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09-30-2009, 09:43 PM   #16
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QuoteOriginally posted by jct us101 Quote
Oh, I had no idea that SR wasn't useful on every lens. That's what I was always told. Anyways, he compares it to models that are entirely out of the range of the K-7 as well. The 7D is NOT a comparison, the Canon 50D would be a much better one (although it lacks video), and the D300s comparison is almost laughable. Either way I really don't take his reviews with as much appreciation now that I've read that review, in the past I've always thought he was never partial to anything.
I prefer the 7D over the 50D anytime of the day. from my standpoint, the 50D is nothing more than a rip-off. same as the D300s. more bucks for a few tweaks? not worth it. 7D is.

09-30-2009, 09:46 PM   #17
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Overall the reviewer sound extreamly impressed by the camera.

I think the "negatives" he presented are more that he had to add something negative otherwise the review would look biased.
09-30-2009, 09:51 PM   #18
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QuoteOriginally posted by jct us101 Quote
Oh, I had no idea that SR wasn't useful on every lens. That's what I was always told. Anyways, he compares it to models that are entirely out of the range of the K-7 as well. The 7D is NOT a comparison, the Canon 50D would be a much better one (although it lacks video), and the D300s comparison is almost laughable. Either way I really don't take his reviews with as much appreciation now that I've read that review, in the past I've always thought he was never partial to anything.
Apparently, Jeff is partial to the K7!

QuoteQuote:
The Pentax K-7 isn't just an excellent midrange digital SLR -- it's also an incredible value. It may not have the fastest burst rate or lowest noise in its class, but it offers more features per dollar than anything else out there. It has very good image quality, stellar build quality, snappy performance (in most situations), more manual controls than you'll need, unique exposure modes, an HD movie mode, and lots more. Downsides are few. The camera tends to underexpose, and its image are on the soft side. The movie mode could use some work, contrast detect autofocus is slow (when using live view), and the menu system looks like a relic of the last century. Ultimately, the K-7 is a high-end camera at a midrange price, and it's a great choice for Pentax owners looking to upgrade, or first time D-SLR buyers who want something more capable than an entry-level model.
QuoteQuote:
Despite a few flaws -- most of them being easy to work-around -- the Pentax K-7 is an excellent digital SLR, offering features normally found on cameras two or three times its price. Heck, some of the K-7's features won't be found on any other camera. While I doubt that folks with a lot of money invested in other D-SLR systems will be jumping ship for the K-7, owners of Pentax cameras or those just starting out will be lining up to get their hands on this camera, and well they should. The K-7 is a great camera for enthusiasts, and it easily earns my recommendation.
09-30-2009, 11:37 PM   #19
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QuoteOriginally posted by ftpaddict Quote
Common knowledge is to just set the SR focal length value to the shortest focal length of the lens (i.e. for a 70-210mm lens, one would set SR to 70)
imo, common knowledge might need to be tempered with a little bit of common sense regarding this.

On a (hypothetical) 30-60mm setting it at the lowest level (30mm) might work because the difference isn't all that great, but on a 50-500mm I personally think it's asking for trouble to set it at 50mm, use it mainly at 500mm and expect great results.

I'd love to see some emperical testing done on this, comparing the "set once at lowest zoom" and "reset often nearer to zoom that's actually being used"

09-30-2009, 11:47 PM   #20
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It does not work...

SR is crippled on non 'A' zooms... you all can talk about setting it at the lowest setting, but that is not effective unless you are down at the wide end.

I have a adaptall tamron 70-210... if you set for either end, the other end does not effectively SR and in fact even makes it worse if you happen to have it set on the long end and then switch back.

All I am saying is that the reviewer is correct... SR does not work for all lenses.

Can you work around it, of course you can... We Pentax owners have perfected the work-around!

I can set it if for near the long end and just turn SR off at the 70-100mm range as I can hand hold pretty good... but it is still a work around... The SR is not fully functional.
10-01-2009, 01:26 AM   #21
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Yep, agreed. I'd say that for primes it's great, but for zooms it's not - so they need to slightly change how they do it. Instead of making the user manually put in the focal length, either make the sensor measure the radial spread & bounce distance of the AF assist light to calculate an optimum SR for that focal length (optional of course) OR use a small laser to achieve the same end - whichever works better. Zooms are hugely popular so as a manufacturer you really want to get them right.

