When there is a K?D what will it be like?

kenyee · 06-17-2007, 06:55 PM

Ben:
How did you do the lighting on that? The shadows don't match. It's almost like the white sphere was grafted on afterwards because I don't see a shadow from a snoot. The shadow to the left of her right leg doesn't look like anything in the scene. The light color on the top and around her legs don't match although I guess you could have snooted/gridded both, but that doesn't explain the weird shadow to the left of her right leg. And her right leg is moving from the blur, which is an odd thing to see too.

davemdsn · 06-17-2007, 06:59 PM

Originally posted by benjikan

If this is not taken by a pro-camera..Well you tell me

I've said it before and this photo says it again - cameras are not professional, people are professional. The camera is only the tool and it is obvious in the hands of someone like Ben that this camera can meet the needs of a true pro.

People forget that professional photography existed, even flourished, long before digital. For that matter, even sports photography existed back when the photographer had to not only focus the lens manually, he had to wind the film with his thumb. New technology may make life easier, but great photos are still taken by people, not cameras.

benjikan · 06-18-2007, 03:10 AM

Originally posted by kenyee

Ben:
How did you do the lighting on that? The shadows don't match. It's almost like the white sphere was grafted on afterwards because I don't see a shadow from a snoot. The shadow to the left of her right leg doesn't look like anything in the scene. The light color on the top and around her legs don't match although I guess you could have snooted/gridded both, but that doesn't explain the weird shadow to the left of her right leg. And her right leg is moving from the blur, which is an odd thing to see too.

Look at the neck shadow..What do you see to the left of it? Why do you assume I used a "Snoot"? I didn't use a snoot...All of the shadows are what was seen during the actual shooting. What was there was there...Really. Ah..Isn't photography magical.

PS..and I MEAN THIS; "You Really Have to Learn to "F" with Light!!!!"

Benji

kenyee · 06-18-2007, 06:30 AM

Originally posted by benjikan

Look at the neck shadow..What do you see to the left of it? Why do you assume I used a "Snoot"?

I assumed a snoot because of the rectangular patch on the wall.
Ok...from the other pic, it looks like those are some sort of spherical light fixtures (although I have no idea how you got that lightning effect unless you photoshopped it in :-).
For the original picture, I would guess:
- one softbox or something w/ a light modifier close to the light fixtures, but above her head and to the right of her (to her left)
- a halogen desk lamp or some other tungsten source far right and shining left (that weird shadow is the shadow from her rear end lit by this light)

What I still don't get is the halo around her head in that first picture. It's like there's another light but I can't figure out where it's coming from... :-)

benjikan · 06-19-2007, 08:34 AM

Originally posted by kenyee

I assumed a snoot because of the rectangular patch on the wall.
Ok...from the other pic, it looks like those are some sort of spherical light fixtures (although I have no idea how you got that lightning effect unless you photoshopped it in :-).
For the original picture, I would guess:
- one softbox or something w/ a light modifier close to the light fixtures, but above her head and to the right of her (to her left)
- a halogen desk lamp or some other tungsten source far right and shining left (that weird shadow is the shadow from her rear end lit by this light)

What I still don't get is the halo around her head in that first picture. It's like there's another light but I can't figure out where it's coming from... :-)

The more you observe the more you speculate and the more you speculate the more you experiment and the more you experiment the more you learn..Wow, we kind of came full circle.

SGT · 06-19-2007, 09:31 AM

Originally posted by benjikan

Look..Pentax are not riding on their laurels. Pentax is not the same company you knew two years ago. For that matter, Pentax may just pull out all the stops for the next up and coming shows in the Fall of 2007..I'm pretty confident of that...

Pull out all of the stops, produce a model for the shows, announce the new camera with much fanfare, and take forever to put it in the marketplace. BIG DEAL.

pixelpruner · 06-19-2007, 09:59 AM

I just hope the K?D is chuffing sweet so all my friends that have Canons and Nikons (who hadn't heard of Pentax till I got mine!!!) can stop saying the K10D is a fluke!

kenyee · 06-19-2007, 10:39 AM

Originally posted by benjikan

The more you observe the more you speculate and the more you speculate the more you experiment and the more you experiment the more you learn..Wow, we kind of came full circle.

