Forgot Password
Pentax Camera Forums Home
 

Reply
Show Printable Version Search this Thread
07-21-2009, 05:00 PM   #91
Veteran Member
Pentaxor's Avatar

Join Date: May 2009
Location: Vancouver, B.C.
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 6,513
QuoteOriginally posted by schmik Quote
Wow... you guys need to get a room. I think you have some unresolved issues.

BTW, Ignore the bunny. The FACT thing is cultural. I work with people like him and they PISS ME OFF ALL THE TIME. I do my best to not let them get to me but the fact that someone employs clueless "know it all idiots" bothers me. I ignore them as much as possible, unfortunately our customers can't.

This is the RANT thread isn't it!?!?!?

mike
for starters, something is wrong with the thread title. it is more like a novice seeking for an attention by posting a thread that would create some commotion and controversy. I wonder where he read or saw that Pentax publicly advertised that the Pentax K-7 runs at around 5.2 fps under AF-C mode. Pentax never made any marketing tricks ads.

what I do recall is me reading the advertised specs of the K-7 having a continuous hi burst speed of 5.2 fps and continuous low of 3.3 fps. that is clear as a daylight and I believe the bunny fella has some problems comprehending the specs in English.

the K-7 can run at around 5.2 fps (hi) as was advertised. it achieves the 5.2 fps burst speed then varies from there, the lowest registers at 3.3 fps on a continuous lo mode. I would had been pissed if the K-7 wasn't able to run at 5.2 fps but since it can run at that speed, I won't bitch about.

then comes the comparison part where the blah blah blah is better and faster and all this and that is 100% in focus and cant even show a single, not even an inch of evidence except for the word "FACT". I'm so fed up with facts that don't have any real sense of measurement. man, it's a FACT that we just wasted our time on a person that dont have anything to show.

07-21-2009, 05:07 PM   #92
Veteran Member
nostatic's Avatar

Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: socal
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 1,576
QuoteOriginally posted by kristoffon Quote
"boo-hoo the neighbors toy's got more buttons than mine"

You can't even write properly nor make any point at all except parroting the same specs over and over. Please convince me you're not a 15 yo troll.
I think part of it is that English is not his first language. So I'll cut him that slack. And maybe post another clown photo because Samsungian loves them

07-21-2009, 05:51 PM   #93
Veteran Member
*isteve's Avatar

Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: London, England
Posts: 1,187
QuoteOriginally posted by Bunny Gear Quote
It's not truth. D300 really can 6 fps.
Canon 50D is in the same league too.

K-7 is the best among Pentax in AF-C, but it's lower level than Nikon/Canon/Olympus.
D300 AF system is close to perfect.
So buy one.
07-21-2009, 06:55 PM   #94
Veteran Member




Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Borås, Sweden
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 3,165
QuoteOriginally posted by *isteve Quote
So buy one.
Not picking on you in particular, but why is it that so often people blurt out "Well go buy a Canikon" rather than agree that some things could be improved, and maybe if enough people make an issue out of it Pentax will listen to them?

07-21-2009, 07:10 PM   #95
Veteran Member




Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Ontario
Posts: 750
QuoteOriginally posted by pingflood Quote
Not picking on you in particular, but why is it that so often people blurt out "Well go buy a Canikon" rather than agree that some things could be improved, and maybe if enough people make an issue out of it Pentax will listen to them?
While I would like a slightly faster fps with the k-7 in AF-C, I've mentioned it in another of the original poster's threads and left it at that. I have since watched the spectacle unfold in this thread. The k-7 is what it is. He either likes it & uses it, or doesn't. Move on. I have no problem with people having issues with a camera including the k-7, but the OP is a bit over the top in this case.

Right now the k-7 is about the same price as a D300 here, so price of the body isn't an excuse. Unless there's several grand invested in pentax glass, getting the performance of a d300 would make more sense for the OP.
07-21-2009, 07:16 PM   #96
Veteran Member
nostatic's Avatar

Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: socal
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 1,576
QuoteOriginally posted by pingflood Quote
Not picking on you in particular, but why is it that so often people blurt out "Well go buy a Canikon" rather than agree that some things could be improved, and maybe if enough people make an issue out of it Pentax will listen to them?
I think it is a question of tone and approach. At some point "constructive criticism" turns into rants that accomplish nothing other than annoying people.

