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01-26-2010, 01:48 PM   #31
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QuoteOriginally posted by keyser Quote
Jeans: if you're going to perform sex acts for money, at least make sure you get the money up front!
Couldn't be helped, he pulled the old Payroll Check scam. They're as good as money, he said. Oh well, live and learn.

01-26-2010, 01:53 PM   #32
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Here's how I'd put it:

The "crop factor" is of course very real phenomenon in an abstract sense: a lens *does* have a different FOV betweeen FF and APS-C. This is of no consequence whatsoever to people who don't shoot FF - the fact that the lens would have a different FOV on a camera you don't own simply has no relevance. But for someone who does work in both formats, it is an undeniable fact of life.

However, trying to *resolve* this through the use of conversion lenses seems a bit, well, odd. I mean, you could just as easily turn around and start using TC's on all your lenses for FF if you want them to have the same FOV between both formats. I suppose some do use TC's heavily, but most don't. Or, think for a moment about if you didn't have an APS-C camera - just the FF camera and an FA77. If you wanted a "normal" lens for your FF camera, would you think about getting a wide angle converter to use with the FA77, or would simply get a 50mm lens?

BTW, the tone of this discussion seems unnecessarily personal. I'd like to ask people to edit their responses and clean it up.
01-26-2010, 01:57 PM   #33
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Some of you have really tarded up this thread.

QuoteOriginally posted by Marc Sabatella Quote
The "crop factor" is of course very real phenomenon in an abstract sense: a lens *does* have a different FOV betweeen FF and APS-C.
Exactly.

Last edited by juu; 01-26-2010 at 02:17 PM.
01-26-2010, 02:11 PM   #34
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QuoteOriginally posted by Damn Brit Quote
Once you've had the camera for a while you'll realise that the crop factor discussion is a bit old and tired. If it doesn't get old and tired for you then you definitely need to get a FF camera.
To get a wider field of view you need a wider lens, it's as simple as that. I'm not sured what you mean characteristics of the 50mm f/1.4. If you mean the large aperture, you won't get that on a wider lens. Your only alternative is to take a few steps back to get a similar field of view as 50mm on a FF.

At the end of the day, it's only a problem if you let it be.
Yes I mainly mean wide aperture, though I do so prefer the smooth solid feeling of focusing this lens also. I do realize that I'm not going to find as wide an aperture on a wide angle lens. Thats kind of the reason for my inquiry. I appreciate the widely shared opinion that a converter lens is a poor fix, though I may want to try it out anyway. I just won't expect too much. I'm very accustomed to tradeoffs.

01-26-2010, 02:27 PM   #35
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Well, in that case go for it.

I have a word of warning though. If you want the wide aperture for the bokeh, it may not look that good. If you want the wide aperture for low light shooting, the wide angle converter may take up a stop of light (or more). Your f/1.4 may turn into a f/2 or f/2.8.

Either way, it doesn't hurt to try. You might just turn some peoples opinions around.
01-26-2010, 03:03 PM   #36
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QuoteOriginally posted by jeans Quote
I appreciate the widely shared opinion that a converter lens is a poor fix, though I may want to try it out anyway. I just won't expect too much. I'm very accustomed to tradeoffs.
If you don't mind me asking, how much photographic experience do you have?
You seem to be trying to fix a problem that doesn't exist except in your imagination. Without you offering any real world examples of what this problem is and how it affects you I just think you're making things harder for yourself than they need to be.
01-26-2010, 04:52 PM   #37
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QuoteOriginally posted by graphicgr8s Quote
What do you call the effect of the smaller sensor compared to a film frame.
I don't reference (often, anyway) outside of a format.
The focal length is what it is within the format that it is attached to.
In this instance, the OP has a 50mm lens. On the APS-C format, it is a short telephoto.
And Serge, we all pay for sex in one way or another.
01-26-2010, 06:40 PM   #38
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QuoteOriginally posted by Damn Brit Quote
If you don't mind me asking, how much photographic experience do you have?
You seem to be trying to fix a problem that doesn't exist except in your imagination. Without you offering any real world examples of what this problem is and how it affects you I just think you're making things harder for yourself than they need to be.
I think it's probably pretty clear that I don't have much. I have been more of a video guy. I owned a DVX100b for several years, but sold it recently when I realized I ended up wanting to take photos more often than videos and my point and shoot wasn't cutting it. So I thought it was time to try out a dslr that also shot video. I did some research and settled on the K-X. Then I bought the old 50mm 1.4 lens off ebay to take full advantage of the cameras low light capabilities as I tend to shoot things at night. It's just that I find the available field of view somewhat limiting, particularly indoors where standing back from a subject isn't always an option. I switch back to my stock lens often, but find it lacking in dim lighting. I may yet simply get a faster manual wide angle lens. I just had this thought and decided to ask about it. In doing so I seem to have committed some semantic fauxpas amidst my description.