LOL. Very true. That's why I decided a month ago to follow the ways of the strobist and learn manual lighting/flashes instead of getting a single Pentax 540 flash run on auto. Thanks for the extra pics for that shoot...just admit it, you photoshopped the lightning in..there's no way models would subject themselves to the risk of getting electrocuted ;-)

DigiFilm · 06-21-2007, 08:05 AM

Originally posted by borno

How about something crazy like a body that takes replaceable sensors one b&w , one high res , one for low noise and maybe a film back, I can dream can't I

add IR to that!

fwbigd · 06-28-2007, 11:23 AM

Below is your own prediction posted on Pentax Life back in the Mar 2007 time frame. Do you still believe it holds true today?
"The standard base level Pentax will be 12 mega pixels. It will have a range of 100 to 3200 iso and will have built in SR, sensor cleaning and image view as well as other novel features like high speed bluetooth and infra red tether support. The net step up will be the equivalent of the K10D and will have a native resolution of 12.8 mega pixels on a 1.25 ratio sensor. It will have a range of 50-6400 iso and will feature a new highly evolved SR system that will allow for a true 4 stops of shake reduction as well as Pan SR. It will also have an improved sensor cleaning system as well as high speed Bluetooth capability and infra red tether support. It will shoot at 6 fps and be able to shoot a full 2 gig card without needing to re-buffer. It will allow up to 30 Raw images to be shot in rapid fire."

benjikan · 06-30-2007, 12:58 PM

Originally posted by pixelpruner

I just hope the K?D is chuffing sweet so all my friends that have Canons and Nikons (who hadn't heard of Pentax till I got mine!!!) can stop saying the K10D is a fluke!

Do your friends honestly believe that the K10D was a fluke. The amount of R&D that went in to developing that camera is staggering. There is nothing haphazard about the design of the the K10D. I believe that what the K10D does do is set a precedent or benchmark that Pentax themselves will use to judge all of their future products in that range.

Ben

VeijoM · 07-08-2007, 08:32 AM

Hope:

A DSLR with compatibility with existing lenses but having format of 645 and 16+ megapixels. The sensor would be exclusively bought from Foveon using three layer techique. The screen would be foldable with live view and possibility to shoot "from hip" with Hasselblad style. This would be camera for studio and landscape work. Sorry, no sports car for me.

Reality:

Pentax professional users won't get as much megapixels as competition and so it is between 12-16, more likely exactly 12 megapixels. Better layout of knobs&buttons and more robust look to appeal "professionals". Nothing fancy, just some minor improvements over K10D. And ofcourse the vertical grip is not detachable being integral part of the camera.

-Veijo-

RMabo · 08-22-2007, 07:15 AM

Ok, so may I have a go on this... Let's see...

12-16Mp CMOS with hardware noise-reduction. APS-C size.
22 bit A/D with 16 bit RAW output.
ISO 100 - 1600 by default, with 3200 and 6400 available as options. (turned on Custom menu)
5-6 bps
30 - 1/8000 sec long-life shutter (140 000 exposures)
1/250 standard flash sync, high speed sync up to 1/8000 sec.
SD slot
20 zone multisegment metering that reads colour tones too.
11 AF points with enhanced sensitivity for the center point.
Improved AF tracking and prediction, and AF continous speed.
Live view
3" LCD, from Samsung.
Program lines in Fn menu.
Prime II digital processing unit, allows for in-camera correction for vignetting, distorsion and CA for JPEG's. (only works with Pentax own lenses). For RAW, this works with the new PhotoLab 4 software, much more automatic and clever than the current options.
3 USER modes.
JPEG engine with improved algorithms.
Tweakability of the exposure meter bias: Normal - High - Low. (Normal - as today, High - exposes after the highlights, Low - expose after the shadows).
Magnesium alloy body with the same weather sealing as today.
Improved SR with more reliability, gives 4.5 EV stop shake reduction.
Price 1 400 EUR.

