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05-27-2009, 06:43 PM   #16
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QuoteOriginally posted by vitalsax Quote
12 months and get it for less
Haha, no kidding, it's not 12 months anymore... I bought my K20d in July-ish for $1250 just the body ... by december it was easy to buy at $700.

Then I broke it, voided the warranty, paid $250 to get it fixed. Just got it back today. I still love the camera. haha. I'll wait it out, I take pictures with it, I don't do video, although I would love Mirror-up and 1/8000 shutter speed like my Konica Minolta Semi-SLR did... Good lord I could take some awesome high speed water shots with that thing with EASE of whatever the light situation was. Flash also fired regardless of the shutter speed.

05-27-2009, 08:08 PM   #17
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Just for my Yashica 21mm f3.3, yes...
05-27-2009, 09:19 PM   #18
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QuoteOriginally posted by Duck Dodgers Quote
Huh? I thought the K-7's guide number was 13 (versus 11 on the K10D). I get 18.2 percent more powerful, with my calculations.
Not a great improvement, really - and not a light source to rely on for the most flattering results anyway.
In any case, the K20D's flash has a GN of 13 as well.
05-27-2009, 09:53 PM   #19
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QuoteOriginally posted by Duck Dodgers Quote
Huh? I thought the K-7's guide number was 13 (versus 11 on the K10D). I get 18.2 percent more powerful, with my calculations.
Think two-dimensionally. Flash power is proportional to the square of the guide numbers. Or to put it the other way around: to double the distance, you need quadruple the power. So, to go from 11 to 13, you need 40% more. (13²/11²=139.67%)


QuoteOriginally posted by Ash Quote
Not a great improvement, really - and not a light source to rely on for the most flattering results anyway.
More power is good. I'll be interested to test if it's better at firing a wireless P-TTL slave around corners, in the sun, or at a distance. Additionally, I made a homebrew foil bounce card for the K10D's built-in flash, and it works okay but there's really not enough power to do ceiling bounces. So a little bit more sounds okay to me.

But you're right, it's not the top improvement on the list.

QuoteQuote:
In any case, the K20D's flash has a GN of 13 as well.
Yeah, I think the K-7 is less compelling if you've got a K20D. If I did, I'd probably wait for next year's K-8 or whatever.

05-28-2009, 03:44 AM   #20
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It also depends on the price of the competition.

In the US, where the D300 is $1,550 ish, $1,299 is a great price.

elsewhere in the world where the price difference between the two is less of a difference (or the price difference is inverted), the K20D is less convincing as a value proposition.

Of course, that's more relevant if you have no glass investment
05-28-2009, 05:03 AM   #21
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QuoteOriginally posted by mattdm Quote
Yeah, I think the K-7 is less compelling if you've got a K20D. If I did, I'd probably wait for next year's K-8 or whatever.
Not in my case. One of the things I noted going to the k20D was the slower auto focus and metering ability compared to my (now gone) D90 in less than stellar lighting.

I am eagerly awaiting some hands on reviews that will confirm (with measurements) the improved speed in that category.

While I won't be an early adopter at the $1299 price, if the price drops below $1000 I will be getting one.

Since I no longer have a backup body to my K20D I am finding myself overly nerve wracked at missing important shots if the K20D were to go belly up.
05-28-2009, 05:04 AM   #22
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Not in the UK.

I paid about £600 for my K10D when it first came out. They replaced the 10 with the 20 and now the 7 so you would be forgiven for thinking it would be in a similar price bracket... but it's nowhere near. Body only RRP in the UK is £1199. Even blaming the weak pound, that's not a good price.

As much as I want one, I'll be waiting at least 6 months for the price to get realistic.
05-28-2009, 07:02 AM   #23
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Of course there are no absolute answers, but it is useful to hear all the opinions about the benefits. The big question for a K10d owner like me who wants two bodies really is whether to 1) Buy a K20d at $660 or a K2000 at $460 and wait a year for the K7 to settle out in terms of bugs and price or 2) sit tight for a few months and spring for the K-7 on release.

Like so many others here, the killer feature would be better low-light AF. This was a big disappointment in the K20d that kept it from being worth the upgrade when it was priced at $1,200. We won't know that until we get full tests of final models. I'd probably pass on the cheaper models and spring for the K-7 if the AF issues were significantly improved.

05-28-2009, 07:32 AM   #24
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To me, yes.

To other people, no.

Just like how some people will find the D3X/1Ds III worth it, and others not.
05-28-2009, 08:02 AM   #25
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QuoteOriginally posted by fast50 Quote
Not in the UK.

I paid about £600 for my K10D when it first came out. They replaced the 10 with the 20 and now the 7 so you would be forgiven for thinking it would be in a similar price bracket... but it's nowhere near. Body only RRP in the UK is £1199. Even blaming the weak pound, that's not a good price.

As much as I want one, I'll be waiting at least 6 months for the price to get realistic.
Gentlemen, keep in mind that current prices for the K-7 are list-prices (SRP, MSRP, RRP, etc.). When they hit the shops, the initial street price will certainly be less.

For example, when the DA15mm was announced, the MSRP was USD649, the USA mail-order shops are already selling them around USD569
05-28-2009, 12:46 PM   #26
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Honestly, the price isn't that bad, considering. I think I paid something close to that for an LX back in 1980's dollars.

The only thing that gives me pause is how dirt cheap the other bodies are.
05-28-2009, 03:07 PM   #27
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QuoteOriginally posted by Reportage Quote
Because it will be up against a couple of other brands models including Olympus E3.

Was really hoping for an articulating lcd. maybe reserved for the k30d.

and perhaps..multiple memory card options maybe 1x CF and 1x SDHC or even 2x SDHC and 2x CF. Nifty.
Many have problems with the E3s LCD.
05-29-2009, 06:12 AM   #28
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I'll use some of your list as well:

QuoteOriginally posted by mattdm Quote
Here are the things that I'm excited for in upgrading from my K10D:
  • improved AF (already fast on my DA 40mm Limited, can't wait to see how it is on the K-7)
  • per-lens AF tuning
  • higher ISO ranges (and hopefully cleaner ISO 1600)
  • smaller and lighter
[/LIST]
For me, the above already brings a lot to the table.
05-29-2009, 06:57 AM   #29
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It is for me, as soon as I can afford it.

I loved my K110D for a year, honestly I did. I'm quickly falling in love with my K20D. I just shot my first wedding, and have two more lined up. I'm hoping to line up many more this year and next. I don't honestly think I realized how big the step from the K110D to the K20D was until I swapped back and forth all day at the wedding. Now I'd really like to get a second K20D body to replace it on back up duty, but I'm certainly willing to wait to be able to afford the K-7.

The wedding I first shot had a reception at a latin dance club, I REALLY wish I could have handed my camera to the friend that was assisting me and let them record the first dance while I second shot stills, but not so much I'd buy a video camera for that rare occasion.
05-29-2009, 08:53 AM   #30
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it certainly is for me, though I will of course be waiting for the price to go down. the street price will be less than 1299 for sure, so as soon as the big stores such as adorama and calumet, among others get them in you will be able to get it a bit cheaper. I originally bought the K-m because of its small size and lightweight, but seeing as the K-7 is nearly as small, and lightweight (with a metal body) I will FOR SURE be buying a K-7. I will finally be selling, my K110D as well as my still young K-m (and maybe even a few film bodies) to help fund the purchase. (just bought a new lenovo notebook, so Im a little strapped for cash) I think I might make the K-7 and the MX my two main bodies. of course both will wear Takumars. =)
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