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01-09-2009, 09:25 AM   #16
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QuoteOriginally posted by losecontrol Quote

I like k20d very much but what real arguments could i use for my friends that are in the same situation like i was? (I want them to buy pentax so pentax brand can benefit and hopefully grow bigger and stronger over the years )
it will benefit us all.
Seamius, I think you were just called "old". Speaking as someone who is on the threshold of being old, it's not so bad.

losecontrol,

Arguments for your friends....

- Some of the best quality lenses ever made were and are Pentax
- Ability to use just about every lens ever produced for Pentax bodies
- Shake reduction in the body versus having to spend extra on EACH lens to get it, which means EVERY lens, even those really old ones, will have SR
- Very easy controls
- Price
- Weather sealing
- To some, image quality is better, though this is subjective of course

This is a short list. There are other reasons.

As far as their complaint about the K20D underexposing, as was said, that's just a factory setting that you can change if you like. All camera's come from the factory preset like the manufacturer wants. Pentax by default slightly underexposes. This is not a bad thing necessarily. It's better to underexpose slightly than overexpose slightly. But as was said, it's just a simple setting you can adjust....all DSLR's have it.

01-09-2009, 09:35 AM   #17
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Buy the camera YOU want. The other cameras mentioned are decent also but if you want to buy a Pentax buy it. It costs less, has much better ergonomics in my opinion and so on. The other posts have covered it. Its YOUR camera and YOU are the guy that is going to be using it for the next few years, not your friends.
01-09-2009, 09:36 AM   #18
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QuoteOriginally posted by losecontrol Quote
oh my gosh! You spoke about that you are young?? you speak like an 80years old
camera professor haha
Thank you so much for the help....im still stunned
Well...I will then go down to the store around the corner and buy one...

wait a minute....

I need some help....

Anyone could tell me where I could find one of these?

Maybe can the camera-researcher sir Séamuis the answer?

CheersRegardsandwhateveritscalled

Emil G
I can assure you, I'm no camera professor. and what I have in technical history knowledge I likely lack in photography knowledge. that's why I am here and always eager to learn from those that are actually older than me.

QuoteQuote:
Maybe can the camera-researcher sir Séamuis the answer?
no Sir required but where were you when Gary had his end of the Year honors list open?

https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/latest-board-news/44168-pentax-forums-fir...ours-list.html
01-09-2009, 09:40 AM   #19
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QuoteOriginally posted by navcom Quote
Seamius, I think you were just called "old". Speaking as someone who is on the threshold of being old, it's not so bad.
Ill take it. it will come in useful to be considered 'old'.

01-09-2009, 09:52 AM   #20
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How about buy a K20, take some pics, and then show them and the camera to your friends.

Plus if you're a tight group, you can trade lenses and everybody can benefit from having the same body.

Of course, if your friends aren't nearby or they're in 'Second Life' or something, that might not work.
01-09-2009, 05:36 PM   #21
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If the Pentax gear makes you happy, probably far better to ditch your friends. You're likely not married yet so you don't need to worry about divorce. Yet.

Buy the glass, not the body.
01-09-2009, 06:39 PM   #22
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QuoteOriginally posted by roentarre Quote
It is really about picking a system and stick with it. After another 2 years, none of these cameras will be good enough for any starters...
I beg to differ. I'm shooting a 3 year old DSLR and doubt I'll see any reason to upgrade for quite a few years to come. Honestly, you can do massive prints and get decent ISO performance from just about any half decent DSLR these days -- what the heck are people looking for?
01-09-2009, 06:45 PM   #23
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QuoteOriginally posted by Damn Brit Quote
It's true of the K10D as well but the grip really balances the camera.
The underexposure is easy to adjust for, it's a known quantity so therefore doesn't have to be a negative.
If you want faster AF then Pentax may not do it but fast AF does not always produce accurate AF. Some would say that AF is not real photography.
If you and your friends are really that enthusiastic about photography you are going to be using manual focus and that's where Pentax has the upper hand, all the old lenses you can play with to create your art.
I lump AF into the same general area as auto exposure, or even built in metering. If you don't know what it's doing and can't control it, it's limiting your potential and probably making your photos worse. But if you understand it, know the manual process (manual focus, manual metering...), and can control it to your desire then it just becomes another good tool.

For instance, I can stand there and fiddle with a stand-alone light meter and probably end up changing the camera to what a decent in-body meter would've come up with anyway. Or, I can set it in manual mode and fiddle with aperture and shutter until the meter says it's right, rather than doing Av or Tv mode to begin with. Neither adds any value since I already know how to do it, and just gets in the way of what really matters: the image. The same goes for autofocus. If I can get the camera to do exactly what I was intending to do except much faster (and more accurately) then why would I be hardheaded and do it manually, wasting time that I could use focusing (hah) on the actual content and framing?