I also predicts that Pentax will release optical SR in new DA Star 400 f/5.6 ED SDM, DA Star 600 f/5.6 ED and DA Star 135 - 400 f/5.6 ED SDM.
The Optical SR system gives a stabilized viewfinder image in the viewfinder, helping composition with those ultra-teles. When an OSR lens is mounted on the camera, the built-in SR system in the camera will be turned off.

Take care
R

regken · 08-22-2007, 07:53 AM

Originally posted by RMabo

Ok, so may I have a go on this... Let's see...

Price 1 400 EUR.

I also predicts that Pentax will release optical SR in new DA Star 400 f/5.6 ED SDM, DA Star 600 f/5.6 ED and DA Star 135 - 400 f/5.6 ED SDM.
The Optical SR system gives a stabilized viewfinder image in the viewfinder, helping composition with those ultra-teles. When an OSR lens is mounted on the camera, the built-in SR system in the camera will be turned off.

Take care
R

Roland,
You have a history of being fairly accurate on your predictions so I hope you are on target once again. I think your price is to high. About $100 less than the Canon 40D would seem more reasonable.

Regards,

Ken

Matjazz · 08-22-2007, 07:54 AM

Pentax in lens stabilisation will never happen. If memory serves me right Pentax has patented something that might be a stabilised viewfinder. As for LCD I hope that it doesn't get as big as on EOS 40D because buttons are more important (at least to me they are)

06-18-2007, 03:10 AM	#63
benjikan Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Paris, France Photos: Gallery Posts: 4,308 Original Poster	Shadow Originally posted by kenyee Ben: How did you do the lighting on that? The shadows don't match. It's almost like the white sphere was grafted on afterwards because I don't see a shadow from a snoot. The shadow to the left of her right leg doesn't look like anything in the scene. The light color on the top and around her legs don't match although I guess you could have snooted/gridded both, but that doesn't explain the weird shadow to the left of her right leg. And her right leg is moving from the blur, which is an odd thing to see too. Look at the neck shadow..What do you see to the left of it? Why do you assume I used a "Snoot"? I didn't use a snoot...All of the shadows are what was seen during the actual shooting. What was there was there...Really. Ah..Isn't photography magical. PS..and I MEAN THIS; "You Really Have to Learn to "F" with Light!!!!" Benji Last edited by benjikan; 02-07-2013 at 06:03 PM.

06-19-2007, 08:34 AM	#65
benjikan Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Paris, France Photos: Gallery Posts: 4,308 Original Poster	Not to Worry Originally posted by kenyee I assumed a snoot because of the rectangular patch on the wall. Ok...from the other pic, it looks like those are some sort of spherical light fixtures (although I have no idea how you got that lightning effect unless you photoshopped it in :-). For the original picture, I would guess: - one softbox or something w/ a light modifier close to the light fixtures, but above her head and to the right of her (to her left) - a halogen desk lamp or some other tungsten source far right and shining left (that weird shadow is the shadow from her rear end lit by this light) What I still don't get is the halo around her head in that first picture. It's like there's another light but I can't figure out where it's coming from... :-) The more you observe the more you speculate and the more you speculate the more you experiment and the more you experiment the more you learn..Wow, we kind of came full circle. Last edited by benjikan; 02-07-2013 at 06:03 PM.

06-19-2007, 09:31 AM	#66
SGT Inactive Account Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: USA Posts: 47	Meaningless Originally posted by benjikan Look..Pentax are not riding on their laurels. Pentax is not the same company you knew two years ago. For that matter, Pentax may just pull out all the stops for the next up and coming shows in the Fall of 2007..I'm pretty confident of that... Pull out all of the stops, produce a model for the shows, announce the new camera with much fanfare, and take forever to put it in the marketplace. BIG DEAL.

