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07-11-2009, 08:41 AM   #1
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Show me a K-7 picture better than K20D's

Holly molly, C'mon folks, ISO 1600 performance, AF speed, strap lugs, movie, other electronic mambo-jambo etc.

I wouldn't mind K-7 have the properties and easiness same as Spotmatic-F with a lousy AF, well, now I've changed my mind, MF is ok too.

I haven't seen a better picture from K-7 (with an much improved sensor!) better than K20D's yet, including these:

Digital Cameras, Pentax K-7 Digital Camera Test Image

Digital Cameras, Pentax K20D Digital Camera Test Image


Which one from above two pictures seems better to you?

Can anyone show me a better IQ comparison of K-7? (ISO 100 or same ISO and same lens please).

In photographic sense is there more bread in K-7 or not?

Bests.
Can.

07-11-2009, 09:06 AM   #2
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I currently own both. Here's my opinion.

In good conditions there is no difference in iq. And I wouldn't necessarily expect one. AWB is far superior with the K7 though.

Under poor conditions I find that the K7 gives more "keepers." The AF is quicker and more accurate and metering more consistent. More important to me, the K7 seems to avoid NR at high iso. While this can give more "noise," I find that it also gives more "detail." My preference is to have the choice about NR and detail is something I'll never get back in PP.

Sorry, no magic bullet here. With APS-C cameras these days we're looking at incremental advances. It isn't like 5 years ago when you were jumping resolutions with every new model.
07-11-2009, 09:16 AM   #3
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QuoteOriginally posted by cbaytan Quote
Holly molly, C'mon folks, ISO 1600 performance, AF speed, strap lugs, movie, other electronic mambo-jambo etc.

I wouldn't mind K-7 have the properties and easiness same as Spotmatic-F with a lousy AF, well, now I've changed my mind, MF is ok too.

I haven't seen a better picture from K-7 (with an much improved sensor!) better than K20D's yet, including these:

Digital Cameras, Pentax K-7 Digital Camera Test Image

Digital Cameras, Pentax K20D Digital Camera Test Image


Which one from above two pictures seems better to you?

Can anyone show me a better IQ comparison of K-7? (ISO 100 or same ISO and same lens please).

In photographic sense is there more bread in K-7 or not?

Bests.
Can.
Who says the K7's sensor is "much improved"? It's basically a small evolutionary step from the K20D's sensor, with some tweaks to allow video. This seems like a rather pointless thread, IMO.
07-11-2009, 09:19 AM   #4
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You wont find one. The K-7 is not about improvement in IQ. I agree with static. It seems like APS-C high-iso has reached a threshold in performance for now. The k20d has fantastic high-iso performance so it would be very difficult to improve on that with the same sensor. The K-7 is about improvements in ALL the other areas that we have been waiting for. I listed some of them important to me in the thread below:

https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/pentax-dslr-discussion/66057-what-i-like-...ared-k20d.html

07-11-2009, 09:42 AM   #5
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QuoteOriginally posted by PentaxPoke Quote
You wont find one. The K-7 is not about improvement in IQ. I agree with static. It seems like APS-C high-iso has reached a threshold in performance for now. The k20d has fantastic high-iso performance so it would be very difficult to improve on that with the same sensor. The K-7 is about improvements in ALL the other areas that we have been waiting for. I listed some of them important to me in the thread below:

https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/pentax-dslr-discussion/66057-what-i-like-...ared-k20d.html
I'm in agreement here. If you have $s to spend, a K20D and a not so great lens collection, spend that money on lenses. If you have a great collection of lenses get the K7. Granted, there is not much in the line of iso improvements but the rest of the new features make it well worth it.
07-11-2009, 10:01 AM   #6
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Cbaytan I don't think those "test" images can or should be compared. In the K-7 images the light source has changed angles plus the K-7 images are overexposed by at least half a stop more like a full stop. The general focus of the K-7 images seems off as well.

Image Resources did a very poor job in maintaining consistency from test to test. There is a year apart to when the test images were taken.
07-11-2009, 10:14 AM   #7
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IQ is vital, but if that was all, in the film world Pentax would only have brought out the KX.

A camera body is more than just a sensor platform.

*I like the size and weight.
*I like the grip.
*I like having the option of video.
*I like the much improved AF.
*I like having the digital filters that the K2000 has.
*I like the layout of the buttons.
*The menu system is much quicker to navigate than the K20D (which I own).
*The metering is much better. I almost never used the "green" option for the metering on my K20D but on the K-7 it works extremely well.
*I like the quieter shutter sound.
*My aging eyes very much like the new display size and brightness
*I like having a functional live-view system.
*I like a pop-up flash that sits higher and does not throw as big a shadow (sometimes none) with lens hoods attached
*I think my images look better. Probably just processing, but they seem to pop a bit more.
*I like the auto-focus assist lamp

All of these might not make the best image of the K-7 any better than the best image of the K20D. But I think it makes my typical K-7 image better than my typical K20D image. Plus as nostatic noted above, I seem to get more "keepers" from the K-7, probably for the reasons noted above, all of which help me get the best out the camera more easily and more consistently.
07-11-2009, 10:53 AM   #8
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I didn't think the K-7's sensor is supposed to be much improved, IQ wise.

