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05-31-2007, 09:20 AM   #46
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I guess you are all right. Now that Pentax is showing some real competition to the other brands and is gaining in popularity it is time to jump ship. After all, it is this boost in popularity that has caused the lenses to become scarce and prices go up. How dare Pentax make themselves an in demand name. The nerve of some companies.

All my gear will be for sale by the end of June. K10D, DA, FA and FA* lenses, 540 fgz, etc. Time to get a system with crappy, but readily available lenses.

05-31-2007, 10:51 AM   #47
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QuoteOriginally posted by davemdsn Quote
Pease tell me that we are not silly enough to blame a manufacturer for the inadequacies of local retailers.
I recently saw a Yamaha motorcycle shop go out of business because they wouldn't bring in what the customer wanted. They figured that because they had no competition in that town the people would take what they could get and live with it.
I'd hate to see any camera shops close up for such ignorance, but I wouldn't be surprised if some do.
05-31-2007, 11:34 AM   #48
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QuoteOriginally posted by davemdsn Quote
I guess you are all right. Now that Pentax is showing some real competition to the other brands and is gaining in popularity it is time to jump ship. After all, it is this boost in popularity that has caused the lenses to become scarce and prices go up. How dare Pentax make themselves an in demand name. The nerve of some companies.

All my gear will be for sale by the end of June. K10D, DA, FA and FA* lenses, 540 fgz, etc. Time to get a system with crappy, but readily available lenses.
Come on man let's be real and not biased. If the lenses were really that "crappy", they wouldn't be market leaders. They're market leaders for 2 reasons:

#1 the equipment is good
#2 the equipment is readily available

Right now Pentax only satisfies #1. Pentax (the company) does not pay my bills, and I have no loyalty to them or any other manufacturer. My only loyalty is to my profession (if you can call it that, or wanna call it that). People say that Pentax is crappy, WHO CARES! I know Pentax equipment is good cause I use it. So what they say means nothing to me. Pentaxians want to spend the money to get the equipment. The problem is the equipment is not there to get! If you were offered $50k to shoot "The Superbowl" but in order to get the kind of shots they wanted you to get you needed a 500mm f/2.8 lens, would you pass on the opportunity cause Pentax doesn't have one? Let me answer that for you....No! You would go and get the camera you needed to capture those shots. It's business...never personal!
05-31-2007, 02:39 PM   #49
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QuoteOriginally posted by Mr CJ Quote
Come on man let's be real and not biased. If the lenses were really that "crappy", they wouldn't be market leaders. They're market leaders for 2 reasons:

#1 the equipment is good
#2 the equipment is readily available

Right now Pentax only satisfies #1. Pentax (the company) does not pay my bills, and I have no loyalty to them or any other manufacturer. My only loyalty is to my profession (if you can call it that, or wanna call it that). People say that Pentax is crappy, WHO CARES! I know Pentax equipment is good cause I use it. So what they say means nothing to me. Pentaxians want to spend the money to get the equipment. The problem is the equipment is not there to get! If you were offered $50k to shoot "The Superbowl" but in order to get the kind of shots they wanted you to get you needed a 500mm f/2.8 lens, would you pass on the opportunity cause Pentax doesn't have one? Let me answer that for you....No! You would go and get the camera you needed to capture those shots. It's business...never personal!
I wasn't being biased, I was being sarcastic. I exagerated.

Speaking of getting real - these elusive lenses that nobody can find, or at least the ones that people always say they are looking for, the FA50, the FA35, the 43, 31, and 77mm limiteds, the 21 and 40mm limiteds? All in stock at B&H right now.

Speaking of getting real - by show of hands, how many people on this forum make $50k per shoot? How many people are prepared to spend $5299 for a lens (the price of a Canon 500mm f4 (fastest I could find))? The 400mm f2.8 is over $6000 and the 600mm f4 is $7000.

Actually do make a little money with photography. I shot a wedding last weekend with a K10D with a Tamron 28-75 f2.8 (available everwhere I looked and for around $400), and a K100D with a DA 50-200 (slow but sharp and available everywhere I looked and for under $200 after rebate). I didn't even pull out my primes. Too much wind for lots of lens changing. I took 892 photos in a little under 5 hours. I didn't miss a single shot, in fact I got too many by far.

I can think of a lot things I would like to have, an assistant being high on the list. The fact of the matter is that what I have serves it's purpose very well and if I want to have money left over for food I don't even want to look at $5000+ lenses.

I don't consider myself a fanboy, just a photographer who is pleased with the tools he has. I look at other systems all the time. I am a big fan of both the D200 and the 5D. Neither would give me an advantage that would be worth the extra cost of switching. I don't care if people choose to sell Pentax and get something else, I just don't see the point of making posts about it. It doesn't help or change things in any way. It only shows any potential Pentax shooting lurkers that the system gets bashed by it's own user base. How much confidence would that give you? How is Pentax supposed to survive long enough to fix the supply issue if we keep scaring away the demand?

