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12-15-2009, 09:10 PM   #1
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Negotiating Camera Adjustment With Pentax Service Center

Hello,

Months ago I posted that I was an unhappy K10-D owner. My pictures were terrible. Forum members asked for sample pictures, but I did not respond. History: All my pictures were underexposed and off-focus using the kit lenses 18-55 and 50-200 mm. I learned to compensate for exposure, but felt uncomfortable with a camera that needed compensation for proper exposure. The picture sharpness was a problem I thought could also be corrected by some camera adjustment. I became despondent, put the camera away and did not touch it for over a year. Picking it up again, I struggled to figure out what I could be doing wrong (this is when I posted). After all, after spending $$ to upgrade to a DSLR, I expected superior pictures. So my camera was out of warranty before I finally had a friendly local pro borrow it for his opinion. He showed me the pictures he took and comparison pictures he took with his DSLR camera. All K10-D pictures were soft in comparison to identical pictures taken with his camera. He thought my camera was at fault and not the lenses and suggested I return them all to Pentax Service. I did so and was hit with a large estimate for "Auto Focusing Adjustment". I refused to pay and was asked to call Pentax Corporate. I called and a customer service representative called back. Without me saying anything, he offered a large discount. I refused to pay again saying that even though my camera was out of warranty, this camera had never worked correctly. I said nothing was broken and the camera was like new. He did not disagree. I said that Pentax had an obligation to its customers to sell cameras that functioned properly and that this one did not. Regardless of the term of the warranty, nothing in this camera was broken and Pentax could not afford to have a poorly performing camera out in the marketplace. I said his company's name and reputation depended on a good product and good will with it's customers. He said he would move my particular situation up the ladder and get back to me.

Question: How would others handle this problem?

12-15-2009, 09:25 PM   #2
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Fault is shared between the parties.

Some fault (possibly, if in fact the camera is adjudged defective) falls to the manufacturer, for releasing a (possibly) faulty item; some fault falls to the purchaser, for allowing the warranty to lapse.

The object of the process of negotiation and, if necessary, adjudication, is to assign the weights of liability for fault and arrive at a just and fair sharing of the cost of defeasing the liabilities.

You are handling the situation precisely as you should, so long as you are willing to accept an agreeable portion of the cost of repair, since you did, in fact, allow the warranty to lapse (none of it is an acceptable number, but you must accept the consequence of "none," which is pursuit of a remedy in court).
12-15-2009, 09:28 PM   #3
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Thread moved to the correct forum.

Great post, though- I hope Pentax acts in your favor and fixes the camera up for you!

Adam
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12-15-2009, 09:46 PM   #4
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I share similar sentiment as Monochrome. I would have tried to figure out if it's possible that the camera is having some issues. If it seems likely, I would send it to Pentax before the warranty expired. This would give me some leverages and justly expect Pentax be held responsible for fixing the camera in full. As of now, you are on the losing side. A company could not possibly just fix every single returned out of warranty product simply because the consumer claims that the product was defective since the beginning. That would be noneconomical for the company, affecting its bottom line, and ultimately its products.

I would think your best bet is to try to get as much discount on the fix as possible. If the amount is still too much, it might be more economical to purchase a used/new camera.

12-15-2009, 09:47 PM   #5
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Also, I'm not sure if the Auto Focus Adjustment would fix your underexposure issue. Since you have soft focusing issue with both lenses, perhaps you could access the debug menu and adjust the autofocus yourself.
12-15-2009, 10:05 PM   #6
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QuoteOriginally posted by pentaxpup Quote
Also, I'm not sure if the Auto Focus Adjustment would fix your underexposure issue. Since you have soft focusing issue with both lenses, perhaps you could access the debug menu and adjust the autofocus yourself.
I didn't want to write this since it isn't germane to the question, but based upon readings here since March 2008 I EXPECT my K10D to underexpose; one must learn how too compensate exposure for each lens - especially M and prior lenses. I also know my K10D likely back focuses a small amount with my FA50/1.4 and the focus confirmation is useless for MF lenses - the focus area is too large to get really sharp focus where I want it - so I have to actually use my eye to focus.

I'm sympathetic to the OP's situation, but we all have SOME responsibility for the outcomes in our lives.

