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03-18-2009, 09:02 PM   #61
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And Canon wouldn't be my first choice for landscapes. What's your point?

03-18-2009, 09:30 PM   #62
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QuoteOriginally posted by Clicker Quote
Make sure you've fully utilized/explored your current system's features, if that's been exhausted then add if possible another system...if not an option then a switch is inevitable. You lose a lot in dollar terms when switching format or system, the dealers usually take you to the cleaners.
I'd been shooting with Pentax for 7 years, got pretty much pro service, it was a difficult decision to leave. However, I'd used the best of the Canon bodies and several of the latest series of the Nikon bodies and was getting photographs I simply could not get with the Pentax. I stuck with the Pentax for another 6 months trying everything but the camera simply would not do what I required it to.

I shoot a lot of sports and am heavily relient on the AF system, a thorn in Pentax's side for a long time. I had to be very careful where I positioned myself otherwise the camera simply was not fast enough to get the shots. Since changing to the D300 I can position myself everywhere because I know it will do what I want it to. Heck I've even started doing more weddings now because I have more confidence in my gear (I detest weddings and their associated pressures as a general rule).

I agree 100%, to change brands is VERY expensive. I had about $4500 worth of Pentax equipment. When changing to Nikon nothing is interchangable, not even memory. I was fortunate that over July-September last year I was pretty quiet and so could really hunt out the best prices. Admittedly I bought higer quality lenses than I had for Pentax, but still it cost me $6000. That's quite a sting.

Am I happy with my new gear; most definitely. Do I wish I could have stayed with Pentax; most definitely. Would I change back to Pentax if they offered a comparative body in the future; no. Why not? Because I simply could not afford to change brands again.


If you're interested in looking at what I've been doing since I've started shooting Nikon, here are some samples (links only, I know some of you won't care).


001
002 003 004 005
006 007 008 009 010
011 012 013 014 015


P.S. No, I don't think I would have been able to get these shots with Pentax, and that's coming from a Pentax lover that tried for a very long time.
03-18-2009, 09:41 PM   #63
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Sure, although I've seen similar fast-action images taken with a Pentax come out rather well too.
03-18-2009, 09:46 PM   #64
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QuoteOriginally posted by adamkean Quote
the only reason for me to switch is if i wanted to shoot professionally as in sports, photojournalism, and paparazzi style.

3fps, not great iso performance, and shortage of fast long glass are the weaknesses of pentax.

the expense of canon and nikon systems is easily covered when you consider you can get shots impossible with a pentax camera. for serious sports you need a 400/2.8 no matter what the cost. (snip)

I started out in photography years ago as a photojournalist (public affairs) for the Army, shooting both news and sports with a manual 35mm film camera, no motor drive, a 52mm lens, and a slow 70-175mm zoom lens. Much later on, I worked in public affairs for Coast Guard (shooting everyday fluff to nighttime drug boardings with infrared), using a 2-fps film camera and a slow 28-200mm lens. In both instances, I was satisfied with the results from that equipment, with none of that equipment as advanced as either my K10D or K20D. Given that, I know professional-quality news and sports photography can be accomplished without a high frame-rate camera or huge telephoto lens. If I were shooting news or sports today, I'd more likely chose a moderately-priced zoom (like the Tamron 18-250mm), over a fixed focal-length lens, to provide greater flexibility on-the-fly and cheaper replacement (news and sports are tough businesses), with frame-rate not even an issue.

stewart

03-18-2009, 09:53 PM   #65
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QuoteOriginally posted by Ash Quote
Sure, although I've seen similar fast-action images taken with a Pentax come out rather well too.
And I too have taken them, however the consistancy with which my new equipment captures these is far higher.

I am not one that is out to put Pentax down, far from, however as a 'tool for the job' argument the Nikon is better for me.
03-18-2009, 10:15 PM   #66
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Agree on that one.
I too have test driven the D700 and D3X - very refined pieces of equipment with slick AF even in really low light. And you'll pay for it, too...

Horses for courses...
03-18-2009, 11:03 PM   #67
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QuoteOriginally posted by Ash Quote
Agree on that one.
I too have test driven the D700 and D3X - very refined pieces of equipment with slick AF even in really low light. And you'll pay for it, too...
True words. I was losing money because I was missing shots, the gear payed for itself quicker than I could imagine.
03-18-2009, 11:39 PM   #68
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QuoteOriginally posted by Wheatfield Quote
since the lens is what makes the picture
I don't necessarily agree with this. I'm sure a great photo has been taken with a less than average lens and visa versa. Some lenses are sharper than others, some cameras more technologically advanced than others. But they dont take photos, nor does the camera.. you do.

But if you are going to go Nikon, i'd listen to what some people have said in this thread and go the D300 over the D90.

I'm happy with my K200D, but not always pleased with the DA 18-250 attached to it.

In any case, its up to you. Swapping brands is legal and harms no one.. the only thing you WILL have afterwards is LESS cash, and hopefully a respect for Pentax.

(edit- OK.. less cash if you are not using it to earn money!)

