new to digital; 2 questions

tibbitts · 04-22-2007, 01:22 PM

I am considering buying a K100d for an upcoming trip the first week of may.

I owned a spotmatic F and numerous smc fixed-focal-length lenses for years during the 70s and early 80s and was happy with them mostly; traded them in the 80s for the 2 canon A-1 bodies and (mostly) zoom lenses that I've used up to now. Mostly happy with them too, except for the infamous shutter squeak (and now one of the shutter buttons is sticking.)

I have several questions after reading hundreds of posts here on this (very helpful) forum:

1. Many posts mention dead or hot pixels and complain that the camera cannot map around them. Does the camera come with software to fix this in the images, or is this aftermarket software? I wasn't planning on getting any extra software (I use gimp on my flatbed-scanned transparencies; have never dealt with the bad pixel issue.)

2. What format do people who use raw ("pentax raw" , I assume) archive images in after downloading? Does the camera come with software to do the necessary conversion? It seems that keeping images in pentax raw (or any proprietary raw) would be a bad idea, since there is no assurance of software being around to deal with it many years from now. While formats like pdf or postscript (maybe now dng?) or whatever may also go away in time, there seems to be some assurance of being able to deal with them due strictly to popularlity.

Thanks.

Paul

Buddha Jones · 04-22-2007, 01:27 PM

Hey Paul, the dead pixel thing isnt really an issue, only if you have it because it is a rareity in itself. As for your other question DNG is a popular RAW format, me I still shoot in JPEG for now, but that is just me.

Welcome to the site.

anomaly · 04-22-2007, 01:42 PM

Ever found a speck on one of you scans? That is much worst than a dead pixel, dont worry about it.

Jonas B · 04-22-2007, 01:56 PM

Hi Paul, and welcome here

Dead pixels: If you shoot raw most raw converters take care of any "dead" pixels. I don't know if the supplied Pentax software does this. For JPG, I have no idea.

About not getting any additional software... I don't know if that is realistic. A good raw converter is a necessity. There is nothing wrong with the results from the included Pentax software (to my understanding) but I have read numerous complaints about the interface and speed.

^^Not a complete ansver, I'm sorry^^

I take pictures in raw format exclusively. I use the Adobe DNG converter as a part of my workflow (moving pictures from the memory card and into the archive and the DAM software) and save all pictures DNG.

Lately we see more cameras supporting DNG (Leica, Hasselblad, Pentax, Ricoh and maybe some more) and also more raw converters supporting DNG. I see no real problem in archiving PEF files. Now foreseeing the future is not my strong side but my guess is that the raw software that supports PEF files today will do so for a long time. Still, DNG may be more future proof, and above all smaller.

hth, at least somewhat,

Originally posted by tibbitts

-snip-
1. Many posts mention dead or hot pixels and complain that the camera cannot map around them. Does the camera come with software to fix this in the images, or is this aftermarket software? I wasn't planning on getting any extra software (I use gimp on my flatbed-scanned transparencies; have never dealt with the bad pixel issue.)

2. What format do people who use raw ("pentax raw" , I assume) archive images in after downloading? Does the camera come with software to do the necessary conversion? It seems that keeping images in pentax raw (or any proprietary raw) would be a bad idea, since there is no assurance of software being around to deal with it many years from now. While formats like pdf or postscript (maybe now dng?) or whatever may also go away in time, there seems to be some assurance of being able to deal with them due strictly to popularlity.

Thanks.

Paul

volosong · 04-22-2007, 03:34 PM

Jonas' answer is pretty good. Read it!

On the dead pixels, not really an issue. RAW conversion software will get rid of them. I use Adobe Photoshop and/or Elements. Both of them use "Adobe Camera Raw" plug-in, which is freely available from Adobe.

Adobe also supplies a freely available RAW to DGN converter. If you are concerned about archiving PEF files, just convert them in batch mode to DNG. Nobody knows for sure, but DNG will most likely be around for quite awhile.

The Pentax software is fine, but it would be worthwhile investing in Photoshop Elements. Available for less than $100 U.S. and contains most of what a photographer needs. You can get by without the full blown Photoshop program.

Personally, I archived both the PEF files and the converted DNG files and a browse version in JPEG format. converted in batch mode.

davemdsn · 04-22-2007, 04:10 PM

As has already been said several times, hot pixels are not a problem. Almost all cameras have them, almost all conversion software fix them automatically so you never see them.

