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10-19-2011, 01:28 PM   #241
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QuoteOriginally posted by rawr Quote
Good results with the flash - what settings did you mainly use?
Mostly -1 to -1.7 stops flash compensation - forced/mandatory flash
I also had to adjust overall exposure compensation as the K-x flash TTL automation is a bit "dumb" -
things like white/light colored shirts in the center of picture, or light spots/reflections in glass etc anywhere in the picture would often cause under exposure
- so I may have to use up to +2/3 stop overall exp comp to allow for that.

I think most of the shots were using Tv setting with ISO400 and 1/6sec shutter speed.

Some were on P and AutoISO (which inevitably were on ISO5000) like this one:

Interesting that when flash is used there is also a flash metering segment section in PhotoMe:

Regular AE metering segments -


Flash metering segments -


or Sv with ISO400 (shutter speed set by K-x to 1/15sec
or if I set slow-sync flash then the shutter speed would have been >2secs!
- that's why I ended up using Tv at 1/6sec)
All on-board built in flash as-is (didn't even use any diffusers I carried)


QuoteOriginally posted by rawr Quote
But ugh, the stage floor in your last photo sure needs a clean. One of the disadvantages of flash is that it reveals too much sometimes.
ha-ha! agreed - but it wasn't just the flash that emphasized the floor -
it was revealed because the main stage lighting (blue gel) was centered there -
look at the first large pp shot which did not use flash......


Last edited by UnknownVT; 10-19-2011 at 04:24 PM.
10-20-2011, 10:55 AM   #242
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QuoteOriginally posted by UnknownVT Quote
I was not very happy with reviewing the shots last night, and because of the lack of light and color balance I ended up having to use flash - as I mentioned I have not got that down on the K-x, like I had on my broken compact - so I was still learning as I was shooting.....

But surprisingly, when I looked at the shots on my PC - I was actually quite impressed with the results.....
so perhaps I have gained just adequate proficiency on K-x flash
Maybe I have spoken too soon - last night -

This has I guess always been a somewhat difficult venue - due to the use of two red and a blue colored floodlight bulbs for the stage lighting - but over the years I have got used to it using my compact with low slow-sync fill-flash - seems to overcome the colored wash - the above was on the K-x no flash - BUT I had to use tungsten balance whereas my old compacts - (Canon S70, S80 and G10) can do this shot on just AWB.

Canon G10 AWB


Anyway the point is unless I used flash all my shots would come out red.....
so just when I thought I have more confidence in K-x flash usage -
again I was mostly not particularly happy with the shots as I reviewed them -
but nonetheless - this one came out -

EXIF attached

AE Metering segments -


Flash metering segments -


Original no retouch - rotated on side to correspond to metering segment display -

My K-x flash shots were almost all underexposed like this one - some worse.

Last edited by UnknownVT; 10-20-2011 at 11:30 AM.
10-21-2011, 05:06 PM   #243
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Only two gigs last night - but I thought particularly successful -
one of my favorite (bigger) venues where there was all the LED color washes and strobing lights last week -
it was back to sanity last night - could be because it was the regular light person.....

she actually broke a string - so was holding her guitar to the side giving this interesting pose.......


mono LED lighting can be effective -
as long as it is not just a wash.....






decided I liked this shot may post a larger version......

series:






few seconds before the first shot -


what's a Thursday without the dark jazz club?
well, it' even better when it was the celebration of Russell Gunn's 40th b'day - the place was packed -
but when I got there -
there was a single solitary seat right up front just right of center -
which I vacated several times so that paying customers can sit there -
but every time I looked, it stayed empty.......


not my bestest shot - but hey! it was the guy's 40th birthday.......


crowded and dark.....


crowded even on stage........


he's wearing a hat again - and boy did I have work hard in pp for this shot (white balance with PDCU - then pp in PhotoImpact).- EXIF attached -

AE metering segments -

again this was clearly below metering limit of the K-x (with 50-200 zoom) the lower segment readings are very suspect - it is obvious to me that the lower part of the picture is NOT brighter.








not so great composition -
but it seems to work......








almost silhouette shot that got brought up in pp...


on and off stage playing......
10-22-2011, 07:41 AM   #244
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Here's the challenge -
what happens when the leader/feature member is in the darkest part of the stage -
the part that causes me the most problems week after week -
and there are music stands on stage?

