taking level horizontal shots

sealonsf · 03-31-2009, 04:26 PM

I haven't had my K2000 very long but I'm noticing that I often have photos that are not level horizontally - I haven't ever noticed this to be a problem with other cameras I have.

I do not have photoshop or Lightroom or any software (that I know of) that can fix the problem.

Do you think I'm just not able to hold the camera properly (even though I always managed to in the past?) or could there be something wrong with my camera? It's annoying, especially because I don't know how I can fix the images.

This is an example of what I'm talking about:

Gooshin · 03-31-2009, 04:48 PM

1. unless you are trained to shoot with both eyes open, there will always be a perspective change when you have one eye closed, this is just how it works

2. when you take a picture, the motion of your hand when pressing the shutter rotates it about an axle, slightly affecting your leveling

also, if you look at the shot, you were using a rather wide angle lens, shooting left of your center line, geometry naturally stats that lines begin to covnerge, so it will look skewed either way.

SOldBear · 03-31-2009, 04:48 PM

I don't think there is a problem with the horizontal lines in the photo.

The edge of the platform looks slanted because of the perspective. The plane of the sensor is not in parallel with the flatform. It's just physics.

Look at the dark column running vertically in the center of the photo. I downloaded the photo and verified that the column is 90 degrees, or very close to that. In other words, the column is in parallel with the sides of the photo as it should be.

If you "fix" the photo so that the edge of the platform is in parallel with the top and bottom of the photo, the vertical lines in the photo will be slanted.

jk333 · 03-31-2009, 05:11 PM

Tell me what you think.

Sold bear is right. But that doesn't mean you won't like it better the way your are describing.

I generally prefer it better with the horizontals straight.

Attached Images

jk333 · 03-31-2009, 05:12 PM

PS, get photoshop somehow. Its completely worth it.

dosdan · 03-31-2009, 05:46 PM

Pentax Photo Lab, the software that comes with your camera, can be used to correct rotation problems. The easiest way when you click on the Rotate button, is to then click on the Baseline button. In this mode, you then draw a straight line between two points i.e. two widely separated points on the titled "horizon" and then click on the Apply tickbox to apply the correction.

You can also use PPL to correct perspective distortion i.e. when you shoot the front of a skyscraper from ground-level, the parallel sides will appear to tilt inwards. However, I use the freeware GIMP for this. See:

https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/post-processing-printing-software/29978-g...-cropping.html

https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/post-processing-printing-software/29983-g...-rotation.html

Dan.

**Michaelina2** · 03-31-2009, 06:59 PM

Originally posted by jk333

I generally prefer it better with the horizontals straight.

I prefer the verticals to be plumb...

A little off...? It's easy to adjust verticals in Picasa 3.0.

Cheers...

OregonJim · 03-31-2009, 07:18 PM

Originally posted by sealonsf

I do not have photoshop or Lightroom or any software (that I know of) that can fix the problem.

You don't need any software - just tilt your monitor.

Seriously though, this particular instance is a problem with perspective (as others have already said), but you can correct it easily for free with the GIMP.

Robert S Donovan · 03-31-2009, 07:19 PM

I agree that the posted photo is not the best example. However, I too often end up with shots that are not quite perfectly level. It's something I have learned to live with and fix later.

sealonsf · 04-01-2009, 07:36 AM

Thanks, everyone. Great advice - this photo example was not the best, I've had the same problem with my prime lens - but now I know how I can fix it without photoshop. This is great. Thanks again!

Maynerd · 04-01-2009, 07:58 AM

Another option would be to get the Pentax LL-80 AF Divided Matte Focusing Screen. You can see it here:

PENTAX LL-80 AF Divided Matte Focusing Screen - Official PENTAX Imaging Web Site

I put one in both my K10 (now in my new K20) and in my wife's K100D Super. It's great for getting your composition right in camera as opposed to doing it in PP.