One other trick they missed is making individual lenses fully configurable. yes the K7 can have focus adjustment for each Pentax one, but not for my M42 primes or others it doesn't recognise. It'd be dreamy to have a bunch of custom settings per lens that, as you put on your new lens, you could just call up, having preprogrammed them in before. Ie my old Tair could do with a little help in contrast, so it'd get +1 (etc)

As for the UI I couldn't agree more. Look what Apple can do inside a tiny Nano and that takes up virtually no physical space. Make it a touchscreen!

-apologies for the somewhat off topic/K7 nature of this post =)

Last edited by Nass; 10-01-2009 at 01:38 AM.
10-01-2009, 04:28 AM   #22
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I think there are two things to remember. First of all, a balanced review will bring up any negatives that the reviewer found. If he found photos soft or menus clunky, he should say it. The person reading the review then needs to figure out if those negatives will effect his enjoyment of the camera. Secondly, all of us come with a background in a particular brand. I am very used to Pentax and the Pentax way of doing things and if I were to review a Nikon, I would likely mention how I missed the green button and SR in the camera. I think the comments on the menu interface are more comments that show the reviewers familiarity with Nikon/Canon than negative comments about Pentax.
10-01-2009, 07:17 AM   #23
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That review is an embarassment for the site. Stating that the camera has "too many buttons" clearly shows the reviewer doesn't grasp the concept of an advanced camera and should stick to compacts. A person that lost among the information shouldn't be allowed to have a review site.

QuoteOriginally posted by Pentaxor Quote
I prefer the 7D over the 50D anytime of the day. from my standpoint, the 50D is nothing more than a rip-off. same as the D300s. more bucks for a few tweaks? not worth it. 7D is.
IMHO the 7D is the rip off here. Sony somehow manages to sell a full frame camera for $200 more than the 7D. And when you get the 7D you buy into a system designed for full frame cameras. Take the 28-70 f/2.8 L lens - LOSE WIDE ANGLE. Or the 70-200 - focal lenght not so useful for twice the cost of Pentax equivalent for aps-c 50-135. Canon L lenses cripple anyone left with a aps-c camera. It's just a really dumb move to buy a 7D and pay through the nose for FF lenses IMHO. Also dumb to buy a 7D and use it with ordinary EF-S lenses. A dumb move any way. And a lot of people are buying it it seems. Says something of the human race.

10-01-2009, 07:22 AM   #24
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cheeky quip: on this whole FF debate... whilst I can see the plusses for FF, it also seems to me that Pentax isn'ty exactly known for its tele lens range these days, so if it went FF wouldn't that cause itself a little bit of an issue (and more importantly its users who suddenly lose 35% of their focal length??). Mind you the wide angle shots would be great
10-01-2009, 09:00 AM   #25
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QuoteOriginally posted by Nass Quote
cheeky quip: on this whole FF debate... whilst I can see the plusses for FF, it also seems to me that Pentax isn'ty exactly known for its tele lens range these days, so if it went FF wouldn't that cause itself a little bit of an issue (and more importantly its users who suddenly lose 35% of their focal length??). Mind you the wide angle shots would be great
No no. Because crop factors don't work that way, unless the FF was also more megapixels and didn't out resolve the lens, so you can blow the picture up larger.
10-01-2009, 10:40 AM   #26
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QuoteOriginally posted by kristoffon Quote
That review is an embarassment for the site. Stating that the camera has "too many buttons" clearly shows the reviewer doesn't grasp the concept of an advanced camera and should stick to compacts. A person that lost among the information shouldn't be allowed to have a review site.



IMHO the 7D is the rip off here. Sony somehow manages to sell a full frame camera for $200 more than the 7D. And when you get the 7D you buy into a system designed for full frame cameras. Take the 28-70 f/2.8 L lens - LOSE WIDE ANGLE. Or the 70-200 - focal lenght not so useful for twice the cost of Pentax equivalent for aps-c 50-135. Canon L lenses cripple anyone left with a aps-c camera. It's just a really dumb move to buy a 7D and pay through the nose for FF lenses IMHO. Also dumb to buy a 7D and use it with ordinary EF-S lenses. A dumb move any way. And a lot of people are buying it it seems. Says something of the human race.
you are not suggesting that I'm dumb, are you? btw, using or choosing an APS camera doesn't make you dumb, nor choosing the lens for it. the FOV cropping is a part of reality or feature of APS sensor camera. don't be too sure that buying EF-S is dumb just because it's more affordable than buying an L lens. remember that they have option on getting an EF lens as well. does it make Pentax users dumb if they don't buy or have the DA* zooms but have the Tokina, Sigma and other cheaper Pentax zooms?

btw, I wouldn't quickly jump on the 7D APS and SONY FF comparison and conclusion just yet. had you seen the initial results from the A850? they don't look that promising at all. the A900 is a disaster btw. just hope that the A850 is not an embarrassment to the FF name coz for what it looks like, it can't do any better than the early 5D. it looks useless at 24MP resolution due to poor High ISO Noise performance at 3200. it's IQ doesn't look good nor any better than the 7D and appears 2 steps below it. that is huge.
if the A850 looked that good, I would had been excited by now, but I look disappointed rather than excited. seems like the A850 is a FF rip-off if it can't do better against an APS-C sensor camera or fully utilized it's 24MP sensor. now that's a real waste of money and feature.