For instance, if the OP posted a thread asking about the AF-C rate and the discussion led to a chorus of people saying that it in-fact is a major flaw that needs to be addressed, then the troops can organize and try to get Pentax to listen. Instead, the title was a hyperbolic accusation, and the OP provided no data to support his comparison beyond insisting "it is fact."

AF has been a complaint here and elsewhere. With the K7, apparently Pentax listened. They also improved the AWB as well as FPS (all things that people complained about). Did they fix everything? Of course not. No manufacturer ever does. Witness people complaining about the Canon 50D saying it has poorer iq compared to the 40D.

Every company has limited resources, especially Pentax. They have to make hard choices about what specs they are going to chase wrt the competition. They also have to find a niche as a smaller market share player. One can wish that AF-C performance was better, but it isn't. So a buyer should pay attention to that going in. What many of the rant threads end up sounding like is one of two things:

the buyer didn't do their homework and bought the wrong tool

the buyer (or troll) only cares about spec sheets and dxo tests and wants to complain

I see some people here who could find something to complain about if Pentax came out with a FF body for $599. Some people want EVERYTHING but they don't want to pay for it. imho it is endemic to our current society and the problem is far deeper than just what dSLR to buy. We want it all yesterday for less than we paid last week. And god forbid that we should actually have to work at something.

There are issues with Pentax gear that is cause for legitimate concern for people. And people need to make informed and rational choices. But at some point it turns into whining that drags the entire community down with it.

My predictions:

Pentax will *never* beat Canikon with mindless AF performance (ie point it and don't bother to think about it)

Pentax will *never* beat Canikon with FPS

Soooo....if those things are important to you then you're much better off buying Canikon and being happy. Because Pentax will NOT deliver. Pony up the bucks and buy something that does what you need.

Another prediction:

Canikon will not make glass equivalent to the Pentax ltd prime glass (especially FA ltd, but also 15/21/40/70).

Canikon will not focus on weathersealing for all (or almost all) of their gear.

Soooo...if those things are important to you then you're much better off buying Pentax and being happy. And realize that:

A) there is no free lunch

B) everything is a compromise.
07-21-2009, 09:23 PM   #97
Veteran Member
GLXLR's Avatar

Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Sugar Land, TX
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 686
QuoteOriginally posted by nostatic Quote
dudeeee that is some freaky sh1t
07-21-2009, 10:17 PM   #98
Pentaxian
Wheatfield's Avatar

Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: The wheatfields of Canada
Posts: 10,042
I kinda skimmed this thread, and I am wondering:
AF-C is not the same as predictive AF, if I understand the technology.
A couple of days ago I decided to check the AF speed of my FA50/1.4 against that of my DA*55/1.4, with the intention of selling the 50 if the 55 was "fast enough" on the K-7.
My testing methodology was far from scientific, I put the camera into single frame advance, and AF-C and sat beside an 80KPH speed limit road near where I live and tried taking pictures of the cars coming towards me.

Now I'm not, never have been and never will be a tailgunner. I take the picture when I think the time is right, I don't mash the button and pray. All my bitching and whining about frame rates was to get a more responsive camera, not because I need high speed as a crutch (though it is nice to have).
Anyway, I found that the K-7 and DA55/1.4 easily kept track of the cars coming towards me at speed, as did the 50/1.4.
The way I shoot, the AF-C was fast enough.
My 50mm lens is now on it's way to foreign lands, where hopefully it will put a smile on the face of another photographer.


Last edited by Wheatfield; 07-21-2009 at 10:38 PM. Reason: Capital I
07-21-2009, 10:34 PM   #99
Moderator
Site Supporter
Blue's Avatar

Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Florida Hill Country
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 17,166
QuoteOriginally posted by Bunny Gear Quote
Are there moderators in this forum?

07-21-2009, 10:41 PM   #100
Veteran Member




Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 923
I get the feeling from using the K-7 AF.C that Pentax has built some predictive AF into its logic.

I was first intrigued by this line in the K-7 manual pg. 119 (which isn't in any other Pentax model).