07-11-2009, 10:57 AM   #9
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QuoteOriginally posted by cousinsane Quote
I didn't think the K-7's sensor is supposed to be much improved, IQ wise.
I don't think there is a lot of room left for improvement.
07-11-2009, 11:06 AM   #10
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I have a K10 and the K-7 is a fair amount better in the IQ department.

As for the difference between K-7 and K20...it's not all about IQ
- Camera ergonomics are tops
- 100% viewfinder (makes a huge difference for me = no more cropping = saves time)
- AF is waaaaay faster and waaaaay more accurate
- AWB and metering is spot on - all the time for me. Another huge time saver.
- Mirror slap sound is almost non-existant now
- Much improved continuous AF (vital for what I do)
- FPS is perfect now, as is shutter response time to press.
- LCD is fantastic. What an improvement over K10/K20
- Grip accepts AA's
- HDR right in camera, as well as, other cool effects
- DA lens line gets some special treatments
- Video, live view that works properly
- Huge ISO difference between K-7 and K10. I mean...HUGE!

If I was only taking pics of stationary objects under controlled lights...maybe the K-7 wouldn't be an upgrade from the K10/K20, but the list above are all huge improvements and make the upgrade (and even cost at the present time) waaaay worth it to me.

c[_]
07-11-2009, 11:31 AM   #11
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I purchased the K-7 for HD video and built-in HDR mode and so far I am having a ball with it.
YouTube - Pentax K-7 1000mm ( Pentax PF80-ED with PF-CA35 K-mount adapter) orange flower
07-11-2009, 01:51 PM   #12
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Several months ago, as the K7 specs were being water dropped out for us, the K20's price was dropped into the mid $600 range. Weighting the unknown against the known, I opted for the K20. The K7 has a lot of nice features I would like to use, however I have quite a few nice K20 images too, as compared against my K100.

There is more than enough in the K20 to keep me entertained for quite some time. It's a wonderful camera, lots of capability, and well known, with a 3 year warranty. I can concentrate on taking my images, while everyone else figures out the K7. It does not appear that I am too far behind everyone.

I still have my K100, and it works well too. So, I'll be merrily be snapping away, trying to improve my skills - in the never ending quest of taking that single perfect image, while the discourse on improved AF and ISO continues.

I do have to say, the best result from all of this is the drop in the K20's price, allowing me in. This just may be my way of operating in the future. I do have to say, the first 30 days of using the K20 - improved my skills significantly!! I do have to say, 4 years on the K100 did make me understand the basics (and finding workarounds), and to use the capabilities of the camera at hand, to try to do what I wanted. I do think that I am a better photographer because of the K100, but the step up to the K20 has been and continues to be quite wonderful.
07-11-2009, 03:02 PM   #13
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No real difference in image quality... but a big difference under various conditions of getting better or higher results of good photos

WB is fantastic, flash with my 540 has vastly improved AF fantastic

There is a real difference in the feel, sound and results in my view, plus it has many great new features that I am yet to get into

Great camera


Neil
07-11-2009, 03:17 PM   #14
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I think it is silly to talk about this. The question is not "will the camera take amazing photos that the K20 wouldn't," but rather "will this camera allow me to do things that I couldn't with the K20?" I have a K20 and am very satisfied, at the same time, when chasing around my kids, I am sure the auto focus could be a little better, the auto white balance a little better, etc. This will end up with more keepers for me, not necessarily awesome photos that I will post on the forum, but ones that I will treasure as my kids get older....

At the same time, if you shoot in manual focus all of the time and do not want any of the new "features" on the K7, don't upgrade and wait for the K8, or whatever. I'm sure by then the camera will be smart enough not to record bad photos on your SD Card.
07-11-2009, 03:35 PM   #15
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Yeah.... unfortunately the k7 didn't make me a better photographer overnight
The body sure is great to use though. Nice 'n' tight!

In the USA you guys are lucky to have the choice. In Aus a k20d body is still$1250 and a K7 body is $1550. Makes it an easy choice for those coming from < k20d. I do see tough choice to be made though when the k20d is 1/2 the k7 price.

I am lusting after the 21mm LTD and (if i was in the USA) i could have had that and a k20d instead of a k7.......... but then i would always wish the LTDs were mounted on the k7.

I came from a k100d.... it's amazing how similar the cameras feel in the hand. I sometimes forget it's k7 until my fingers miss the buttons they were aiming for and find new and improved buttons.

mike
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