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08-23-2009, 06:45 AM   #16
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If the camera tells you the subject is in focus, flip the camera af switch to M, then take the picture. I use that technique all the time. The focus won't change, unless you change the distance between the camera and the subject.

Could be, also, that you need a more modern, sophisticated flash unit.

08-23-2009, 06:57 AM   #17
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QuoteOriginally posted by Russell-Evans Quote
AF button set to disable AF, and hitting it, would accomplish the same. I find the AF button is much easy to work than the focus selector switch.

Thank you
Russell
Cool trick--I like it!
08-23-2009, 08:28 AM   #18
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How good is your second shooter?

I can imagine the feeling (and the look on your face) after missing the second missed shot....

Sorry man. So how do you have your AF set up? Is it connected to the shutter button?
08-23-2009, 09:17 AM   #19
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QuoteOriginally posted by Russell-Evans Quote
AF button set to disable AF, and hitting it, would accomplish the same. I find the AF button is much easy to work than the focus selector switch.

Thank you
Russell
Good call, I used to use that but since I only have one button, I made it AE-L!

08-23-2009, 09:53 AM   #20
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To those of you using the AF button to - disable AF.

Just who is in control of when the subject is in focus?
Shutter button ==> the camera.
Shutter button -> AF button ==> the camera until the human intervines - but still the camera.
AF Button ==> the human.
manual ==> the human.

Personally I prefer the last two - I am in control - not the camera.

The Elitist - formerly known as PDL
08-23-2009, 09:56 AM   #21
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QuoteOriginally posted by PDL Quote
To those of you using the AF button to - disable AF.

Just who is in control of when the subject is in focus?
Shutter button ==> the camera.
Shutter button -> AF button ==> the camera until the human intervines - but still the camera.
AF Button ==> the human.
manual ==> the human.

Personally I prefer the last two - I am in control - not the camera.

The Elitist - formerly known as PDL
I would definitely make the AF button the only one to do the AF if I either had another button for AE-L or could make the shutter half press do AE-L. Anyone know if the latter is a possibility on the K2000?

The only way to have both functionality is the way I have it set up now. But it is only slightly more work using shutter half-press as AF lock and recomposing.
08-23-2009, 10:15 AM   #22
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I have gone both ways on the AF button on my K20. I started with the AF on the shutter button then went to the AF button to focus for a while. I eventually returned to the shutter button with the AF button to disable AF. For those times when the camera refuses to lock focus, I just hit the AF kill button and focus manually. Better than missing a shot.
08-23-2009, 10:29 AM   #23
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QuoteOriginally posted by Eruditass Quote
I would definitely make the AF button the only one to do the AF if I either had another button for AE-L or could make the shutter half press do AE-L. Anyone know if the latter is a possibility on the K2000?

The only way to have both functionality is the way I have it set up now. But it is only slightly more work using shutter half-press as AF lock and recomposing.
AFAIK, no, it's not possible. I tried to configure it that way, but it didn't work.

The half-press of the shutter button does activate the shake reduction tho so there is a reason to half-press even if you do all your focusing with the AF button.

But if you use the AF button for AF, you can use M mode to lock exposure when you need it. It is not quite as fast as using, say, spot metering in combination with exposure lock and recomposing, but it works for me. I guess I love separate AF more than exposure lock.

08-23-2009, 10:57 AM   #24
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QuoteOriginally posted by Russell-Evans Quote
AF button set to disable AF, and hitting it, would accomplish the same. I find the AF button is much easy to work than the focus selector switch.

Thank you
Russell
This is one of the best tricks available on the Pentax cameras...a bit of a hack, but a neat trick even though.

I was about three lines into Wheatfield's original message when I figured out what the core of the rant was going to be. In my opinion, missed focus/missed shot is the "dirty little secret" of AF photography. I have brought the issue up to various photographers and most have sheepishly admitted to using manual focus when they could not risk missing the shot. This is the case regardless of the brand of camera used.

The matter also came up at the K7 road trip stop here in Portland. The guy behind me asked Mark Dimalanta whether he used AF for his surfing and other sports shots. The answer? Often not. Don't quote me, but I also believe that he said that he uses Russel's trick for fast breaking action (AF-S to lock focus followed by burst exposures).

The comment about having a back-up shooter is also well-taken. I have been at several weddings and receptions where more than one camera/shooter was used for "can't mess up" shots such as the toast.

Again, to Wheatfield...sorry that your shoot did not work out. That kind of thing is both frustrating and embarrassing. You have my complete sympathy.

Steve

(Avoids shooting weddings like the plague...)
08-23-2009, 11:12 AM   #25
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QuoteOriginally posted by stevebrot Quote
(Avoids shooting weddings like the plague...)
After two divorces, I avoid weddings like the plague...
08-23-2009, 11:15 AM   #26
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QuoteOriginally posted by PDL Quote
To those of you using the AF button to - disable AF.

Just who is in control of when the subject is in focus?
Shutter button ==> the camera.
Shutter button -> AF button ==> the camera until the human intervines - but still the camera.
AF Button ==> the human.
manual ==> the human.
You missed AF -> Shutter ==> the human

Once you get used to using it, it is not much different than having AF on the AF button. With the grip on the K10/20D, hitting the AF button is pretty impossible for me. AF on the shutter is the only option. At least the K-7 addressed the missing AF button on the grip.