06-28-2007, 11:23 AM	#70
fwbigd Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Fort Worth TX Posts: 339	When there is a K?D what will it be like Below is your own prediction posted on Pentax Life back in the Mar 2007 time frame. Do you still believe it holds true today? "The standard base level Pentax will be 12 mega pixels. It will have a range of 100 to 3200 iso and will have built in SR, sensor cleaning and image view as well as other novel features like high speed bluetooth and infra red tether support. The net step up will be the equivalent of the K10D and will have a native resolution of 12.8 mega pixels on a 1.25 ratio sensor. It will have a range of 50-6400 iso and will feature a new highly evolved SR system that will allow for a true 4 stops of shake reduction as well as Pan SR. It will also have an improved sensor cleaning system as well as high speed Bluetooth capability and infra red tether support. It will shoot at 6 fps and be able to shoot a full 2 gig card without needing to re-buffer. It will allow up to 30 Raw images to be shot in rapid fire."

06-30-2007, 12:58 PM	#71
benjikan Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Paris, France Photos: Gallery Posts: 4,308 Original Poster	A Fluke? Originally posted by pixelpruner I just hope the K?D is chuffing sweet so all my friends that have Canons and Nikons (who hadn't heard of Pentax till I got mine!!!) can stop saying the K10D is a fluke! Do your friends honestly believe that the K10D was a fluke. The amount of R&D that went in to developing that camera is staggering. There is nothing haphazard about the design of the the K10D. I believe that what the K10D does do is set a precedent or benchmark that Pentax themselves will use to judge all of their future products in that range. Ben

06-17-2007, 06:55 PM	#61
kenyee Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Boston, PRofMA Photos: Albums Posts: 3,026	Ben: How did you do the lighting on that? The shadows don't match. It's almost like the white sphere was grafted on afterwards because I don't see a shadow from a snoot. The shadow to the left of her right leg doesn't look like anything in the scene. The light color on the top and around her legs don't match although I guess you could have snooted/gridded both, but that doesn't explain the weird shadow to the left of her right leg. And her right leg is moving from the blur, which is an odd thing to see too.

06-17-2007, 06:59 PM	#62
davemdsn Inactive Account Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Boise, Idaho Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 1,413	Originally posted by benjikan If this is not taken by a pro-camera..Well you tell me I've said it before and this photo says it again - cameras are not professional, people are professional. The camera is only the tool and it is obvious in the hands of someone like Ben that this camera can meet the needs of a true pro. People forget that professional photography existed, even flourished, long before digital. For that matter, even sports photography existed back when the photographer had to not only focus the lens manually, he had to wind the film with his thumb. New technology may make life easier, but great photos are still taken by people, not cameras.

06-18-2007, 06:30 AM	#64
kenyee Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Boston, PRofMA Photos: Albums Posts: 3,026	Originally posted by benjikan Look at the neck shadow..What do you see to the left of it? Why do you assume I used a "Snoot"? I assumed a snoot because of the rectangular patch on the wall. Ok...from the other pic, it looks like those are some sort of spherical light fixtures (although I have no idea how you got that lightning effect unless you photoshopped it in :-). For the original picture, I would guess: - one softbox or something w/ a light modifier close to the light fixtures, but above her head and to the right of her (to her left) - a halogen desk lamp or some other tungsten source far right and shining left (that weird shadow is the shadow from her rear end lit by this light) What I still don't get is the halo around her head in that first picture. It's like there's another light but I can't figure out where it's coming from... :-)

06-19-2007, 09:59 AM	#67
pixelpruner Inactive Account Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Leeds, NE UK Posts: 220	I just hope the K?D is chuffing sweet so all my friends that have Canons and Nikons (who hadn't heard of Pentax till I got mine!!!) can stop saying the K10D is a fluke!