03-19-2009, 01:36 AM   #69
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thinking really hard here...

Knowing how well built pentax's hardware is really makes me lean towards them, regardless. When I have gobs of money to throw out... whenever that happens, or if I get lucky, I'll try other brands... and attempt not to jump to conclusions.

I will throw a little money at some lenses for my K20D and see how things go. I hope for something even cooler than the K20D that might just blow us away sometime in the near future. Until then, I'll love the K20D. The build quality of the camera is what makes me lean towards keeping pentax as my default. I bashed the CRAP out of my k100D.. (things that would make true anal retentive product caring people throw up) NOTHING has ever gone wrong with it, and it still looks good too. Seeing that the K20D has seals all over the place and all, makes it even better.

Now I'm still at a battle of what I want for my next lenses.

I would love a fisheye for landscapes, or would the 14mm prime be a better choice?
I want to go telephoto for sports and other outdoor photography but I'm unsure, should I go with a prime lens instead of a universal zoom? I'm entirely stumped right there. What's a good suggestion of 3rd party primes/zooms?

I would like to find someone in salt lake with other camera body's/makes to go on a shoot with for true comparison. Although, I'm unsure of it that would be affective as I am so use to the function of pentax DSLR's. Doing almost every function and menu without looking is awesome.

ftpaddict: Offtopic (possible flamebait; I hope it doesn't come to that): DOS on an Intel iMac - or any other Macintosh, would be more useful to me than OS X.
Now, Now All my life I've been a PC repair man and macintosh lover... they're equally capable. OS/x does a hell of a lot more than any windows distribution out of the box. Os/x almost makes me bored as I never have anything to fix.. or disable.

I suppose I needed at little something to lean me more towards sticking with what I've got and to make the best... of the best.

And I agree with all the comments on canon, I hate canon's ergonomics also. Period.
03-19-2009, 04:27 AM   #70
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[QUOTE=fractal;529177]I don't necessarily agree with this. I'm sure a great photo has been taken with a less than average lens and visa versa. Some lenses are sharper than others, some cameras more technologically advanced than others. But they dont take photos, nor does the camera.. you do.

Of course it is possible to take good pictures with "poor" lenses. The question is how good is the photographer at covering for the deficiencies of a lens. I had a kit lens that was a really bad lens, poor contrast, very prone to flare. I still used it for a long time and got decent pics from it (sometimes). I was able to use it in ways that hid its flaws. Still, a good lens will make any camera look better -- the opposite is not true.
03-19-2009, 05:19 AM   #71
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QuoteOriginally posted by steve500 Quote
I want to go telephoto for sports and other outdoor photography but I'm unsure, should I go with a prime lens instead of a universal zoom? I'm entirely stumped right there. What's a good suggestion of 3rd party primes/zooms?
As usual a lot depends on the situations you'll be finding yourself in. For outdoor sports you'll want a fast lens with at least medium reach (200mm-300mm) depending on the size of the field you are shooting. Right now I think the best lens for this is the Sigma 70-200 f/2.8 EX HSM. What could be a better option next month (I'm not holding my breath) is the Pentax 60-250 f/4 DA*. It will give you a little bit more reach and is weather sealed although a stop slower. Why I say it only might be better is that the Sigma is a pretty fast focusing lens while we have no idea how the DA* will perform.

For wildlife you'll need to add TC's to either of those lenses to really get close to a good focal length. For anything longer there are choices (Bigma, DA*300 +TC, a couple of new sigmas that go to 400mm-500mm). On the used market you can find some 400mm primes that are decent.

If you do some searches here or on dpreview for "wildlife" or "birds" you'll find a ton of info and suggestions.

Hope that helps
John
03-19-2009, 06:29 AM   #72
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QuoteOriginally posted by blwnhr Quote
I'd been shooting with Pentax for 7 years, got pretty much pro service, it was a difficult decision to leave. However, I'd used the best of the Canon bodies and several of the latest series of the Nikon bodies and was getting photographs I simply could not get with the Pentax. I stuck with the Pentax for another 6 months trying everything but the camera simply would not do what I required it to.

I shoot a lot of sports and am heavily relient on the AF system, a thorn in Pentax's side for a long time. I had to be very careful where I positioned myself otherwise the camera simply was not fast enough to get the shots. Since changing to the D300 I can position myself everywhere because I know it will do what I want it to. Heck I've even started doing more weddings now because I have more confidence in my gear (I detest weddings and their associated pressures as a general rule).

I agree 100%, to change brands is VERY expensive. I had about $4500 worth of Pentax equipment. When changing to Nikon nothing is interchangable, not even memory. I was fortunate that over July-September last year I was pretty quiet and so could really hunt out the best prices. Admittedly I bought higer quality lenses than I had for Pentax, but still it cost me $6000. That's quite a sting.

Am I happy with my new gear; most definitely. Do I wish I could have stayed with Pentax; most definitely. Would I change back to Pentax if they offered a comparative body in the future; no. Why not? Because I simply could not afford to change brands again.


If you're interested in looking at what I've been doing since I've started shooting Nikon, here are some samples (links only, I know some of you won't care).