Scene setter -


Face in shade -











Last edited by UnknownVT; 10-22-2011 at 07:49 AM.
10-23-2011, 11:45 PM   #245
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Little 5 Points Halloween Parade -

look at the shadows - mostly shots against/into the light......


that's quite attractive -
but the real highlight this year (for me) was -

I thought this was good - until I saw this other shot by another photographer -
I am very envious......(and the other photographer in that picture) -
I was taking - this -


then this -



I took lots of shots - link to first shot of 21









There was also music -

Pelvis Breastlies (deserves attention - just for their name alone...) -




Bareknuckle Betties (another name to conjure with)






nearly 6 hours there on my feet -
then on to dark jazz club (where at least I could sit) -
rehearsal -


it's his band -






my Kryptonite nemesis is wearing hats again - in the darkest part of the stage then the hat peak puts face in shadow
- like swimming uphill against the current


AE metering segments -

However the readings for the lower half segments are very suspect - I cannot believe the bottom of the picture can possibly be +2.5LV - this shot was definitely below the metering limits of the K-x (with 50-200 zoom - bottom status line flashing in viewfinder)



compare with
AE metering segments (with 18-55 zoom) -
10-28-2011, 12:33 PM   #246
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It was exceptionally dark last night at the jazz venue -
this may not convey how dark it was -

ISO5000; f/3.5; 1/13; -1.7EV comp; 18mm
"normalized" to account for the -1.7EV comp -
this would have been a 1/4 sec exposure.....
(that's regular night street lighting out of the windows)

Here's the AE metering segments:


One of my earlier shots -

ISO5000; f/3.5; 1/30; -1EV comp; 18mm
"normalized" to account for the -1EV comp -
this would be a 1/15sec exposure

Everything other than stage center looks very dark because of the white T-shirt and he was standing in the spot light/brightest part of the stage.

AE metering segments -


Then he moved the mic off to the side out of the bright spot....

ISO5000; f/3.5; 1/6; -0.7EV comp; 18mm
"normalized" for the -0.7EV comp -
this would be a 1/4sec exposure -
note that's the same LV/overall exposure as the first shot I posted above

AE metering segments


Most of my shots were with the mic off to the side out of the main bright spot light:

hat in the shade...


use of the stronger back lighting....



so one can imagine what off stage was like:

ISO5000; f/3.5; 1/6; -0.7EV comp; 18mm
"normalized" = 1/4 sec exposure
that's a cell phone light on the middle trumpeter's lap.

AE metering segments -

again this was definitely below the metering limit of the K-x with 18-55 zoom so some of this may be at error like I found with the 50-200 zoom - which reaches the metering limit sooner......

Anyway - my shot of the night from the darkest part of the stage -
but it could be just because it turned out better than I had any right to expect -

EXIF is still attached

AE segments -


10-29-2011, 09:53 PM   #247
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These jazz shots have turned out very well, especially those where you have had to go down to 1/6 sec. You are a very brave shooter.

Also I'm gonna have to look up those girl bands you shot in the Halloween Parade - the Bareknuckle Betties and Pelvis Breastlies. They look great fun.
10-29-2011, 11:57 PM   #248
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QuoteOriginally posted by rawr Quote
These jazz shots have turned out very well, especially those where you have had to go down to 1/6 sec. You are a very brave shooter.
Not really - with that kind of darkness one expects a number of not so successful shots -
so the trick is not to let the conditions/lack of light intimidate/inhibit photography -
with practice comes improvement
and recognition of when there may be a better chance of success.

In film days this would have been expensive -
but with digital it is really only a usage of time/effort.

QuoteOriginally posted by rawr Quote
Also I'm gonna have to look up those girl bands you shot in the Halloween Parade - the Bareknuckle Betties and Pelvis Breastlies. They look great fun.
BareKnuckle Betties

The Pelvis Breastlies | The All Female Elvis Presley Tribute Band

10-30-2011, 09:02 PM   #249
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Interesting musical stuff this weekend - mostly Halloween themed -

Friday night several acts at a single venue -
LED stage lighting - with a lot of magenta -

this has -1.3 stop comp fill-flash supplementing my usual "P" setting
ISO2500; f/4; 1/25; 18mm; -1.3 stop flash comp

No flash - as-is on next 2 shots




The featured singer with the main band I only knew as Molly - taken photos of her before -



all her shots were in red LED light with a touch of blue -
almost impossible to get nice clear photo because of the overwhelming colored wash.