Just my two cents.

emalvick · 04-01-2009, 08:28 AM

I'm amazed at how often I end up with images that are slightly rotated. For me, it has been more than in the past, but software these days allows for easy correction. I shoot raw, so Silkypix and Rawtherapee both have decent distortion, perspective, and rotation correction functions that work well.

Perspective I think is the biggest issue I have to the point I think it screws with my eyes while taking the shot in the first place.

alohadave · 04-01-2009, 09:05 AM

Originally posted by sealonsf

Thanks, everyone. Great advice - this photo example was not the best, I've had the same problem with my prime lens - but now I know how I can fix it without photoshop. This is great. Thanks again!

You can get a bubble level that slides into your hot shoe to make your camera level. They range from $2-15 online.

aleonx3 · 04-01-2009, 09:26 AM

There is nothing wrong with the original picture. The vertical lines are vertical. If you line up the horizontal lines, the vertical lines will not be vertical.

This is a common "problem" (perhaps not a problem) if you do a center-point focus lock and adjust the camera for composition. The "problem" is more serious if you take a picture of a person, center-focus on the face and then adjust camera down to include the feet/shoe - the person will look like a dwarf (small feet).

alohadave · 04-01-2009, 05:33 PM

Originally posted by aleonx3

There is nothing wrong with the original picture. The vertical lines are vertical. If you line up the horizontal lines, the vertical lines will not be vertical.

This is a common "problem" (perhaps not a problem) if you do a center-point focus lock and adjust the camera for composition. The "problem" is more serious if you take a picture of a person, center-focus on the face and then adjust camera down to include the feet/shoe - the person will look like a dwarf (small feet).

That has nothing to do with the focus point. It's convergence caused by shooting your subject at an angle.

03-31-2009, 04:26 PM	#1
sealonsf Veteran Member Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: San Francisco Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 2,729	taking level horizontal shots I haven't had my K2000 very long but I'm noticing that I often have photos that are not level horizontally - I haven't ever noticed this to be a problem with other cameras I have. I do not have photoshop or Lightroom or any software (that I know of) that can fix the problem. Do you think I'm just not able to hold the camera properly (even though I always managed to in the past?) or could there be something wrong with my camera? It's annoying, especially because I don't know how I can fix the images. This is an example of what I'm talking about:

03-31-2009, 06:59 PM	#7
Michaelina2 Site Supporter Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: SE Michigan USA Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,300	Hmmmmmm...?? Originally posted by jk333 I generally prefer it better with the horizontals straight. I prefer the verticals to be plumb... A little off...? It's easy to adjust verticals in Picasa 3.0. Cheers...

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03-31-2009, 04:48 PM	#2
Gooshin Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Toronto, the one in Canada. Posts: 5,610	1. unless you are trained to shoot with both eyes open, there will always be a perspective change when you have one eye closed, this is just how it works 2. when you take a picture, the motion of your hand when pressing the shutter rotates it about an axle, slightly affecting your leveling also, if you look at the shot, you were using a rather wide angle lens, shooting left of your center line, geometry naturally stats that lines begin to covnerge, so it will look skewed either way.

03-31-2009, 04:48 PM	#3
SOldBear Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Alameda, CA Posts: 3,206	I don't think there is a problem with the horizontal lines in the photo. The edge of the platform looks slanted because of the perspective. The plane of the sensor is not in parallel with the flatform. It's just physics. Look at the dark column running vertically in the center of the photo. I downloaded the photo and verified that the column is 90 degrees, or very close to that. In other words, the column is in parallel with the sides of the photo as it should be. If you "fix" the photo so that the edge of the platform is in parallel with the top and bottom of the photo, the vertical lines in the photo will be slanted.

03-31-2009, 05:11 PM	#4
jk333 Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: bev Posts: 181	Tell me what you think. Sold bear is right. But that doesn't mean you won't like it better the way your are describing. I generally prefer it better with the horizontals straight. Attached Images

03-31-2009, 05:12 PM	#5
jk333 Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: bev Posts: 181	PS, get photoshop somehow. Its completely worth it.