001
002 003 004 005
006 007 008 009 010
011 012 013 014 015


P.S. No, I don't think I would have been able to get these shots with Pentax, and that's coming from a Pentax lover that tried for a very long time.
thanks for sharing your perspective. for me, and probably 99% of us here, a pentax k20d and current pentax lenses are enough, but, if my income was highly dependent on low light, high shutter speed, high iso, etc photos for a magizine, website, etc, i would be in the canon or nikon camp.



areas i think pentax can improve for the better for the majority of us - better flash system, and cleaner 1600/3200 iso. 3 fps is enough for me, 1/4000 shutter is more than enough, well, perhaps i could use 1/6000 outside in sunlight for action shots @ f 2.8 where i want dof
03-19-2009, 07:03 AM   #73
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Blwnhr i too found out rather quickly about Pentax's "focusing/metering" performance when it comes to sports that's why i added the Nikon 700 to my collection with the kit zoom for now. I'm not a working pro so i can slowly add lenses as needed but i still prefer my Pentax for travel and portraits, i don't know why but i seem to favour the "look" of the photos that Pentax glass produces out of the box without any software manipulation. It's just more of a personal preference coming from Canon optics, if i were a working pro i wouldn't be so callous in my brand selection ...as others have mentioned there is a reason why Nikon and Canon are usually the top picks for working pros.
03-19-2009, 08:43 AM   #74
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QuoteOriginally posted by steve500 Quote
I want to go telephoto for sports and other outdoor photography but I'm unsure, should I go with a prime lens instead of a universal zoom? I'm entirely stumped right there. What's a good suggestion of 3rd party primes/zooms?
For indoor sports, or where you can get close to the sidelines, the DA*50-135 seems to be the perfect match for the K20D. Yes the 70-200 gives a little more reach, but that 70-200 became the defacto sports lens on 35mm film. 50-135 is the same FOV, plus you can do some nice cropping if necessary, and when the action comes to you, you'll have a little wider view to keep it all in. Finally, the DA* lenses are weathersealed, so you can keep shooting when the weather turns bad.

I've read that the new 70-200 offerings are very nice and may rival the 50-135 for IQ (I've never used them). However, I don't think they are weathersealed.

Others have mentioned that the 50-135 is slow on AF. I haven't really seen that and have captured indoor rodeo with mine, which is hardly slow. However, if you have to move focus from really close to infinity (or back), it can be slow then. However, once you're in the general area (like in the middle of the field where all the action starts), you should be fine. I've never had a problem tracking with mine.

If you want longer, try the DA*200, but of course you lose the flexibililty of the zoom. Still, it's a nice action lens as well.
03-19-2009, 09:23 AM   #75
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FWIW, I had the opportunity to play with a Nikon D300 for quite a while the other day. My wife's cousin got one as a gift and had no clue what to do with it (despite having used a Nikon film SLR for many years, and also having shot a lot with a decent P&S). I offered to help her figure it out, so she brought it over (along with the manual and her film SLR for comparison).

We didn't really get to the point of looking at images taken except on her (nice) LCD, so I can't comment on the IQ. But I have to say, I was rather surprised at how much I *didn't* like the ergonomics of this body. I mean, I expected things to be different than what I am accustomed to, but there were a number of things that I would think would really bother people.

For instance, no mode dial. Changing exposure mode is a button press plus rear dial. Not a big deal to me since I use M pretty much exclusively, but still, quite surprising given how pretty much universal the mode dial is. And there were very few options in that mode menu - M, P Av, and Tv. I suspect there were option buried to enable variants - like a way to enable Auto ISO with M mode to simulate the Kx0's TAv mode, but it was hardly as straightforward as with pentax. Also, no "Green Button" to quickly set an appropriate shutter speed in M mode, nor did P mode seem to give a "hyperprogram" facility (unless that needed to be enabled by some sort of option).

Apparently unlike some Nikon DSLR's (?!), there *are* options to control typical JPEG processing parameters - sharpness, contrast, etc - but I couldn't find them. Not on the camera, not in the manual - I had to go thrugh the dpreview review to find them. Really well hidden.

Overall, looking through the menus, camera behavior just doesn't seem as customizable as even the K200D, much less the K20D.

I liked that there were dedicated ISO and WB buttons, as well as other controls, but overall, the body it felt *too* littered with buttons - I would imagine it would take quite a while to get accustomed to finding these buttons by feel.

The liveview implementation was about as counter-intuitive as I could possibly imagine designing such a system. I never quite got to the point of understanding it, actually (and reading more about since she left, I understand that others find it confusing as well). Not that this is one of the K20D's strong points either, of course. Still, for soe reaosn i expected this to be better.

Anyhow, I'm sure the camera has really strong points as well, and some of my confusion comes form being brainwashed into the Pentax way of settings things up. But I swear I didn't have nearly as much difficulty figuring out the DS (my first DSLR), and I'm quite sure I'd never really find the D300 controls as intuitve as those of any of the Pentax DSLR's I've handled.
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