Had to use PDCU and grey point selection to remove the color cast -
work on the "neutral" photo
the re-add red and touch of magenta to get them back to what they looked like.
For details see Post #125 in Modern LED Stage Lighting & photography problems ( 1 2 3 ... Last Page)
Turns out she is Molly Harvey of the Residents.

Both shots have EXIF attached - the thumbnails show the photos AFTER I had stripped the red/magenta color.

Saturday - Halloween party -


This is Swami - who is also a well known artist - he's doing some of the current official Furthur tour posters -
(that's the Grateful Dead's Phil Lesh and Bob Weir band)

This was fluorescent yellow paint under UV lighting -
I am not too sure if there was such prominent red -
but when I did an auto level in Ulead PhotoImpact 8 the red was revealed.
Even then I had to save it from PhotoShop Elements 7 using lower compression to preserve the colors.


The stage lighting was a simple projector light with a rotating patterned/colored disc in front of it -
so the pattern would go on not only the back drop (a white painted trampoline) - but the artists as well -
so I had to wait for the right gap in the rotating patterns/colors to take photos.

Last stop Saturday night -

very magenta and blue..... I didn't strip the colors using PDCU - but reduced saturation and added green.
Might not seem quite as effective as the PDCU strip technique but this actually turned out better to my eyes -
for details see Post #125 in Modern LED Stage Lighting & photography problems ( 1 2 3 ... Last Page)


pretty obvious flash supplemented shot -
but for some reason this almost looks 3-D to me.

Thought this shot came out particularly well -

as-is - with very little pp


Last edited by UnknownVT; 10-31-2011 at 11:51 AM.
11-04-2011, 05:45 AM   #250
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I'm a doula and use my kx for birth photography. Here are a few. I couldn't find any without processing, but thought I'd share a couple anyhow. I'm pretty sure each is taken with an old manual 50mm 1.2 Many of my pictures are shot in complete darkness- with only the light of Christmas lights that I bring to each birth. I really appreciate the KX in those situations.
Camera settings:
Focal length 50mm, Aperture: 1.4, Exposure: 1/125, ISO 400, No Flash, Used available light from medical spot light


Focal Length 50mm, Aperture: 1.4, Exposure:1/800, ISO 400, No Flash-Used available light from medical heat lamp


Focal Length:50mm, Aperture 1.4, Exposure 1/30, ISO 1600, No Flash, no available medical spot light


Focal length: 50mm, Aperture: not listed, Exposure 1/25, ISO 800, No Flash, Used available back light from kitchen.


I am missing the original of this photo, and need to find the back-up, it won't give me the info based on the file I have online.

Last edited by therevslady; 11-16-2011 at 02:30 PM.
11-04-2011, 12:25 PM   #251
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QuoteOriginally posted by therevslady Quote
I'm a doula and use my kx for birth photography. Here are a few. I couldn't find any without processing, but thought I'd share a couple anyhow. I'm pretty sure each is taken with an old manual 50mm 1.2 Many of my pictures are shot in complete darkness- with only the light of Christmas lights that I bring to each birth. I really appreciate the KX in those situations.
Good stuff - I particularly liked the last sepia toned shot -
are these all available light shots (no flash)?

If so, it'd be great if you could please give us the exposure settings -
sensitivity ISO, aperture f-stop, shutter speed, and focal length of lens.

So that was a f/1.2 lens (or did you mean f/2.0 - which is shown sometimes as 1:2)?

If you have kept your originals then showing the properties (Windows) would give a simple view of the EXIF information -
or better yet get PhotoME - Exif, IPTC & ICC Metadata Editor this is a very, very good program to see information about a shot.

Like the other poster in your introduction thread I also had to look up Doula - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia.
Nice profession - and great use of the K-x.
11-04-2011, 08:58 PM   #252
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Oh man. That is so much work :P Hahaha- I'll see if I can figure out how to do that in between managing my three children, homeschooling, and work. Lol. I should know those things though- it's important.