01-10-2009, 01:31 AM   #24
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QuoteOriginally posted by pingflood Quote
I beg to differ. I'm shooting a 3 year old DSLR and doubt I'll see any reason to upgrade for quite a few years to come. Honestly, you can do massive prints and get decent ISO performance from just about any half decent DSLR these days -- what the heck are people looking for?
Sorry. I was being sarcastic there...
01-10-2009, 02:02 AM   #25
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QuoteOriginally posted by losecontrol Quote
But the problem is not me (i will at least buy one k20d anyway) but my friends!
I disagree. Your position is that there must be one and only one possible "best" camera for everyone. I would no more allow someone to tell me which camera is best for me than tell me who to marry.

You seem to know what you want. Fair enough. But give your friends the same respect.
01-10-2009, 04:16 AM   #26
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QuoteOriginally posted by pingflood Quote
....... If I can get the camera to do exactly what I was intending to do except much faster (and more accurately) then why would I be hardheaded and do it manually, wasting time that I could use focusing (hah) on the actual content and framing?

But that time isn't wasted IMO. While manually focusing, I am also making last moment checks of the composition.
01-10-2009, 08:18 AM   #27
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QuoteOriginally posted by séamuis Quote
Not counting the lenses that Asahi Kogaku Goshi Kausha produced for the Japanese military during WWII, it would have to be an Asahi-Kogaku Takumar (M37) for the Asahiflex camera by Asahi Opt. Co., Ltd. the Asahiflex I, was introduced in 1952 followed by the Ia in 1953. so I can only assume the oldest lens would be from 1952. Asahi Opt. got its start in 1919 I believe making eye glasses. if I had to take a guess I would say it would be the Asahi-Kogaku Takumar 50mm 3.5 (a Tessar-Type (4 elements/ 3 groups) but I could certainly be wrong.

.


Unless things have changed I think it is unlikely you can use the original Asahiflex lenses. They had a proprietry narrower mount than the M42 mount developed for the Zeiss Contax S in (I think) about 1949. I don't know of any commercially made adaptors. You should, however, be able to use Zeiss or Pentacon/Praktica M42 lenses. I suspect the earliest Asahi lens you will be able to use will be from the original Asahi Pentax of 1957. The alternative might be to adapt a K-mount body cap to use as a mount for Asahiflex lenses.

I also believe (though Nikon fans keep quiet about it) that Asahi Optical made some of the first lenses used by Nippon Kōgaku Kōgyō Kabushikigaisha on their early cameras.
01-10-2009, 10:51 AM   #28
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QuoteOriginally posted by losecontrol Quote
Well you are so right.
Listen! I never even use the AF so I love pentax for the old lens collection as you said.
My friends are a little bit more of computer-photographers and mind a lot of the electronic.
Maybe it's just better to let them go, becasue pentax is for photo-entusiasts...not hobbie gear collectors

The balans is amazing even with the batterygrip on.

Do you have any idea of what pentax lens is the most old of all, and from what year it is?
I really want one becasue This one on a k20d could mix the best from two worlds, and to have pictures with a classic look from a 14,6mp camera....mmmmm I already see my huge photos hanging there on the wall
It would be one of the m37 lenses, probably the 50mm f3.5 "Asahi Kogaku Takumar" lenses that came with the Asahiflex 1 back in 1952 manual diaphragm and chrome. If they made lenses before that it was probably not anything you could easilly mount on a DSLR. But you should be able to find a m37 to m42 adapter, or have a fine mechanic work shop make one, and then put that one in a m42-to-K-adapter. Don't know anyone who have done this, but I've seen some of these lenses.
01-10-2009, 10:57 AM   #29
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QuoteOriginally posted by Douglas_of_Sweden Quote
It would be one of the m37 lenses, probably the 50mm f3.5 "Asahi Kogaku Takumar" lenses that came with the Asahiflex 1 back in 1952 manual diaphragm and chrome. If they made lenses before that it was probably not anything you could easilly mount on a DSLR. But you should be able to find a m37 to m42 adapter, or have a fine mechanic work shop make one, and then put that one in a m42-to-K-adapter. Don't know anyone who have done this, but I've seen some of these lenses.
Ah, didn't see that Séamuis already replied to that, but I'm happy I came with the right answer since I trust Séamuis knowledge on this much more than my own.

I know I've seen m39 to m42 adapters. Not sure about m37. Might have been made commercially looong ago when some more people cared.
01-10-2009, 11:00 AM   #30
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I have an old book that suggests that there was originally an adaptor for M37 > M42, allowing the use of Asahiflex lenses on the Pentax bodies.
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