06-19-2007, 10:39 AM	#68
kenyee Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Boston, PRofMA Photos: Albums Posts: 3,026	Originally posted by benjikan The more you observe the more you speculate and the more you speculate the more you experiment and the more you experiment the more you learn..Wow, we kind of came full circle. LOL. Very true. That's why I decided a month ago to follow the ways of the strobist and learn manual lighting/flashes instead of getting a single Pentax 540 flash run on auto. Thanks for the extra pics for that shoot...just admit it, you photoshopped the lightning in..there's no way models would subject themselves to the risk of getting electrocuted ;-)

06-21-2007, 08:05 AM	#69
DigiFilm Forum Member Join Date: May 2007 Location: San Antonio, Texas Photos: Gallery Posts: 59	Originally posted by borno How about something crazy like a body that takes replaceable sensors one b&w , one high res , one for low noise and maybe a film back, I can dream can't I add IR to that!

07-08-2007, 08:32 AM	#72
VeijoM Inactive Account Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Helsinki, Finland Posts: 21	My hope and my guess Hope: A DSLR with compatibility with existing lenses but having format of 645 and 16+ megapixels. The sensor would be exclusively bought from Foveon using three layer techique. The screen would be foldable with live view and possibility to shoot "from hip" with Hasselblad style. This would be camera for studio and landscape work. Sorry, no sports car for me. Reality: Pentax professional users won't get as much megapixels as competition and so it is between 12-16, more likely exactly 12 megapixels. Better layout of knobs&buttons and more robust look to appeal "professionals". Nothing fancy, just some minor improvements over K10D. And ofcourse the vertical grip is not detachable being integral part of the camera. -Veijo-

08-22-2007, 07:15 AM	#73
RMabo Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Sweden Posts: 845	Ok, so may I have a go on this... Let's see... 12-16Mp CMOS with hardware noise-reduction. APS-C size. 22 bit A/D with 16 bit RAW output. ISO 100 - 1600 by default, with 3200 and 6400 available as options. (turned on Custom menu) 5-6 bps 30 - 1/8000 sec long-life shutter (140 000 exposures) 1/250 standard flash sync, high speed sync up to 1/8000 sec. SD slot 20 zone multisegment metering that reads colour tones too. 11 AF points with enhanced sensitivity for the center point. Improved AF tracking and prediction, and AF continous speed. Live view 3" LCD, from Samsung. Program lines in Fn menu. Prime II digital processing unit, allows for in-camera correction for vignetting, distorsion and CA for JPEG's. (only works with Pentax own lenses). For RAW, this works with the new PhotoLab 4 software, much more automatic and clever than the current options. 3 USER modes. JPEG engine with improved algorithms. Tweakability of the exposure meter bias: Normal - High - Low. (Normal - as today, High - exposes after the highlights, Low - expose after the shadows). Magnesium alloy body with the same weather sealing as today. Improved SR with more reliability, gives 4.5 EV stop shake reduction. Price 1 400 EUR. I also predicts that Pentax will release optical SR in new DA Star 400 f/5.6 ED SDM, DA Star 600 f/5.6 ED and DA Star 135 - 400 f/5.6 ED SDM. The Optical SR system gives a stabilized viewfinder image in the viewfinder, helping composition with those ultra-teles. When an OSR lens is mounted on the camera, the built-in SR system in the camera will be turned off. Take care R

08-22-2007, 07:53 AM	#74
regken Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Bangor, Maine Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,377	Originally posted by RMabo Ok, so may I have a go on this... Let's see... Price 1 400 EUR. I also predicts that Pentax will release optical SR in new DA Star 400 f/5.6 ED SDM, DA Star 600 f/5.6 ED and DA Star 135 - 400 f/5.6 ED SDM. The Optical SR system gives a stabilized viewfinder image in the viewfinder, helping composition with those ultra-teles. When an OSR lens is mounted on the camera, the built-in SR system in the camera will be turned off. Take care R Roland, You have a history of being fairly accurate on your predictions so I hope you are on target once again. I think your price is to high. About $100 less than the Canon 40D would seem more reasonable. Regards, Ken

08-22-2007, 07:54 AM	#75
Matjazz Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: EU/Slovenia Photos: Gallery Posts: 774	Pentax in lens stabilisation will never happen. If memory serves me right Pentax has patented something that might be a stabilised viewfinder. As for LCD I hope that it doesn't get as big as on EOS 40D because buttons are more important (at least to me they are)