If I expected perfection in every transaction I ever made I would be one unhappy consumer. Rather, when my expectations aren't met, I negotiate to a point, accept a proposal when further negotiation doesn't seem to be a good use of time; and if the final resolution is unsatisfactory, I simply don't patronize that company any more.

I don't threaten. I don't slander to the media. I don't waste any more time.

I just don't ever buy ANYTHING from that company EVER again.
12-16-2009, 12:14 AM   #7
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While I am sympathetic to your cause, I must point out that Pentax is not entirely to blame here. No company can guarantee that 100% of their product would be free from defects; that's why these companies offer warranties. I'm surprised they're offing a discount at all. You suspected a faulty unit during this warranty period, so there was a chance to send it in for warranty service. Posting some pictures to the forum could possibly have allowed someone here to identify a softness issue (I emphasize possibly) back in September.

Before you go accusing me of being a fanboy, do note that I'm not happy with Pentax support at the moment as well. My Pentax K-7, which came back from repairs, had to immediately be returned because of a faulty sensor.

- Jason
12-16-2009, 10:12 PM   #8
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I'd say, it's not too late to post the pictures that lead you to suspect a camera problem. No point in suggesting a course of action until that matter is finally resolved.

12-17-2009, 09:15 AM   #9
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QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
I'm sympathetic to the OP's situation, but we all have SOME responsibility for the outcomes in our lives.
+1.
Get them as low as you can on the price of fixing this, and TAKE it. Your K10D is a great camera, and practically new. Worst case scenario is that you can sell it and defray much of the cost of the repair as well as getting some money back on the original investment. Digging in and refusing to meet them part of the way will result in a loss of money. Ask yourself if losing that much money is worth the principle. If it is, accept it and do not complain. Simply take responsibility for that choice. If it is not, then again, accept responsibility for your part in this, and move on.
BTW, while the camera is in for adjustment they will almost certainly upgrade the AF firmware, something that users do not have access to. My K10D came back from the free CLA with the new firmware and it is now very comparable to my K20D in many ways. Faster and more accurate really.
woof!
12-17-2009, 09:34 AM   #10
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I seem to recall the previous thread the OP started, and that it was at the time considered someone trolling because the OP refused to post examples.

I also agree that the OP is partially to blame for not going for service or at least contacting pentax prior to end of warranty to get the camera repaired. Pentax as we all know is not clairvoyant. They cannot know a camera is defective until you tell them. I have on occasion sent photos to pentax to illustrate problems (K10D exposure with manual lenses in my case) and this does 2 things, first, it is correspondance notifying them of a problem, with a date to illustrate when the problem was first noticed. This is important with respect to warranty. If the OP had done this simple step, the repair should be free.

THey are showing a considerable degree of goodwill by reducing their price for the repair, and you should be negotiating with them to get this price as low as possible.

with respect to poor image quality, exposure and focus accuracy, again no one can comment without seeing an image. Please post, and also send to pentax to insure they address ALL the problems.

With respect to exposure error, how many stops of compensation do you add?? is this a real issue or just your preference. Posting an unaltered photo with histogram is important here,
12-17-2009, 03:48 PM   #11
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You're lucky they're offering you a discount after you foolishly let your warranty expire.


Quit whining.
12-17-2009, 05:52 PM   #12
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QuoteOriginally posted by Lowell Goudge Quote
I seem to recall the previous thread the OP started, and that it was at the time considered someone trolling because the OP refused to post examples.
Previous thread I hate my K10D
12-17-2009, 07:41 PM   #13
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2 full days since the OP posted. I curious on his opinion/thought now. Hope he's not disappearing on us.
12-18-2009, 12:23 PM   #14
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Update

Thank you everyone, for your opinions.

No, I am not disappearing and do accept my responsibility for not acting within the term of my warranty. The cold truth is that I was ill (I have a damaged heart) and for almost one year did not care for much other than survival where my day to day existence was bleak. I just didn't care and couldn't be bothered with this camera and its failure to please me.

Feeling much better, I picked up the camera again and started sorting out it's problems. I figured out exposure compensation. Still, until a pro picked it up, I thought the focusing problem was me also.

Give me some time and I will send in a few pictures.
12-18-2009, 02:00 PM   #15
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Hey, sorry to hear about that. Hope you recover quickly and feel better soon. Once recovered, hope your camera issue sorted out and be able to continue shooting.
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