05-31-2007, 03:36 PM   #50
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QuoteOriginally posted by davemdsn Quote
I wasn't being biased, I was being sarcastic. I exagerated.

Speaking of getting real - these elusive lenses that nobody can find, or at least the ones that people always say they are looking for, the FA50, the FA35, the 43, 31, and 77mm limiteds, the 21 and 40mm limiteds? All in stock at B&H right now.

Speaking of getting real - by show of hands, how many people on this forum make $50k per shoot? How many people are prepared to spend $5299 for a lens (the price of a Canon 500mm f4 (fastest I could find))? The 400mm f2.8 is over $6000 and the 600mm f4 is $7000.

Actually do make a little money with photography. I shot a wedding last weekend with a K10D with a Tamron 28-75 f2.8 (available everwhere I looked and for around $400), and a K100D with a DA 50-200 (slow but sharp and available everywhere I looked and for under $200 after rebate). I didn't even pull out my primes. Too much wind for lots of lens changing. I took 892 photos in a little under 5 hours. I didn't miss a single shot, in fact I got too many by far.

I can think of a lot things I would like to have, an assistant being high on the list. The fact of the matter is that what I have serves it's purpose very well and if I want to have money left over for food I don't even want to look at $5000+ lenses.

I don't consider myself a fanboy, just a photographer who is pleased with the tools he has. I look at other systems all the time. I am a big fan of both the D200 and the 5D. Neither would give me an advantage that would be worth the extra cost of switching. I don't care if people choose to sell Pentax and get something else, I just don't see the point of making posts about it. It doesn't help or change things in any way. It only shows any potential Pentax shooting lurkers that the system gets bashed by it's own user base. How much confidence would that give you? How is Pentax supposed to survive long enough to fix the supply issue if we keep scaring away the demand?
You make some really good points here and I agree. The point of the $50k is; is it really worth passing up on really good money just because the lens you need to shoot the event either doesn't exist in Pentax mount or almost impossible to find. I see those lenses you listed above all the time, but in my case I need something like a 70-200 f/2.8, which like I stated, either doesn't exist in Pentax mount (which it does), or is almost impossible to find (which it is). My plan is not to switch, but if business dictates, then I will. The best thing about the K10 is that no matter what lens I use I have SR (like someone stated earlier). That is a HUGE plus in my book. Not to mention the fact that the FA 50mm/1.4 is a darn good lens and I love using it!! To me this lens is under priced at $200. It's worth every bit of $400.
05-31-2007, 04:07 PM   #51
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Everyone keeps saying that "there is heaps of lenses available on the net" ie, B&H and yes, there is. But im a 17 year old with no credit card, a low paying job and LBA. My only source of buying lenses now is locally and its almost impossible.
05-31-2007, 05:35 PM   #52
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QuoteOriginally posted by smcclelland Quote
Frankly from a newcomer standpoint I don't really see where the disappointment in the K100D comes from or why you feel the need to have such "professional equipment" right away. As others have stated, learn the ropes of photography and the art behind it by shooting as much as you can with the K100D. As you progress and adapt then buy lenses you find you require to obtain certain shots and build your collection. Spending $2000+ right away on glass or replacing your K100D with a high end Canon or Nikon sounds like more money than sense to me.

I hear the same type of thing every day at work (I work in computer animation for film, working on stereoscopic IMAX 3D features currently) and at least a few times a week an artist says "I need a new machine" and they think that spending the $6000+ is going to turn their work into this dazzling piece. The hardware's just a pencil, it's the person who holds the pencil that dictates the outcome and how they put it to use.

goodluck with your choice.

-shawn
yeah, but the extra processing power goes a long way in speeding up render times, allowing you to do more work.

but then you have a point about spending $2000+ for a camera that's only gonna be used for a campus journal.

my point is, if you're a professional, then every extra bit of power or feature might be worth the cost, and if you're not, then it's more prudent to use what's available, especially if you don't have a lot of spare cash.
05-31-2007, 05:41 PM   #53
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QuoteOriginally posted by davemdsn Quote
Don't blame Pentax. They want to be in those camera stores.
Not really. There's a place in Manila here in the Philippines where most photographers get their stuff. Lines and lines of stores selling new and used photo equipment; the brick-and-mortar kind of store.

Pentax doesn't make any effort to get their products in these stores, probably since the local distributors think they could make a killing in malls.

It's even more ironic since Pentax cameras are assembled locally, right here in the Philippines, but the distributors find it hard to stock even the most common of Pentax lenses and accessories (try waiting 4 months for a DA 50-200).

