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12-10-2008, 02:17 PM   #1
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Move from K100D to K2000?

I've been a very happy owner of a K100D for the past year and a half. I've shot around 20,000 pictures, mostly of small bands playing shows in poorly lit clubs. I was thinking of getting a K200D when they came out but decided against it. While I liked some of the features, the lack of live preview and top ISO rating of 1600 made me decide against it. The K20D sounds awful nice, but is sadly outside the price I can spend for an upgrade right now.

I didn't take much interest in the K2000 early on, but as I've read more about it, I keep thinking that it might make a good replacement for my K100D. Besides the basic stuff like a wider ISO range and higher pixel count, features like the full info back panel LCD (the top panel on the K100D is useless in the dark) and improved low-light autofocus really capture my attention. The smaller size doesn't hurt, either, as it means more room to stuff lenses in my bag.

I'd of course be happier if the K2000 had live preview and "red dot" focus confirmation. And I can't quite seem to figure out for sure if it has an orientation sensor. That feature alone might be worth the upgrade.

Anyone have any advice for me?

12-10-2008, 02:28 PM   #2
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The ISO range is irrelevant... Shooting at ISO 3200 is the same as shooting at ISO 1600 & overexposing by 1 EV in postprocessing.
12-10-2008, 02:43 PM   #3
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Couple of things (I own a K10D and the new K-m):

1) no orientation sensor

2) low-light focus is better on the K-m than the K10, but not enough to buy a camera for. In fact, the lack of a focus dot almost negates this for me, as it may focus more quickly on something I don't intend to focus on

3) I would say that unless you need a high pixel count for cropping/large printing, it's not that big of a deal.

4) it's a great little camera, but you might be better off spending the money on glass now and buying a more significant upgrade for the K100D when it comes out (I don't mean specifically an upgrade for the K100D, but something that CLEARLY has more of the improvements you want)

5) then again, it's shiny and new, and those things are always fun to have!

Todd

Last edited by gnaztee; 12-10-2008 at 02:44 PM. Reason: added
12-10-2008, 03:51 PM   #4
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QuoteOriginally posted by denisv Quote
The ISO range is irrelevant... Shooting at ISO 3200 is the same as shooting at ISO 1600 & overexposing by 1 EV in postprocessing.
It's not irrelevant because it influences what shows up on the LCD screen. When I'm shooting in the dark I want to know that detail has been captured and I've got the shot. I can't know that if I can't see what's lurking in the shadows. There might not be any difference in the camera data (I correct exposure in Aperture anyway), but there is a practical difference in how I shoot.

12-10-2008, 04:08 PM   #5
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QuoteOriginally posted by gnaztee Quote
Couple of things (I own a K10D and the new K-m):

3) I would say that unless you need a high pixel count for cropping/large printing, it's not that big of a deal.

4) it's a great little camera, but you might be better off spending the money on glass now and buying a more significant upgrade for the K100D when it comes out (I don't mean specifically an upgrade for the K100D, but something that CLEARLY has more of the improvements you want)

5) then again, it's shiny and new, and those things are always fun to have!

Todd
The high pixel count is always a good thing. If you have a K10D, do you shoot at 4MP because you know your framing is perfect and you will never need to crop?

About buying better glass... The K100D does not have the HSM contact on the mount, therefore all fo the new lenses coming out will be manual focus for us. The K2000 seems like a perfect fit you you! and maybe me.... Good luck!
12-10-2008, 04:26 PM   #6
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For the price of a K2000, you can get a K200D or even a K20D (body only) at Amazon.
If you have a K100D I assume you have lenses, so why not going for the K20D?

Just my 2 cents...
12-10-2008, 04:27 PM   #7
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QuoteOriginally posted by ghost Quote
The high pixel count is always a good thing. If
I'll just disagree here as high pixel count in a CCD generally increases noise. The CMOS in the K20D handles noise better, and you get the increased resolution. However, that's a different beast than the K100D or K2000.

Personally, I'd stay with the K100D, or at least keep it until you're certain the noise on the K2000 is equal to the K100D, especially since you're shooting in clubs.
12-10-2008, 05:41 PM   #8
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QuoteOriginally posted by rfortson Quote
I'll just disagree here as high pixel count in a CCD generally increases noise. The CMOS in the K20D handles noise better, and you get the increased resolution. However, that's a different beast than the K100D or K2000.

Personally, I'd stay with the K100D, or at least keep it until you're certain the noise on the K2000 is equal to the K100D, especially since you're shooting in clubs.
I usually agree with this, so I just went over to dpreview and found this and ISO 3200 looks pretty good compared to mine, so I think the higher noise is a non issue.

12-10-2008, 05:43 PM   #9
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Uh, yeah...

QuoteOriginally posted by ghost Quote
The high pixel count is always a good thing. If you have a K10D, do you shoot at 4MP because you know your framing is perfect and you will never need to crop?
I will defer to and agree with Russ on his response to this.

