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02-03-2010, 03:47 PM   #1
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Defective Camara or Battery Problem K200D??

Hi,

I have a K200D and have been using Energizer Lithium Ion batteries since I got it last year, and since I only used in temperate environments until now, need to ask for hellp. I took the camera to a Tamp Bay Lightening game and by the end of the second period the batteries would not work ( they were new at the start), and new batteries kept in the case wouldn't show any charge on the meter as well. Only after we brought it home and it warmed up, did the old batteries show again a full charge. thought maybe it was a fluke. I took the camera for St Augustine where it was about 50F with strong cold winds, and got three pictures before the same thing happened?? Any suggestions as to whether I need to take the camera in for repair, or is this a problem with the camera in 50F temperature, and is there a fix? Any help is appreciated - love my camera, but this is not good!!!

Marianne

02-03-2010, 04:21 PM   #2
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How old are the batteries? Mine will flip flop like that when the batteries are getting weak, though from your description they shouldn't be. I don't think the temperatures should be affecting it, I have used my k200d in anywhere from 10F to 100+F and never had a problem.

I'm assuming you mean 50 degrees fahrenheit? That doesn't seem very cold to me.
02-03-2010, 04:32 PM   #3
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Different camera, but I took my K100d to Yellowstone in late October just before the park closes. Temperatures ranged from 17f to 36f, and my lithium batteries were having the same problem you are describing. Maybe one or two photos, then dead. I could turn the camera off, wait a bit, turn it back on and then it would show a full charge. After a couple shots, dead again.

I bought alkalines from my hotel and they worked fine. When I got back into warmer climates on the way home I put the lithiums back in and they worked fine. In fact, I still have two sets of lithiums running my flash, that were used on that trip, and they are both working great. I attributed it to the batteries (energizers).

Have you tried alkalines to see how they perform? Is the performance of the camera fine now that you're back in a warmer area?

As the other post above me mentions, 50f is not cold at all. I have never had any issues above 32f with my k100d.
02-03-2010, 04:46 PM   #4
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The K200 and K100 and K100 super have always had this problem. In these temp. ranges. It is best to keep the battery's warm, and change them as often as needed. I have also tried using the camera with a gloved hand warmer on the hand that supports the battery compartment. In most cases it allowed the battery's to last a little longer, but not much.

02-03-2010, 05:20 PM   #5
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Weird, fresh! lithiums should not be giving up that fast.
Almost sounds like camera problem.

Chees, Mike.
02-03-2010, 05:40 PM   #6
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QuoteOriginally posted by ganarask Quote
I have a K200D and have been using Energizer Lithium Ion batteries
Any suggestions as to whether I need to take the camera in for repair, or is this a problem with the camera in 50F temperature, and is there a fix? Any help is appreciated - love my camera, but this is not good!!!
QuoteOriginally posted by matiki Quote
Different camera, but I took my K100d to Yellowstone in late October just before the park closes. Temperatures ranged from 17f to 36f, and my lithium batteries were having the same problem you are describing. Maybe one or two photos, then dead. I could turn the camera off, wait a bit, turn it back on and then it would show a full charge. After a couple shots, dead again.
I bought alkalines from my hotel and they worked fine. When I got back into warmer climates on the way home I put the lithiums back in and they worked fine.
This is very interesting and I am surprised-
because normally when it comes to extreme cold - Lithium are the batteries recommended.

AA Energizer Lithiums are spec'd to operate as low as -40degC or -40degF (note these are minus temperatures).

Whereas AA Alkalines go to as low as -18degC or 0degF.

Typical NiMH are spec'd to only 0degC or 32degF
(eneloops claim as low as -10degC or 14degF).

Don't know what to say - seems to me that the batteries ought to work in the "cold" -
but both your reports seem to contradict this.

EDIT to ADD -

I just thought of a way that may be able to determine whether it's the batteries or the camera.

First is relatively risk free - put the batteries (that work in normal temperatures) in the refrigerator - which is average 35-38degF - leave fo a good while at least an hour(?) - while keeping the camera in a nice warm environment.

The try to use the batteries, if the combination gives the same symptoms - then it is definitely the batteries.

If not then the next 2 tests may be just a bit riskier.

Only if you are willing
put the camera without batteries in a sealed plastic bag and place in the refrigerator for about two hours to allow the whole camera to reach 35-38degF.
This time keep the batteries in a nice warm environment.

Then open the bag in the refrigerator and put in the batteries and see if the camera powers up - if it does not then it is the camera.

I suggested doing it this way to avoid condensation on the camera -
either way close the bag and allow the camera to reach room temperature in the sealed bag.