I'm hoping that the new management would finally resolve this.

05-31-2007, 06:28 PM   #54
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QuoteOriginally posted by davemdsn Quote
How is Pentax supposed to survive long enough to fix the supply issue if we keep scaring away the demand?
You make really valid points, and I concur with a lot of them. This particular line, though, jumps at me.

Pentax is already lacking with regards to meeting the current demand (us). As much as I promote Pentax to friends, I can't fully close the doors on their other options since new (even used) glass for Pentax is quite hard to find locally.

You can say all you want about online ordering (I've done this myself, and it was a good experience), but not all people want to risk doing that.
05-31-2007, 06:35 PM   #55
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re: the original topic

I think a K100D with the 18-55mm lens might sell for $400 to a newbie, but anyone in the USA who has enough smarts to come here or post on DPR would probably offer $300-350 at best. If it's $430 new after rebate .... is that with lens?
05-31-2007, 09:31 PM   #56
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QuoteOriginally posted by -spam- Quote
Everyone keeps saying that "there is heaps of lenses available on the net" ie, B&H and yes, there is. But im a 17 year old with no credit card, a low paying job and LBA. My only source of buying lenses now is locally and its almost impossible.

Oh, my goodness. I can see where this is going.
K-MOUNT KILLER CAPTURED

Brisbane police announced today that they had arrested a seventeen-year old male in connection with the recent string of robberies in which amateur photographers - often middle-aged or elderly folks - were forced to surrender the lenses on their cameras. Detectives observed that the robber only took "K-mount" lenses commonly found on Pentax-brand cameras, so the robber was dubbed the K-Mount Killer.

"He never actually killed anybody," admitted Detective Vincent "Vinny" Salerno. "We just thought it sounded good and it stuck."

Only once did the K-Mount Killer take the entire camera, a recently-released Pentax model K10D. In that case, according to the police report seen by The News, he carefully took the lens off the camera, capped it, and handed it back to the victim. Then he ran off yelling "Upgrade!"

Typically, a day or two after the attack, high-quality prints taken with the victims' lenses would mysteriously appear in their postal boxes. "It was traumatic, getting those photos in the post," said Betty Lindenhaal, 82, of Kipney, one of the K-Mount Killers early victims. "There was a photo that reminded me of Edgar, except that it was tack sharp, unlike the pics I'd taken with that lens meself. Like pouring salt in a wound, it was. Reminded me what I had lost." Edgar, identified in preliminary reports as Mrs Lindenhaal's husband, has subsequently been identified as a cockapoo.

At his booking, the young man got into a heated argument with the photographer at the police station who tried to take his mug shot. "I could not help myself. He was using an FA 50 f/1.4 wide open and also using the on-board flash - and with no compensation whatsoever! Harsh shadows, possible red-eye, no depth of field. I know the lens is a bit soft wide open, but I still think it's police brutality!"

After the outburst, a representative of the prosecutor's office reminded the young man once more that anything he said could be used against him in court. Later the prosecutor admitted privately that he had no idea what the suspect was on about.

In the end, the young man was permitted to take his own mug shots after the police photographer left the police station weeping.

Later, at his arraignment, the youth confessed to the crimes and told the magistrate that he suffered from an addiction he refused to specify. He did use the term "LBA", then he complained about not being able to satisfy his addiction over the Internet. He has been remanded to the custody of the psychological services department for evaluation. "LBA" appears to be a street term, but The News has not been able to find a psychological professional who is familiar with the acronym.

"We had no idea," said the boy's mother, who spoke to The News on condition of anonymity. "We thought he was coming straight home from his part-time job at the chip shop. But we should have wondered why he always seemed to be penniless. Photography! He's broken my heart, he has. His pa and I so hoped he'd be a dentist, or you know, something useful."

After pleading guilty to nineteen counts of misdemeanor assault and theft of property over $299, the boy was given a probated sentence and is now on parole. He was forced to return the equipment he had stolen, all of which was recovered from his bedroom. "It's amazing," said Detective Salerno. The owners said it's in better condition than when he stole it. We are pretty sure this is the first time in the history of the Force that we've actually recovered stolen photographic equipment."

The young man has been allowed to return to his low-paying job as a cook in a chip shop, but he has to report to a parole officer once a week. He is also forbidden to use any camera that accepts interchangeable lenses.
Will :-)
05-31-2007, 09:53 PM   #57
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QuoteOriginally posted by WMBP Quote
Oh, my goodness. I can see where this is going.
K-MOUNT KILLER CAPTURED

Brisbane police announced today that they had arrested a seventeen-year old male in connection with the recent string of robberies in which amateur photographers - often middle-aged or elderly folks - were forced to surrender the lenses on their cameras. Detectives observed that the robber only took "K-mount" lenses commonly found on Pentax-brand cameras, so the robber was dubbed the K-Mount Killer.