One thing I do know: there was no flash at all. I do not do flash photography on baby day. Ever.
11-06-2011, 10:44 AM   #253
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QuoteOriginally posted by therevslady Quote
Oh man. That is so much work :P Hahaha- I'll see if I can figure out how to do that in between managing my three children, homeschooling, and work. Lol. I should know those things though- it's important.

One thing I do know: there was no flash at all. I do not do flash photography on baby day. Ever.
Nope, you have clearly demonstrated it is not important to have to know the technical details or do that work to take and show good photos.

However just to encourage you -
it is almost no effort to download PhotoME - Exif, IPTC & ICC Metadata Editor
and open your original photo(s) with it to see all that detail
(or even easier - right click on your original photo and choose the PhotoMe option)
each of the fields can be copied and pasted in your post.

Even without PhotoMe - just right click on the original photo and choose Properties, click on summary tab and if necessary click on the Advanced >> button

I asked because you appear to be taking photos under really low lighting conditions, so was very interested in the exposure settings so I could determine the light levels.

PhotoMe can show the actual LV (light value) of each AE Metering segment, like this:

Manufacturer's notes > AE Metering Segments > (click on) <Graphic> link
it's easier to do just a Find on "AE me".

see Post #235 by rawr for details.

Last edited by UnknownVT; 11-06-2011 at 10:50 AM.
11-07-2011, 12:12 AM   #254
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The current way I cope with strong color lighting from LEDs or even gel incandescent is to use supplemental fill-flash.

I had this down pretty well with my compacts - but the Canon G10 is now broken - so I had been using the K-x - where my flash shots are a bit hit and miss.

Friday Nov/4 - Unknown Hinson (where I appropriated my moniker)
strong LED lighting only

ISO5000; f/3.5; 1/13; 18mm - NO flash
I was very pleasantly surprised that the lights although LEDs only, and often would be strong colored washes,
would occasionally have only slightly tinted white on the main performer.

When there was strong colored washes I'd use supplemental fill-flash (built-in) at -1 to -1.7 stops flash compensation

ISO5000; f/5.6; 1/20; 21mm; -1 stop Flash compensation


ISO5000; f/5.6; 1/20; 24mm; -1 stop Flash comp.


ISO5000; f/4; 1/20; 23mm; -1 stop Flash comp.

Note these were all at ISO5000 despite the flash - that was because I was using "P" setting with AutoISO 200-5000 - the light levels were low enough for the K-x to select ISO5000.

Contrast those shots with Saturday Nov/5 -

Tv Mode; ISO400; f/3.5; 1/6; 18mm; -1.3 stops Flash comp.
-1.3 Flash comp seems to be about optimal for this kind of a overview stage shot.
I know -1 flash comp seemed just too strong; -1.7 flash comp the colored light overwhelm the flash - which is self-defeating - as I am using the flash as supplemental white light.

Whereas closer to stage for individual shots, I found -1 stop was better due to the strong color lights.


Tv Mode; ISO400; f/4; 1/6; 24mm; -1 stop Flash comp -
this shot was underexposed due to the hi-reflective finger guard on the bass.
I really like this shot.


Tv Mode; ISO400; f/4; 1/6; 23mm; -1.3 stops Flash comp.
this would have been better with -1 stop Flash comp
That's Oliver Wood - when he's not with the Wood Brothers.


Tv Mode; ISO400; f/4; 1/6; 21mm; -1 stop Flash comp.

In this venue the lights were gel incandescent - amber, red and blue - so it is difficult to shoot available light - I have been shooting this venue with flash for years - always low supplemental fill-flash coupled with slow shutter speeds (about 1/5 sec) - with the K-x I tried to emulate that - using Tv mode, setting fixed ISO400; shutter speed at 1/6 sec - this would mean underexposed shots without flash - and flash even at -1 to -1.3 stops comp would have more prominence in the exposure. Although the majority of my shots were dark/underexposed - they ended up looking pretty good, only needing little pp - I was pleasantly surprised with my results - so perhaps I maybe starting to get the hang of the K-x flash.....

Last edited by UnknownVT; 11-07-2011 at 11:29 AM.
11-11-2011, 12:48 PM   #255
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Thursday -
no explanation needed......


















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