If this combination still works, then what is left is to place the camera with batteries in a sealed bag in the refrigerator for enough time for the combination to reach 35-38degF - open the bag in the fridge and try again - if it does not power on then somehow it is the combination of battery and camera at that temperature range that's not working.

If this still works then it's a mystery to me
and probably anyone else reading this....

Again seal the bag after and allow the camera/battery to reach room temperature in the sealed bag to avoid condensation.

Of course the K200D has the advantage of being weather-protected -
but one should avoid condensation anyway.......

Last edited by UnknownVT; 02-03-2010 at 06:11 PM. Reason: added suggestion for investigation
02-03-2010, 07:39 PM   #7
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Batteries

Great site detailing performance of many different cell types
Battery Performance Characteristics - How to specify and test a battery
02-03-2010, 07:39 PM   #8
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Vincent,

I too thought that Lithium batteries would be the way to go. I fly electric R/C planes exclusively on LiPoly batteries because I can take them out in any weather (flying in still, 5-10f weather is incredible).

So... when I went to yellowstone, I left my NiMh batteries at home and loaded up on lithiums. Man was I freaked out when I thought I'd gotten to Yellowstone only to be relegated to using my P&S (which also uses Lithium, but worked fine). I was sure my camera was kaput.

Just to be sure, I bought a pack of alkalines, popped them in, and it worked great (other than the expected halving of images/battery change).

In fact, the only image I got into the PPG is from that Yellowstone trip, with alkalines in my K100d.

I'm going to continue poking around now that the issue has come back to my attention. I think your experiment is a good idea. I think a multimeter to check voltages (since that is ultimately what the camera uses to determine battery charge) during the experiment is also in order.

02-03-2010, 08:49 PM   #9
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Hi Marianne, i think it's the body as someone else mentioned. My body did the same thing while on an open top tour bus going over the Golden Gate bridge and had to tuck it in my jacket to warm it up, also when we were in -20C temps in Toronto, i was out shooting and it did the same thing after maybe 20 shots on a full charge

At least i know the body isn't temperature resistant but if you read the manaul it does say something like below xF (me thinks 0c) it won't operate properly, that's why i'm moving to the K7 which has a better temp working zone.
02-03-2010, 10:55 PM   #10
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QuoteOriginally posted by Clicker Quote
At least i know the body isn't temperature resistant but if you read the manaul it does say something like below xF (me thinks 0c) it won't operate properly, that's why i'm moving to the K7 which has a better temp working zone.
You know I never checked on that - and you're right -
almost all the dSLRs that I downloaded manuals for -
eg: all Pentax (except K-7) Canon 7D, T1i, Nikon D300S, D90, D5000 etc
have specified operating temperature range of 0-40degC (32-104degF).

I know I have shot at below freezing -
but the K100D and/or K-x have come from warm indoors
and I had them under my coat until I was ready to shoot -
so although the outdoor temperature was below 0degC
the dSLRs were kept warmer than that.....
02-03-2010, 11:18 PM   #11
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From the spec sheet

Weather, dust and cold resistant
The K-7 is weather, dust and cold resistant (to 14 F or -10 C), making it ideal for use in any environment.
02-05-2010, 10:59 PM   #12
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As a K200D owner I have used my camera in the winter here in Northeast Ohio many times at temperatures much lower then 50 F (in the teens). This sounds like a defective camera. Try some of the tests mentioned earlier but I think a trip to the service center is inorder.

Rick
02-14-2010, 09:28 AM   #13
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Battery problem solution

Hi everyone -
Thank you for your help with the problem. I tried putting cold batteries in frig, and then camera in frig, an then whole thing in frig and it worked fine for a while. Then same problem arose.
Took it to my local camera store and the same problem with lithium or NiMh that they put in. Put in regular alkaline and it works great every time even in the cold. May be a camera problem, but if this is the fix - I can live with it. Regular alkalines in the camera and battery pack works like a charm. Took camera to COLD Daytona Nationwide race yesterday and worked perfectly.
Thanks all for your help.

Marianne
02-14-2010, 03:27 PM   #14
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QuoteOriginally posted by ganarask Quote
Put in regular alkaline and it works great every time even in the cold. May be a camera problem, but if this is the fix - I can live with it. Regular alkalines in the camera and battery pack works like a charm. Took camera to COLD Daytona Nationwide race yesterday and worked perfectly.
Thanks all for your help.
I am glad things are working for you again with alkalines.

However be aware that the K200D manual says that alkalines are not recommended -



However if it works - it works
and hopefully you get a fair number of shots from each set
- just carry spare sets -
fortunately alkalines are cheap and widely available.
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