"He never actually killed anybody," admitted Detective Vincent "Vinny" Salerno. "We just thought it sounded good and it stuck."

Only once did the K-Mount Killer take the entire camera, a recently-released Pentax model K10D. In that case, according to the police report seen by The News, he carefully took the lens off the camera, capped it, and handed it back to the victim. Then he ran off yelling "Upgrade!"

Typically, a day or two after the attack, high-quality prints taken with the victims' lenses would mysteriously appear in their postal boxes. "It was traumatic, getting those photos in the post," said Betty Lindenhaal, 82, of Kipney, one of the K-Mount Killers early victims. "There was a photo that reminded me of Edgar, except that it was tack sharp, unlike the pics I'd taken with that lens meself. Like pouring salt in a wound, it was. Reminded me what I had lost." Edgar, identified in preliminary reports as Mrs Lindenhaal's husband, has subsequently been identified as a cockapoo.

At his booking, the young man got into a heated argument with the photographer at the police station who tried to take his mug shot. "I could not help myself. He was using an FA 50 f/1.4 wide open and also using the on-board flash - and with no compensation whatsoever! Harsh shadows, possible red-eye, no depth of field. I know the lens is a bit soft wide open, but I still think it's police brutality!"

After the outburst, a representative of the prosecutor's office reminded the young man once more that anything he said could be used against him in court. Later the prosecutor admitted privately that he had no idea what the suspect was on about.

In the end, the young man was permitted to take his own mug shots after the police photographer left the police station weeping.

Later, at his arraignment, the youth confessed to the crimes and told the magistrate that he suffered from an addiction he refused to specify. He did use the term "LBA", then he complained about not being able to satisfy his addiction over the Internet. He has been remanded to the custody of the psychological services department for evaluation. "LBA" appears to be a street term, but The News has not been able to find a psychological professional who is familiar with the acronym.

"We had no idea," said the boy's mother, who spoke to The News on condition of anonymity. "We thought he was coming straight home from his part-time job at the chip shop. But we should have wondered why he always seemed to be penniless. Photography! He's broken my heart, he has. His pa and I so hoped he'd be a dentist, or you know, something useful."

After pleading guilty to nineteen counts of misdemeanor assault and theft of property over $299, the boy was given a probated sentence and is now on parole. He was forced to return the equipment he had stolen, all of which was recovered from his bedroom. "It's amazing," said Detective Salerno. The owners said it's in better condition than when he stole it. We are pretty sure this is the first time in the history of the Force that we've actually recovered stolen photographic equipment."

The young man has been allowed to return to his low-paying job as a cook in a chip shop, but he has to report to a parole officer once a week. He is also forbidden to use any camera that accepts interchangeable lenses.
Will :-)

oh my, that was the best laugh i have had in a long time thank you so much for that.

Just one thing, my "pa" would have been an accomplice, he has LBA nearly as bad as i do...
05-31-2007, 11:19 PM   #58
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so, davemdsn, You think that future pentaxians will be those who live near adorama, b&h and some japanese?
let me show you something:
pentax lenses in ebay (~1000 items).
canon lenses in ebay (~3700 items)
ebay is stupid example, but it shows, what is available and what is not.
here is the local latvian web market page, where we can sell/buy used and new gear (only c&n)
heres is pentax gear in latvian internet shops(~500 items)
and here is canon in latvian web shops (~2000 items)

damn, pentax marketing experts rocks, don't they?!. only few americans, can be pentaxians, and others can use kit lenses or go ...
If i had a money and if I wanted such a collection as Mo's, I would better start knitting or find some other hobby. or just go for a canon and get analogic lenses in two days for much cheaper price. FA* lenses: cost drillion, most of them are no more in production and damn hard to find; DA* will be more expensive and only new. C L lenses: Cost much but available used ones that are cheaper than used FA*s and futer DA*s; and are easy available everywhere; if something bad happens, just go and get a new lens. See the difference?
Pentax should start an agressive marketing politics, like canon or they will stay only as a good old sweet memories.

Sorry for my poor english!
06-01-2007, 04:32 AM   #59
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Thanks, Will. That was the best post I've read in weeks

And to those who are under 18, why not get a debit card? Works just like a credit card, but you can't spend more than what's on your account. Last time I checked, there wasn't any age limit, as long as your parents approve.
06-01-2007, 05:13 AM   #60
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QuoteOriginally posted by kskjon Quote
And to those who are under 18, why not get a debit card? Works just like a credit card, but you can't spend more than what's on your account. Last time I checked, there wasn't any age limit, as long as your parents approve.
Been thinking about it. But then there is the issue of keeping money in the acount to spend
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