QuoteOriginally posted by ghost Quote
About buying better glass... The K100D does not have the HSM contact on the mount, therefore all fo the new lenses coming out will be manual focus for us. The K2000 seems like a perfect fit you you! and maybe me.... Good luck!
I didn't say NEW glass, I said BETTER. DA or FA Ltds would fit this description, as would upcoming DA Ltds, which will still have screwdrive. So I will again point to my original statements.

Todd
12-10-2008, 06:25 PM   #10
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QuoteOriginally posted by gnaztee Quote
I will defer to and agree with Russ on his response to this.



I didn't say NEW glass, I said BETTER. DA or FA Ltds would fit this description, as would upcoming DA Ltds, which will still have screwdrive. So I will again point to my original statements.

Todd
I did not know that about the new DA Ltds. That is good news.
12-11-2008, 02:23 AM   #11
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If the K-m had come out before the K20D, I probably would have bought one. I think it would be almost perfect for a dedicated M42 camera, which is how I would use it 99% of the time.
12-11-2008, 07:17 AM   #12
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I upgraded from the K100D Super to the K2000 mainly for the higher pixel count -
I like the ability to crop. It's at least as good as the K100DS with regards to
noise, even though it has greater pixel density.

If you have the K100D and not Super, and you ever want to use SDM, you should
upgrade. If you don't plan to use SDM and you don't ever crop, you can stick with
the K100D until the next generation comes out and gets cheaper.

(Note on price - I got mine + kit for $385 from a prodigital2000 auction - so it's
affordable if you're willing to do that.)

I love mine. The thing wears a limited or Tak and hangs around my neck, and I
don't even know it's there half the time.

Plus, you can use the cheesy-but-very-fun in-camera digital filters to take shots
like this:










.
12-11-2008, 08:17 AM   #13
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It will not be a great upgrade for you if IQ is not vastly improved and exposure accuracy is better.


QuoteOriginally posted by jro Quote
I've been a very happy owner of a K100D for the past year and a half. I've shot around 20,000 pictures, mostly of small bands playing shows in poorly lit clubs. I was thinking of getting a K200D when they came out but decided against it. While I liked some of the features, the lack of live preview and top ISO rating of 1600 made me decide against it. The K20D sounds awful nice, but is sadly outside the price I can spend for an upgrade right now.

I didn't take much interest in the K2000 early on, but as I've read more about it, I keep thinking that it might make a good replacement for my K100D. Besides the basic stuff like a wider ISO range and higher pixel count, features like the full info back panel LCD (the top panel on the K100D is useless in the dark) and improved low-light autofocus really capture my attention. The smaller size doesn't hurt, either, as it means more room to stuff lenses in my bag.

I'd of course be happier if the K2000 had live preview and "red dot" focus confirmation. And I can't quite seem to figure out for sure if it has an orientation sensor. That feature alone might be worth the upgrade.

Anyone have any advice for me?
12-11-2008, 09:02 AM   #14
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With IQ differences between DSLRs down to the level of minutia, how many years would one have to wait for "vastly improved" IQ? This is a bit silly.
12-11-2008, 09:36 AM   #15
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I just purchased the K-m to replace my K100d, which my wife demanded I give to her. My K100 had smoe condensation on the viewfinder which made it harder for me to see, and she has no problem with that. Here are my views.

I really love this little camera. It fits in my hand far better than the K100 does, and frankly I am surprised, because it is so small. The viewfinder is about the same as the K100 but the numeric display seems a bit easier to read to me.

The control layout is far better than the K100. Direct buttos for the most common camera settings make it far more user friendly. I thought I'd miss the top LCD more, but I don't, not one bit. You also get program shift and Sv mode, which I am already beginning to love.

The menu system is much better and far more extensive, although I don't know if I'll use the RAW development feature or digital filters much.

Focussing is vastly improved on the K-m, I was amazed at it. There is no focus confirmation light but I tend to use the center focus point and have the beep on so that tells me when I'm in focus.

We've had pretty poor weather lately so I haven't shot much with it, but my initial impressions are that IQ is a bit better than K100. Keep in mind that the differences in IQ for any of these cameras is quite small, you won't see earth shattering changes in IQ with any upgrade at this point.

Noise is higher at the pixel level and generally lower if you look at the overall image. I shoot raw so YMMV. Check here for analysis. My own testing seems to confirm this.

On the negative side, it doesn't seem to like the lower powered nimh batteries like eneloops (2100mah) so you may need some higher capacity ones. Battery life is vastly improved though.

Another little niggle is that when you shoot in PEF format the number of shots remaining is displayed incorrectly. The camera assumes the files are uncompressed (about 15mb) so it gives you a smaller number, when in fact the PEF files are approx. 9 mb, losslessly compressed, so you will get about 50% more PEF's per card.

What's the deal with the power on light. It glows like some wierd green robot eye. I know you can turn it off but still....

The auto ISO is limited to 100-800 and is not programable, which is a bit of a shame.

The lack of an orientation sensor is no big deal as the K100 doesn't have one either.

Having said how much I like this little camera, I also agree with the above posters that say you are always better spending money on glass as opposed to bodies.
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