• When the shutter release button is pressed halfway to focus, the camera automatically tracks the subject if it is determined to be a moving object. The lens will automatically operate and continuously focus on the subject.

Trying it out on a moving object (in my case a toddler), I think the AF is indeed making some prediction as to how far the subject will be in the next shot. I can't find anything else which Pentax actually put out on this subject, so I don't have any data to back it up.

Back to my earlier point that AF.C in the K-7 indeed works, and works better than any previous Pentax model. In a series of 30 shots over about 10 seconds, most (80%) were in good focus.

Well, the fps rate thus drop below 5.2 , but I'm not going to get involved in THAT argument.
07-21-2009, 11:13 PM   #101
Adorama Camera Representative
Helen Oster's Avatar

Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: New York
Posts: 545
Message from Helen at Adorama Camera

QuoteOriginally posted by nostatic Quote

There is no local dealer with the K7. Hence if I want to try it, I have to buy it.
Adorama Camera has an excellent rental department, with a wide range of items. Our rates are competitive and the members of our staff team are knowledgeable and helpful.


The sad thing is, that when the returns system is abused, we all lose........



Sincerely

Helen Oster
Adorama Camera Customer Service Ambassador


helen.oster@adoramacamera.com
Digital cameras, all other cameras and everything photographic from Adorama Camera
07-21-2009, 11:15 PM   #102
Veteran Member
schmik's Avatar

Join Date: May 2008
Location: Sydney Aus
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 527
I just did a test of auto focus point vs centre focus point in AF.C. Seemed to get a higher frame rate in centre point. Test was not very scientific just listened to the fps. Subject was slow moving black dog in poor light. I will have to repeat it in better light with a subject that is not all one color

mike
07-21-2009, 11:21 PM   #103
Adorama Camera Representative
Helen Oster's Avatar

Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: New York
Posts: 545
Message from Helen at Adorama Camera

QuoteOriginally posted by Samsungian Quote
your story has made me reconsider ever buying a camera from them(again). I did buy one once, but the factory box was in terrible shape yet it was all nicely packed in a perfect shipping box. So the damaged camera box had nothing to do with shipping. This always bothered me with them.
There is one probable explanation as to what may have happened; the manufacturers and distributors, who supply to Adorama, and of course, all other retailers , do allow us to return equipment as new, because of over-stocks, exchanges etc. This can be a particular issue after the Christmas holiday when we all need to balance out our inventories.

Even if we at Adorama are completely thorough when packaging up these items for return, there is no doubt that less scrupulous retailers could well be receiving returns, trusting the customer's explanation that they never opened the box - packaging them up for return to the manufacturer or distributor. These items then form part of the inventory for sending out to other retailers.

No retailer can inspect the contents of every package received into the warehouse. If the manufacturer doesn't check the equipment before sending it back out, from the customer's perspective it is the retailer who looks bad, even though it may well have not been their fault.

Any item that is returned to Adorama and has been opened is inspected thoroughly - including the shutter count.
If it is not in MINT condition (eg an unwanted gift return), it will either be returned to the manufacturer or distributor, or be transferred to the store as a demo or floor model, or to our rental department.

At Adorama we do have liberal return policies and there is no doubt that on occasion this is taken advantage of - although this does not exempt us from more closely checking any and all returns, some retailers don't.


QuoteOriginally posted by Samsungian Quote
Now I think I know why though the shutter count was at zero. Are they able to re-set the counters to zero on returned like new dslr cameras?
We certainly don't do so; it is just not worth our reputation - but as above, I wouldn't be able to comment on the policies of another company.

I know I'm repeating myself, but the sad thing is, that when the returns system is abused, we all lose........

NB, special thanks to the Pentaxian who brought this thread to my attention; while I would love to drop in here every day, I have a presence on over 400 websites, blogs, photo sharing sites etc. so it isn't possible.

I will be showing my appreciation!



Sincerely

Helen Oster
Adorama Camera Customer Service Ambassador


helen.oster@adoramacamera.com
Digital cameras, all other cameras and everything photographic from Adorama Camera
07-21-2009, 11:37 PM   #104
Veteran Member
nostatic's Avatar

Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: socal
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 1,576
QuoteOriginally posted by Helen Oster Quote
Adorama Camera has an excellent rental department, with a wide range of items. Our rates are competitive and the members of our staff team are knowledgeable and helpful.


