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05-14-2007, 04:21 PM   #1
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K10D, manual lenses, and metering

I think I'm not the only one having problems with the K10D and manual lens metering. I've got the cam set-up properly and tried the green button and the DOF switch, to mixed results (lenses are pre-A models).

F5.6 and lower, I have no problems. At F8 onwards, though, my K10D severely underexposes.

I believe the problem is limited to the K10D, and may be a hardware issue, since they would've fixed the problem via firmware updates already if it isn't.

So, aside from guesstimation, are there any other tips or techniques one can use to be able to have a more consistent output from the in-camera metering system? I've heard about changing focus screens. Does this do the trick? If so, what about the Katz Eye screen and the ones from China?

Also, is it correct to assume that any A lenses onwards will not have metering problems anymore, even if it's a manual-focusing lens?

Maybe this thread could serve as basis for other people (newbies like me) looking to use manual lenses and the K10D.


Last edited by vinzer; 05-14-2007 at 04:50 PM. Reason: Additional questions
05-14-2007, 05:01 PM   #2
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Lenses from the A series onward work fine in manual. It's the old M and K lenses that seem to have trouble with the K10D.

If you use these lenses a lot, getting a hand-held light meter is not a bad idea.
05-14-2007, 05:03 PM   #3
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QuoteOriginally posted by vinzer Quote
I think I'm not the only one having problems with the K10D and manual lens metering. I've got the cam set-up properly and tried the green button and the DOF switch, to mixed results (lenses are pre-A models).

F5.6 and lower, I have no problems. At F8 onwards, though, my K10D severely underexposes.

I believe the problem is limited to the K10D, and may be a hardware issue, since they would've fixed the problem via firmware updates already if it isn't.

So, aside from guesstimation, are there any other tips or techniques one can use to be able to have a more consistent output from the in-camera metering system? I've heard about changing focus screens. Does this do the trick? If so, what about the Katz Eye screen and the ones from China?

Also, is it correct to assume that any A lenses onwards will not have metering problems anymore, even if it's a manual-focusing lens?

Maybe this thread could serve as basis for other people (newbies like me) looking to use manual lenses and the K10D.
Actually this is sort of old news. Buy a DS focusing screen and put it in, or manually adjust. Only 2 solutions that I know of..................Katz-eye have not been definitively confirmed to work..
See this link. I personally blame Urano
https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/pentax-dslr-discussion/6724-k10d-ll-60-fo...-m-lenses.html
05-14-2007, 05:36 PM   #4
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It's not a bad idea but it really shouldn't be necessary.

As Jeff says; exchange the K10D viewfinder screen to a D/DS screen and the exposure should be if not fine so at least much better.

05-14-2007, 06:13 PM   #5
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thanks guys. i'm off to buy a DS focus screen, then.

anyone else who could verify Katz Eye and other third party focus screens vis-a-vis the K10D and manual lenses?

blame Urano? possible. hahaha.

i'm curious as to why Pentax changed the focusing screen (composition, design, whatnot) on the K10D when they already had a working one (working in the sense that it's functional with manual lens metering) in the *ist series. hmm...

and as for my desire to use old lenses... well... let's just say that i wanna satisfy my LBA without breaking the bank!
05-14-2007, 06:31 PM   #6
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Are you sure it is underexposing? That is the opposite of the 'normal' K10 exposure problems. Typically it experiences a gradual overexposure as the aperture gets to f/8-f/11 at the worst.
05-14-2007, 06:45 PM   #7
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QuoteOriginally posted by vinzer Quote
thanks guys. i'm off to buy a DS focus screen, then.

anyone else who could verify Katz Eye and other third party focus screens vis-a-vis the K10D and manual lenses?

blame Urano? possible. hahaha.

i'm curious as to why Pentax changed the focusing screen (composition, design, whatnot) on the K10D when they already had a working one (working in the sense that it's functional with manual lens metering) in the *ist series. hmm...

and as for my desire to use old lenses... well... let's just say that i wanna satisfy my LBA without breaking the bank!
K10 screen was designed to be "Brighter". Unfortunately this does not seem to be the best choice for MF lens or possibly MF itself. Using AF and A lenses are fine because it meters "wide open" and then calculates the amount to stop down the lens. since most lenses are f4 or faster there are no problems. When you start "stopping down" below this you get the anomoly.
05-14-2007, 06:53 PM   #8
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I can verify that the Katz Eye screen DOES NOT solve the metering problem, with the K10D.

As I stated in 2 prior threads I can verify that the DS screen DOES solve the metering problem (and, as a side effect, also gives better manual focusing ability than the original K10D screen).


Last edited by ben-pentax; 05-14-2007 at 07:39 PM.
05-14-2007, 11:12 PM   #9
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Yes, it has been covered before, and it will be discovered, questioned about and discussed again...

Here are my exposure values from one of the earlier threads:


That thread is here:
https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/pentax-dslr-discussion/6286-k10d-exposure...on-m-mode.html
(The first post refers to another earlier thread.)

Please note that my and Sean's curves are different. As always; you have to try your equipment and see how it behaves. Only then you know what to do when it's time to take The picture.
05-15-2007, 05:08 AM   #10
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this seems to be a continually occuring issue, and there have been a lot of mixed results posted.

I will repeat what I wrote a long time ago.

I took my K10D and my SMC-M 100mm F4 macro and took a series of shots from F4 to F32. I compared them side by side in Corel PSP XI on the browser page and there is no noticable difference between shots.