As for what software. Adobe has a new program called Photoshop Lightroom. I highly recommend it when shooting RAW. It will convert your PEF files to DNG on import to the computer. It manages your entire workflow unless you do a lot of pixel editing. It is a VERY good RAW converter. You can download the trial program to use for 30 days to see if you like it. Until April 30 it sells for $199, afterwards it will be $299.

raz · 04-22-2007, 07:18 PM

How does the raw conversion get rid of the dead pixels ? I think a dead pixel in an sensor is coming out red in the image, no ?

So the conversion software just fills that red pixel with black color or its neighbor color ?

regken · 04-22-2007, 07:18 PM

Originally posted by tibbitts

1. Many posts mention dead or hot pixels and complain that the camera cannot map around them. Does the camera come with software to fix this in the images, or is this aftermarket software? I wasn't planning on getting any extra software (I use gimp on my flatbed-scanned transparencies; have never dealt with the bad pixel issue.)

2. What format do people who use raw ("pentax raw" , I assume) archive images in after downloading? Does the camera come with software to do the necessary conversion? It seems that keeping images in pentax raw (or any proprietary raw) would be a bad idea, since there is no assurance of software being around to deal with it many years from now. While formats like pdf or postscript (maybe now dng?) or whatever may also go away in time, there seems to be some assurance of being able to deal with them due strictly to popularlity.

Thanks.

Paul

UFRAW and Raw Tharapee both compliment Gimp as a DNG converter and are much better than the Pentax software. For a quick browser try FastStone. These are all free and while not as fast as lightroom or bibble they are very good.

DNG IMO is the best option right now.

Regards,

Cideway · 04-22-2007, 08:41 PM

Originally posted by raz

How does the raw conversion get rid of the dead pixels ? I think a dead pixel in an sensor is coming out red in the image, no ?

So the conversion software just fills that red pixel with black color or its neighbor color ?

It is part of the de-mosaic algorithm it just makes up what the pixel should be, and it does it fairly well, so well in fact that most people aren't aware that their cameras have dead/hot pixels.

04-22-2007, 01:22 PM	#1
tibbitts Pentaxian Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Oklahoma USA Posts: 2,196	new to digital; 2 questions I am considering buying a K100d for an upcoming trip the first week of may. I owned a spotmatic F and numerous smc fixed-focal-length lenses for years during the 70s and early 80s and was happy with them mostly; traded them in the 80s for the 2 canon A-1 bodies and (mostly) zoom lenses that I've used up to now. Mostly happy with them too, except for the infamous shutter squeak (and now one of the shutter buttons is sticking.) I have several questions after reading hundreds of posts here on this (very helpful) forum: 1. Many posts mention dead or hot pixels and complain that the camera cannot map around them. Does the camera come with software to fix this in the images, or is this aftermarket software? I wasn't planning on getting any extra software (I use gimp on my flatbed-scanned transparencies; have never dealt with the bad pixel issue.) 2. What format do people who use raw ("pentax raw" , I assume) archive images in after downloading? Does the camera come with software to do the necessary conversion? It seems that keeping images in pentax raw (or any proprietary raw) would be a bad idea, since there is no assurance of software being around to deal with it many years from now. While formats like pdf or postscript (maybe now dng?) or whatever may also go away in time, there seems to be some assurance of being able to deal with them due strictly to popularlity. Thanks. Paul

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04-22-2007, 01:27 PM	#2
Buddha Jones Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Charlotte, NC Photos: Gallery Posts: 2,587	Hey Paul, the dead pixel thing isnt really an issue, only if you have it because it is a rareity in itself. As for your other question DNG is a popular RAW format, me I still shoot in JPEG for now, but that is just me. Welcome to the site.

04-22-2007, 01:42 PM	#3
anomaly Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Barbados Photos: Gallery Posts: 264	Ever found a speck on one of you scans? That is much worst than a dead pixel, dont worry about it.