03-31-2009, 05:46 PM	#6
dosdan Pentaxian Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Brisbane, Australia Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 1,741	Pentax Photo Lab, the software that comes with your camera, can be used to correct rotation problems. The easiest way when you click on the Rotate button, is to then click on the Baseline button. In this mode, you then draw a straight line between two points i.e. two widely separated points on the titled "horizon" and then click on the Apply tickbox to apply the correction. You can also use PPL to correct perspective distortion i.e. when you shoot the front of a skyscraper from ground-level, the parallel sides will appear to tilt inwards. However, I use the freeware GIMP for this. See: https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/post-processing-printing-software/29978-g...-cropping.html https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/post-processing-printing-software/29983-g...-rotation.html Dan.

03-31-2009, 07:18 PM	#8
OregonJim Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Willamette Valley, Oregon Posts: 1,327	Originally posted by sealonsf I do not have photoshop or Lightroom or any software (that I know of) that can fix the problem. You don't need any software - just tilt your monitor. Seriously though, this particular instance is a problem with perspective (as others have already said), but you can correct it easily for free with the GIMP.

03-31-2009, 07:19 PM	#9
Robert S Donovan Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Anderson, SC Photos: Gallery Posts: 361	I agree that the posted photo is not the best example. However, I too often end up with shots that are not quite perfectly level. It's something I have learned to live with and fix later.

04-01-2009, 07:36 AM	#10
sealonsf Veteran Member Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: San Francisco Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 2,729 Original Poster	Thanks, everyone. Great advice - this photo example was not the best, I've had the same problem with my prime lens - but now I know how I can fix it without photoshop. This is great. Thanks again!

04-01-2009, 07:58 AM	#11
Maynerd Inactive Account Join Date: Sep 2008 Location: Pickering, Ontario, Canada Photos: Gallery Posts: 100	Another option would be to get the Pentax LL-80 AF Divided Matte Focusing Screen. You can see it here: PENTAX LL-80 AF Divided Matte Focusing Screen - Official PENTAX Imaging Web Site I put one in both my K10 (now in my new K20) and in my wife's K100D Super. It's great for getting your composition right in camera as opposed to doing it in PP. Just my two cents.

04-01-2009, 08:28 AM	#12
emalvick Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Davis, CA Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,642	I'm amazed at how often I end up with images that are slightly rotated. For me, it has been more than in the past, but software these days allows for easy correction. I shoot raw, so Silkypix and Rawtherapee both have decent distortion, perspective, and rotation correction functions that work well. Perspective I think is the biggest issue I have to the point I think it screws with my eyes while taking the shot in the first place.

04-01-2009, 09:05 AM	#13
alohadave Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Quincy, MA Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 2,024	Originally posted by sealonsf Thanks, everyone. Great advice - this photo example was not the best, I've had the same problem with my prime lens - but now I know how I can fix it without photoshop. This is great. Thanks again! You can get a bubble level that slides into your hot shoe to make your camera level. They range from $2-15 online.

04-01-2009, 09:26 AM	#14
aleonx3 Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Brampton, Ontario Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 3,996	There is nothing wrong with the original picture. The vertical lines are vertical. If you line up the horizontal lines, the vertical lines will not be vertical. This is a common "problem" (perhaps not a problem) if you do a center-point focus lock and adjust the camera for composition. The "problem" is more serious if you take a picture of a person, center-focus on the face and then adjust camera down to include the feet/shoe - the person will look like a dwarf (small feet).

04-01-2009, 05:33 PM	#15
alohadave Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Quincy, MA Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 2,024	Originally posted by aleonx3 There is nothing wrong with the original picture. The vertical lines are vertical. If you line up the horizontal lines, the vertical lines will not be vertical. This is a common "problem" (perhaps not a problem) if you do a center-point focus lock and adjust the camera for composition. The "problem" is more serious if you take a picture of a person, center-focus on the face and then adjust camera down to include the feet/shoe - the person will look like a dwarf (small feet). That has nothing to do with the focus point. It's convergence caused by shooting your subject at an angle.