The sad thing is, that when the returns system is abused, we all lose........
I have always found the same, and have purchased a fair amount of gear from Adorama over the years. I am interested in your take on my scenario. I bought the body with all intention of keeping it, but know that the body size/ergos might be an issue. After a few days of very careful use, I find that it was not the K20d replacement that I originally imagined, largely due to the physical design of the case. At that point I sent the body back - in perfect condition with all packing material intact. If there is a restocking fee then I'll have to have a conversation and determine the value proposition. Now being without it I find situations where I would prefer the K7, and now understand how it would fit into my workflow as a second dSLR rather than K20d replacement. At this point it depends on what I think my value proposition is for going with a less-than-ideal ergonomic fit.
'
Body was sent back less than 7 days after receipt in brand new condition. Would you consider this an "abuse" of the return policy?

If so I will take that into consideration, with the upshot being that impulse purchases for me will drop to near zero. Sight unfelt is a dangerous way to buy gear that becomes an intimate part of a creative process. While sometimes you roll the dice, if you know that snakes are likely to come up with no recourse, you're a lot less likely to step up to the table.

-todd
07-21-2009, 11:54 PM   #105
Adorama Camera Representative
Helen Oster's Avatar

Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: New York
Posts: 545
Message from Helen at Adorama Camera

QuoteOriginally posted by nostatic Quote
I have always found the same, and have purchased a fair amount of gear from Adorama over the years. I am interested in your take on my scenario. I bought the body with all intention of keeping it, but know that the body size/ergos might be an issue. After a few days of very careful use, I find that it was not the K20d replacement that I originally imagined, largely due to the physical design of the case. At that point I sent the body back - in perfect condition with all packing material intact. If there is a restocking fee then I'll have to have a conversation and determine the value proposition. Now being without it I find situations where I would prefer the K7, and now understand how it would fit into my workflow as a second dSLR rather than K20d replacement. At this point it depends on what I think my value proposition is for going with a less-than-ideal ergonomic fit.
'
Body was sent back less than 7 days after receipt in brand new condition. Would you consider this an "abuse" of the return policy?

If so I will take that into consideration, with the upshot being that impulse purchases for me will drop to near zero. Sight unfelt is a dangerous way to buy gear that becomes an intimate part of a creative process.
-todd
I was merely responding to your note that

QuoteOriginally posted by nostatic Quote

.........if I want to try it, I have to buy it.
and ensuring that all forum users are aware that Adorama does offer a fantastic rental service, which is just one of the ways that we are able to keep our pricing competitive.

Sincerely

Helen Oster
Adorama Camera Customer Service Ambassador


helen.oster@adoramacamera.com
Digital cameras, all other cameras and everything photographic from Adorama Camera
Reply

Bookmarks
  • Submit Thread to Facebook Facebook
  • Submit Thread to Twitter Twitter
  • Submit Thread to Digg Digg
Tags - Make this thread easier to find by adding keywords to it!
af-c, camera, dslr, fps, k-7, photography, trick
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
PENTAX ... Marketing? Adrian Owerko Photographic Technique 4 08-28-2009 06:10 PM
Marketing For Different Audiences ajtour Photographic Industry and Professionals 1 05-31-2009 07:43 PM
Marketing daacon Post Your Photos! 3 02-07-2009 05:47 PM
Pentax needs marketing help rparmar Photographic Technique 26 03-28-2008 10:28 PM
New Pentax Marketing?! codiac2600 Pentax News and Rumors 49 11-30-2007 08:28 PM



All times are GMT -7. The time now is 08:30 PM. | See also: NikonForums.com, part of our network of photo forums!
  • Red (Default)
  • Green
  • Gray
  • Dark
  • Dark Yellow
  • Dark Blue
  • Old Red
  • Old Green
  • Old Gray
  • Dial-Up Style
Hello! It's great to see you back on the forum! Have you considered joining the community?
register
Creating a FREE ACCOUNT takes under a minute, removes ads, and lets you post! [Dismiss]
Top