I really wish the K10D and K20D had the focus switch of the K100 series. I'm always worried about the switch unless I flip the camera over to look at it.

Thank you
Russell

Last edited by Russell-Evans; 08-23-2009 at 11:42 AM.
08-23-2009, 02:54 PM   #27
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QuoteOriginally posted by StigVidar Quote
On K-7, custom function 14 set to off is the most important setting in my opinion. It let you focus when you want with the AF button and it let you take pictures at exactly the right moment.

So you prefocus a few seconds before taking pictures and are ready for that special moment.
That's another button to push and another operation that can screw up. After yesterday I'm thinking manual focus is the reliable way to go. Unfortunately, with the looking into a tunnel viewfinders that APS-C camera have, manual focus is not a dream come true.
It is most likely better than what I am finding to be rather vague and unreliable AF.

QuoteOriginally posted by impact Quote
Still, if the camera indicated good focus (green hexagon lit up), it should let you take a picture. Unless of course it was waiting for the flash to recharge or something.
My flash doesn't talk to the camera. The camera managed to blow it for me all by itself.

QuoteOriginally posted by Ash Quote
Sorry for that experience Wheatfield.
I just don't get why the cams didn't fire seeing as though AF locked on.
Flash wasn't P-TTL and so won't stop camera from firing if not ready to discharge.
Care to shed some light on the possiblities there?
The only think I can think is that the AF locked and the subject moved slightly out of focus prior to the shutter release, thereby negating the focus lock. I'm also wondering if the AF sensor isn't a bit colour blind and so wasn't seeing as well as it could have.

QuoteOriginally posted by WalterGA Quote
If the camera tells you the subject is in focus, flip the camera af switch to M, then take the picture. I use that technique all the time. The focus won't change, unless you change the distance between the camera and the subject.

Could be, also, that you need a more modern, sophisticated flash unit.
Too time consuming. With a lot of this stuff, by the time it's obvious that the camera has dropped the ball, the opportunity is gone. The handoff at a wedding only takes a couple of seconds, and generally the ideal photo happens in the space of about a half second.
My experience with modern, sophisticated flash units is that they are less reliable than my old non TTL, plug it into the PC socket dinosaur. I have an AF540 FGZ that I pretty much never use because it just doesn't do what I want.

QuoteOriginally posted by MJB DIGITAL Quote
How good is your second shooter?

I can imagine the feeling (and the look on your face) after missing the second missed shot....

Sorry man. So how do you have your AF set up? Is it connected to the shutter button?
No second shooter, I play these things as a one man band. The AF just plain failed. I've tried a few of the suggestions here, but they either don't fit into the way I work, or don't work.
When the camera is set to AF, disableing it with the AF button doesn't allow manual focus with a screwdrive lens, since all the button does is turn off the AF. It doesn't disengage the mechanism.
I use the AF connected to the shutter button. The only time it's ever been a problem is when I need the camera to shoot at a fairly specific moment, at which time it always seems to do a faceplant for me.
I tried AF-C during the processional (it was VERY slow moving so I was able to make adjustments to the camera, something I try to avoid), but found that the camera wasn't following the subject accurately.
I should have just switched the AF off completely.
Live and learn.
Fortunately, I don't shoot weddings very often.
I was ranting a bit to one of the shooters at the studio, a D300 user. She was completely aghast that a camera would drop the ball that way. Apparently this is not an issue with her Nikon. It locks on and takes the picture every time.

Pentax has a way to go in the AF department still. This isn't really surprising, they are still using what is essentially an 8 year old AF system.
08-23-2009, 05:21 PM   #28
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QuoteOriginally posted by Wheatfield Quote
When the camera is set to AF, disableing it with the AF button doesn't allow manual focus with a screwdrive lens, since all the button does is turn off the AF. It doesn't disengage the mechanism.
Correction: This is an issue if you are using non-QSF lenses.

QuoteQuote:
I use the AF connected to the shutter button. The only time it's ever been a problem is when I need the camera to shoot at a fairly specific moment, at which time it always seems to do a faceplant for me.
If you know that it's a critical situation, why not modify your setup to ensure you get the shot, rather than ranting when it doesn't work the way you want?

QuoteQuote:
I was ranting a bit to one of the shooters at the studio, a D300 user. She was completely aghast that a camera would drop the ball that way. Apparently this is not an issue with her Nikon. It locks on and takes the picture every time.

Pentax has a way to go in the AF department still. This isn't really surprising, they are still using what is essentially an 8 year old AF system.
And her camera has never, ever done anything wrong? No camera is perfect, and her anecdote doesn't prove anything about the reliability of Nikon cameras, nor does your experience prove anything about the reliability of Pentax cameras.
08-23-2009, 05:32 PM   #29
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I figured out some time ago, that, if I HAD to get a shot, I'd let the camera AF, then I'd flip to manual. Works every time. It's called "thinking in advance."
08-23-2009, 05:38 PM   #30
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Sorry but I'm wondering how is the camera to blame?
Isn't it the responsibility of a working pro to know the ins and outs of the cameras beforehand? There no reason in my view why the shutter can't be released once the AF has locked.
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