04-22-2007, 01:56 PM	#4
Jonas B Inactive Account Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Göteborg, Sweden Posts: 810	Hi Paul, and welcome here Dead pixels: If you shoot raw most raw converters take care of any "dead" pixels. I don't know if the supplied Pentax software does this. For JPG, I have no idea. About not getting any additional software... I don't know if that is realistic. A good raw converter is a necessity. There is nothing wrong with the results from the included Pentax software (to my understanding) but I have read numerous complaints about the interface and speed. ^^Not a complete ansver, I'm sorry^^ I take pictures in raw format exclusively. I use the Adobe DNG converter as a part of my workflow (moving pictures from the memory card and into the archive and the DAM software) and save all pictures DNG. Lately we see more cameras supporting DNG (Leica, Hasselblad, Pentax, Ricoh and maybe some more) and also more raw converters supporting DNG. I see no real problem in archiving PEF files. Now foreseeing the future is not my strong side but my guess is that the raw software that supports PEF files today will do so for a long time. Still, DNG may be more future proof, and above all smaller. hth, at least somewhat, Originally posted by tibbitts -snip- 1. Many posts mention dead or hot pixels and complain that the camera cannot map around them. Does the camera come with software to fix this in the images, or is this aftermarket software? I wasn't planning on getting any extra software (I use gimp on my flatbed-scanned transparencies; have never dealt with the bad pixel issue.) 2. What format do people who use raw ("pentax raw" , I assume) archive images in after downloading? Does the camera come with software to do the necessary conversion? It seems that keeping images in pentax raw (or any proprietary raw) would be a bad idea, since there is no assurance of software being around to deal with it many years from now. While formats like pdf or postscript (maybe now dng?) or whatever may also go away in time, there seems to be some assurance of being able to deal with them due strictly to popularlity. Thanks. Paul

04-22-2007, 03:34 PM	#5
volosong Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: North Idaho Photos: Gallery Posts: 696	Jonas' answer is pretty good. Read it! On the dead pixels, not really an issue. RAW conversion software will get rid of them. I use Adobe Photoshop and/or Elements. Both of them use "Adobe Camera Raw" plug-in, which is freely available from Adobe. Adobe also supplies a freely available RAW to DGN converter. If you are concerned about archiving PEF files, just convert them in batch mode to DNG. Nobody knows for sure, but DNG will most likely be around for quite awhile. The Pentax software is fine, but it would be worthwhile investing in Photoshop Elements. Available for less than $100 U.S. and contains most of what a photographer needs. You can get by without the full blown Photoshop program. Personally, I archived both the PEF files and the converted DNG files and a browse version in JPEG format. converted in batch mode.

04-22-2007, 04:10 PM	#6
davemdsn Inactive Account Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Boise, Idaho Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 1,413	As has already been said several times, hot pixels are not a problem. Almost all cameras have them, almost all conversion software fix them automatically so you never see them. As for what software. Adobe has a new program called Photoshop Lightroom. I highly recommend it when shooting RAW. It will convert your PEF files to DNG on import to the computer. It manages your entire workflow unless you do a lot of pixel editing. It is a VERY good RAW converter. You can download the trial program to use for 30 days to see if you like it. Until April 30 it sells for $199, afterwards it will be $299.

04-22-2007, 07:18 PM	#7
raz Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Timisoara, Romania Posts: 248	How does the raw conversion get rid of the dead pixels ? I think a dead pixel in an sensor is coming out red in the image, no ? So the conversion software just fills that red pixel with black color or its neighbor color ?

04-22-2007, 07:18 PM	#8
regken Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Bangor, Maine Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,377	Originally posted by tibbitts 1. Many posts mention dead or hot pixels and complain that the camera cannot map around them. Does the camera come with software to fix this in the images, or is this aftermarket software? I wasn't planning on getting any extra software (I use gimp on my flatbed-scanned transparencies; have never dealt with the bad pixel issue.) 2. What format do people who use raw ("pentax raw" , I assume) archive images in after downloading? Does the camera come with software to do the necessary conversion? It seems that keeping images in pentax raw (or any proprietary raw) would be a bad idea, since there is no assurance of software being around to deal with it many years from now. While formats like pdf or postscript (maybe now dng?) or whatever may also go away in time, there seems to be some assurance of being able to deal with them due strictly to popularlity. Thanks. Paul UFRAW and Raw Tharapee both compliment Gimp as a DNG converter and are much better than the Pentax software. For a quick browser try FastStone. These are all free and while not as fast as lightroom or bibble they are very good. DNG IMO is the best option right now. Regards,

04-22-2007, 08:41 PM	#9
Cideway Inactive Account Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Adelaide, South Australia, Australia Photos: Gallery Posts: 364	Originally posted by raz How does the raw conversion get rid of the dead pixels ? I think a dead pixel in an sensor is coming out red in the image, no ? So the conversion software just fills that red pixel with black color or its neighbor color ? It is part of the de-mosaic algorithm it just makes up what the pixel should be, and it does it fairly well, so well in fact that most people aren't aware that their cameras have dead/hot pixels.