So yes, I concede this problem is in my imagination. It's only a problem in relation to my own preferences and limitations as a person. Though I think the same could be said for any problem to some extent. I don't think I'm making anything too difficult for myself. I'm rather enjoying the camera and I'll enjoy seeing what else I can make it do.

01-26-2010, 07:15 PM   #39
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your best bang for the buck (without going used)

Sigma | W/A 28mm f/1.8 EX Aspherical DG DF Macro AF Lens

you may find a used one cheaper.

your other alternatives finding any one of the following lenses used

https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/pentax-slr-lens-discussion/34654-vivitar-...placement.html

unless you like barrel distortion.. then hold your course.
01-26-2010, 07:39 PM   #40
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QuoteOriginally posted by jeans Quote
I think it's probably pretty clear that I don't have much.\
Then, seriously, forget about the crop factor for now, it's above your pay grade.
Just enjoy getting used to the camera and taking photos.

Last edited by Damn Brit; 01-27-2010 at 02:39 AM.
01-26-2010, 09:18 PM   #41
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QuoteOriginally posted by Gooshin Quote
your best bang for the buck (without going used)

Sigma | W/A 28mm f/1.8 EX Aspherical DG DF Macro AF Lens

you may find a used one cheaper.

your other alternatives finding any one of the following lenses used

https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/pentax-slr-lens-discussion/34654-vivitar-...placement.html

unless you like barrel distortion.. then hold your course.

Thanks for the suggestions. I definitely don't mind going used. I'm kind of eying this Vivitar,
PENTAX K MOUNT VIVITAR 28mm 1:2 FAST LENS W/CAPS EXCELL - eBay (item 310196455549 end time Jan-30-10 21:41:06 PST)

I wouldn't say I like barrel distortion. I would say I don't mind it to a point.
01-26-2010, 10:05 PM   #42
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The point i was trying to drive home was that you have to understand what you are getting into. You have a tool and you have peripherals to expand that tools capability.

You'll have the occasional low budget elitist jump in and claim that the world can be had in the palm of your hand with a broken spotmatic and a 50mm lens... which is true, if your world occupies the confines of a mexican prison cell.

Trust me when i say that i understand what you are going through because in a way i too wanted the same things, wide to normal angle fields of view and thin depth of field.

trying to find budget solutions i ended up buying one of pentax's most prestiegous lenses, the FA31 (after hording something like 20 "low budget" lenses in total)

my chase to find what i want through sheer experimentation rather than tedious research has cost me quite a bit of cash... and what have i learned... better to buy the right tool the first time, even if the initial cost may seem high.

in fact, looking back, i could have outfitted myself with a D700 and 3-4 quality lenses for teh amount of money i spent with pentax.

because once you figure out what you want out of your photography, two or three lenses really DO get the job done.. and they get it done fantastically.

if money is tight, my suggestion is to SAVE and read these forums.

And if my initial post offended you, well.. tough luck, thats how i roll.
01-26-2010, 10:07 PM   #43
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QuoteOriginally posted by Gooshin Quote
And if my initial post offended you, well.. tough luck, thats how i roll.
I can vouch for that.


BTW, barrel distortion doesn't mean a gun that won't shoot straight.
01-27-2010, 12:05 AM   #44
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There are some things that you can't do without the right tools, but IMHO a fast 50 is the best tool you can have. If that makes me a low budget elitist (which is a contradiction in terms), well count me in that group.

Sure, it would be nice to have a better selection of lenses, but it wouldn't make me a better photographer. I prefer to spend longer composing shots with what I have rather then throw money at the problem.
01-27-2010, 05:19 AM   #45
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QuoteOriginally posted by Gooshin Quote
your best bang for the buck (without going used)
There you go...bringing up sex for money again.
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