Last edited by Pentaxor; 10-01-2009 at 12:34 PM.
10-01-2009, 11:12 AM   #27
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QuoteOriginally posted by Igilligan Quote
SR is crippled on non 'A' zooms... you all can talk about setting it at the lowest setting, but that is not effective unless you are down at the wide end.

I have a adaptall tamron 70-210... if you set for either end, the other end does not effectively SR and in fact even makes it worse if you happen to have it set on the long end and then switch back.

All I am saying is that the reviewer is correct... SR does not work for all lenses.

Can you work around it, of course you can... We Pentax owners have perfected the work-around!

I can set it if for near the long end and just turn SR off at the 70-100mm range as I can hand hold pretty good... but it is still a work around... The SR is not fully functional.
I've used wrong SR settings and the pictures are fine. It's only in extreme circumstances for like a 70-200 set at 50mm...or using 28mm for a 90mm macro at full magnification... I think I took tests shot with a Tok 80-200 set at 50mm...I can't remember if I turned SR off or not because the pics turned out fine. So I won't hold that example high since I can't remember less than a week previous

SR itself WORKS at all focal lengths listed in the menu, or a near approximation. SR WORKS for every lens...physically, it sure does.

The AUTOMATIC functioning of SR is "crippled" on pre-A lenses, but you can still set SR. Pain in the ass or not...I can't disagree that it is crippled in its auto focal length-sensing function.

If you can set it, it works. Symantics, yes, but SR surely works on all lenses...just like all M42 lenses can be used...they just have a limitation on automation (stop down metering).
10-01-2009, 02:40 PM   #28
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This is funny, because I was trying to cheat when shooting video with a Takumar 50 the other day and tried setting the SR button to higher numbers (like 100mm) to see if it would make it even steadier. Needless to say I couldn't see a difference, in fact it seemed to make it slightly worse
10-01-2009, 03:22 PM   #29
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Did we (PentaxForums) ever come to a conclusion about SR settings...as in, lower SR settings degrade the image less than higher settings which over-compensate?

All I ever recall seeing were pics of the K20's updated and improved firmware with regards to SR
10-01-2009, 03:46 PM   #30
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QuoteOriginally posted by Pentaxor Quote
you are not suggesting that I'm dumb, are you? btw, using or choosing an APS camera doesn't make you dumb, nor choosing the lens for it. the FOV cropping is a part of reality or feature of APS sensor camera. don't be too sure that buying EF-S is dumb just because it's more affordable than buying an L lens. remember that they have option on getting an EF lens as well. does it make Pentax users dumb if they don't buy or have the DA* zooms but have the Tokina, Sigma and other cheaper Pentax zooms?

btw, I wouldn't quickly jump on the 7D APS and SONY FF comparison and conclusion just yet. had you seen the initial results from the A850? they don't look that promising at all. the A900 is a disaster btw. just hope that the A850 is not an embarrassment to the FF name coz for what it looks like, it can't do any better than the early 5D. it looks useless at 24MP resolution due to poor High ISO Noise performance at 3200. it's IQ doesn't look good nor any better than the 7D and appears 2 steps below it. that is huge.
if the A850 looked that good, I would had been excited by now, but I look disappointed rather than excited. seems like the A850 is a FF rip-off if it can't do better against an APS-C sensor camera or fully utilized it's 24MP sensor. now that's a real waste of money and feature.
DXO seems to think the noise difference is much smaller than a single stop between the 5D2 and the A900. The overall sensor scores are a tie.

Compare cameras

You have to take into account that when printing the camera with more pixels has its noise averaged out. It's only an issue if you're printing extremely large.

I mantain that the 7D is a total rip off compared to the A900. The Sony system as a whole sucks though, I'd never buy that camera unless all I were to use were MF Carl Zeiss primes. And also that when buying the 7D + L lenses same quality shots can be had by a lot less money using other brands (Pentax for one, and even Nikon)
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