All shots were achieved with the pressing of the green button only. By activating Depth of field (on the on off switch) and green button together is not the correct process.
05-15-2007, 05:42 AM   #11
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QuoteOriginally posted by Lowell Goudge Quote
this seems to be a continually occuring issue, and there have been a lot of mixed results posted.

I will repeat what I wrote a long time ago.

I took my K10D and my SMC-M 100mm F4 macro and took a series of shots from F4 to F32. I compared them side by side in Corel PSP XI on the browser page and there is no noticable difference between shots.

All shots were achieved with the pressing of the green button only. By activating Depth of field (on the on off switch) and green button together is not the correct process.
Wouldn't be the first time 2 different copies prduced different results. That aside, and not being familiar w/ PSP (I use Corel Photopaint) are these RAW or jpg? Is there an "auto correct" that is skewing the results? Not denying your finings but just seeing if there is any other explaination. Pentax could have done some mid production tweaks to solve this but the issue is present for some. There really is no denying it.......and actually not having a minor,say 1/2 stop anomoly at the 2 extremes of aperatures is nowhere near my findings w/ my D, and others w/ various other models. My A f1.7 on "manual aperature" (yes really no need for this) slightly overexposes at 1.7. After that it 's business as usual.
05-15-2007, 05:49 AM   #12
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QuoteOriginally posted by jeffkrol Quote
Wouldn't be the first time 2 different copies prduced different results. That aside, and not being familiar w/ PSP (I use Corel Photopaint) are these RAW or jpg? Is there an "auto correct" that is skewing the results? Not denying your finings but just seeing if there is any other explaination. Pentax could have done some mid production tweaks to solve this but the issue is present for some. There really is no denying it.......and actually not having a minor,say 1/2 stop anomoly at the 2 extremes of aperatures is nowhere near my findings w/ my D, and others w/ various other models. My A f1.7 on "manual aperature" (yes really no need for this) slightly overexposes at 1.7. After that it 's business as usual.
Just to clear up the issue, Corel PSPXI does not correctly read PEF files for the moment, so everything is shot in Jpeg which, I find suitable for what I do with the camera, and can print excellent 11x17 prints. Never felt the need for RAW.

Regarding mid production correction, I doubt that for 2 reasons, first it would be a commercial nightmare,, and second, I have had my K10D since before christmas. It is an early camera, and cannot as a result be a unit benefiting from a mid production change.

I have only tested with one ov my manual lenses, but I have many
300 mm F4, 400mm F5.6, 100 mm F4 macro, 50mm F1.4 and F2.0 and 24mm F2.4. I'm not sure I have time to play with all of them the same way as I did with the 100 mmF4. I did that to see if I had a problem.
05-15-2007, 06:03 AM   #13
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Exchange the K10D focusing screen with a *ist DS or *ist D one, then it will make stop down metering better.

As for Katz eye, forget about it to correct metering errors, it just introduces more exposure errors in the end, as the central metering cell will be fooled. Katz eye does have warn the users the change in exposure after installation, too.

For more reads:-

K Mount Metering & Exposure Bases - A Technical Brief

RiceHigh's Pentax Blog: When the Focusing Screen Lies (for Focusing and Metering)

QuoteOriginally posted by vinzer Quote
I think I'm not the only one having problems with the K10D and manual lens metering. I've got the cam set-up properly and tried the green button and the DOF switch, to mixed results (lenses are pre-A models).

F5.6 and lower, I have no problems. At F8 onwards, though, my K10D severely underexposes.

I believe the problem is limited to the K10D, and may be a hardware issue, since they would've fixed the problem via firmware updates already if it isn't.

So, aside from guesstimation, are there any other tips or techniques one can use to be able to have a more consistent output from the in-camera metering system? I've heard about changing focus screens. Does this do the trick? If so, what about the Katz Eye screen and the ones from China?

Also, is it correct to assume that any A lenses onwards will not have metering problems anymore, even if it's a manual-focusing lens?

Maybe this thread could serve as basis for other people (newbies like me) looking to use manual lenses and the K10D.
05-15-2007, 07:04 AM   #14
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QuoteOriginally posted by Lowell Goudge Quote
Just to clear up the issue, Corel PSPXI does not correctly read PEF files for the moment, so everything is shot in Jpeg which, I find suitable for what I do with the camera, and can print excellent 11x17 prints. Never felt the need for RAW.

Regarding mid production correction, I doubt that for 2 reasons, first it would be a commercial nightmare,, and second, I have had my K10D since before christmas. It is an early camera, and cannot as a result be a unit benefiting from a mid production change.

I have only tested with one ov my manual lenses, but I have many
300 mm F4, 400mm F5.6, 100 mm F4 macro, 50mm F1.4 and F2.0 and 24mm F2.4. I'm not sure I have time to play with all of them the same way as I did with the 100 mmF4. I did that to see if I had a problem.
Thanks for the clarifications.. just needed to check. The exposure issues pop up constantly on many different forums and cannot be all relegated to user error. Some very astute users have run into this issue
05-15-2007, 11:58 AM   #15
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I have owned Dslr's since the D1 arrived on the scene. I would all ways carry a hand meter in my film days, espesially if using them in winter B&W shots. However, i have noticed and call me wrong if i am, that if i set the digital on the hand held reading, i'm way over exposed. I find, even in winter, what ever the meter says plus +0.3 ev and i'm fine.

Dave
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