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02-11-2010, 07:05 PM   #1
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Debating the return of the K-7

The first issue was that the AF while seemingly faster has been doing a lot of hunting and such making it less effective than my K10D was... Often it will lock in out of focus and take the shot. I am manually focusing my 500mm telephoto and it seems to be going in and out of focus even during a burst of shots.

The horizon indicator shows level and the picture is much more off kilter than the K10D normally was. (Is there an adjustment?) This was on a tripod and leveled according to the indicator:

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I can't seem to get any shake stability in movie mode. It won't turn on SR even with it set to on. (maybe some other setting I haven't found yet)

I have lots of pictures that have an over lapping purple tinge that is near areas that would be higher contrast.

I knew the noise was an issue in High ISO but was left with the impression that it wasn't in the RAW's which it very much is....

Just really disappointed so far. I want to like the K-7 but after seeing the noise of the K-X high ISO in comparison to this one I am thinking of selling my lenses as well and permanently jumping this ship.

02-11-2010, 10:28 PM   #2
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Whoa, seems you may have a lemon. If you have all these problems with the K-7 you have, why not send it in for servicing or hope they fix the issues or provide you with a new body? The symptoms you are experiencing are completely opposite of my experiences with my K-7. I came from a K10D as well.

Jason
02-11-2010, 11:11 PM   #3
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QuoteOriginally posted by KansasHorizons.com Quote

I knew the noise was an issue in High ISO but was left with the impression that it wasn't in the RAW's which it very much is....

Just really disappointed so far. I want to like the K-7 but after seeing the noise of the K-X high ISO in comparison to this one .
the statement that k7's noise is on par with others in RAW is slightly misleading. And its not your fault if you fell for it.

This statement is being repeated in these forums quite often. Mostly a way to dismiss other person's comment noise issues.

In the start this statement really had some truth, because when k7 came out it was compared with the competitors of that time. And really raw noise was almost near to others.
But since then we had kx released and there was a significant difference in noise performance.
But this statement about RAW noise being equal is continued blindly.
And some people say this deliberately too, just to mislead others (k7 fanboys, we have 1 or 2 here).

Just few days ago, in another thread someone asked similar question about noise performance and a k7 fanboy uttered golden words - 'In camera jpgs only'
(thus deliberately creating impression that in RAW kx and k7 have same performance. )

This type of things if repeated few times in forums by different members, gives false impression to person watching from outside.
02-12-2010, 01:44 AM   #4
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QuoteOriginally posted by KansasHorizons.com Quote
The first issue was that the AF while seemingly faster has been doing a lot of hunting and such making it less effective than my K10D was... Often it will lock in out of focus and take the shot. I am manually focusing my 500mm telephoto and it seems to be going in and out of focus even during a burst of shots.
You can adjust microfocus in Menu. Lenses are usually focusing differently on different cameras. Especially those 500mm. It's called lens back or front focusing, not a camera problem.


QuoteOriginally posted by KansasHorizons.com Quote
The horizon indicator shows level and the picture is much more off kilter than the K10D normally was. (Is there an adjustment?)
You can turn horizon level auto adjustment in Menu.

QuoteOriginally posted by KansasHorizons.com Quote
I can't seem to get any shake stability in movie mode. It won't turn on SR even with it set to on. (maybe some other setting I haven't found yet)
QuoteOriginally posted by KansasHorizons.com Quote
I have lots of pictures that have an over lapping purple tinge that is near areas that would be higher contrast.
Can you show sample? Could be the lens fringing.

QuoteOriginally posted by KansasHorizons.com Quote
I knew the noise was an issue in High ISO but was left with the impression that it wasn't in the RAW's which it very much is....

Just really disappointed so far. I want to like the K-7 but after seeing the noise of the K-X high ISO in comparison to this one I am thinking of selling my lenses as well and permanently jumping this ship.
It seems that you are doing something wrong, or, in case SR is really not working and other problems persistent, you should contact Pentax Service. If SR is working in other modes, it's almost not possible that it's not working in Movie mode.

02-12-2010, 05:46 AM   #5
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QuoteOriginally posted by KansasHorizons.com Quote
The first issue was that the AF while seemingly faster has been doing a lot of hunting and such making it less effective than my K10D was... Often it will lock in out of focus and take the shot. I am manually focusing my 500mm telephoto and it seems to be going in and out of focus even during a burst of shots.

I have lots of pictures that have an over lapping purple tinge that is near areas that would be higher contrast.

I knew the noise was an issue in High ISO but was left with the impression that it wasn't in the RAW's which it very much is....

Just really disappointed so far. I want to like the K-7 but after seeing the noise of the K-X high ISO in comparison to this one I am thinking of selling my lenses as well and permanently jumping this ship.
The movie issues aside, have you taken exactly the same shot with the K10d and the K7 and compared? Some of this sounds like the angst I have gone through with every new piece of equipment, and it often goes back to my own learning curve. If the K7 in raw does not have as good or better noise characteristics than the K10d, then something is wrong. The same is true with focus.

After I got the K20d I took a shot that was mostly sky at the focus point (to look for dust on the sensor), and was frustrated that focus would not immediately lock at infinity. It turned out that the K10d and the k100d did the same thing when aimed at exactly the same place. AF has trouble with skies, and a slight change of horizon makes all the difference in whether the AF can find enough contrast at the point of focus. Sometimes a focus problem makes a shot initally look noisy to my eyes, so two of your problems may be related. Get out the manual and go through all the settings. Usually, there is something different. If all the settings are correct, and the K7 does not do as well as the K10d, then it is time to send it off for service or return it.
02-12-2010, 07:51 AM   #6
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I should have a replacement here by Monday. I will test them side by side for a day to see if a few of these issues are common or just part of being a lemon. If I thought there was any chance of seeing a replacement for the K-7 any time soon I would just wait and grab a K-x for the time being.

I am considering the K-x as a second body anyway so I may send both back if I am not pleased and grab a K-x in hopes of a better replacement for the K-7 to come out soon or I may get disgusted and jump ship though that is not where my heart is at. When I bought the K10 new I had to send it in immediately for a few various issues, I don't want to do that again as I should be able to get a working camera on the first try from a company.

QuoteOriginally posted by GeneV Quote
have you taken exactly the same shot with the K10d and the K7 and compared?
No, Sorry. I had meant that my raw pictures via the k-7 were barely less noisy than the jpeg the k-7 was producing alongside the raw. The noise is much better than the K10 it is the focusing that does not seem any better in many cases. Yes the sky is one of then that is a tough grab but I think I was having better luck with the K10 even on skies.
02-12-2010, 11:44 AM   #7
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The point isn't that shooting RAW magically mean less noise - it means greater latitude in applying noise reduction yourself. You can;'t simpyl shoot raw, do a default conversion, and magically expect better results than shooting jpeg (which does exactly the same thing).
02-12-2010, 12:06 PM   #8
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QuoteOriginally posted by Marc Sabatella Quote
The point isn't that shooting RAW magically mean less noise - it means greater latitude in applying noise reduction yourself. You can;'t simpyl shoot raw, do a default conversion, and magically expect better results than shooting jpeg (which does exactly the same thing).
Excellent point. One reason I shoot raw is to pick my own noise reduction and sharpening software.

02-12-2010, 02:36 PM   #9
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QuoteOriginally posted by Jadran Quote
You can adjust microfocus in Menu. Lenses are usually focusing differently on different cameras. Especially those 500mm. It's called lens back or front focusing, not a camera problem.
Please take a minute and think about this statement. If the same lens focuses differently on different cameras, where does the problem lie?
02-12-2010, 03:42 PM   #10
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QuoteOriginally posted by Steve Beswick Quote
Please take a minute and think about this statement. If the same lens focuses differently on different cameras, where does the problem lie?
Lens focus calibration, as well as centering, varies from sample to sample. Same goes for cameras, even if they are from same production batch, you can never tell which one has exactly "proper" calibration. So, it could be that in this case K10d and the lens match each other accidentally. Or, K10 and K-7 could have different calibration. Or, k-7 has "wrong" calibration. Or lens. Which one is right, do you know? That's why microadjusment exist. The point is to match particular camera with lens.
It can be camera malfunction, but you can draw some conclusion only if testing with certain number of different lenses, not just one, especially 500 mm telephoto ("mirror lens", i guess)

Last edited by Jadran; 02-12-2010 at 03:50 PM.
02-12-2010, 03:58 PM   #11
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QuoteOriginally posted by Jadran Quote
You can adjust microfocus in Menu.
I see no such named option in my K-7 and the term is not found in the English PDF manual.
Could you elaborate please?
02-12-2010, 04:02 PM   #12
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QuoteOriginally posted by sledger Quote
I see no such named option in my K-7 and the term is not found in the English PDF manual.
Could you elaborate please?
On 6-th tab (last) of Custom options in Menu, there is "AF Adjusment" option. That is it. It affects "In Focus" signal even if you're using manual lenses.
02-12-2010, 04:09 PM   #13
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Got it.. Thanks
02-12-2010, 04:54 PM   #14
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QuoteOriginally posted by Jadran Quote
It can be camera malfunction, but you can draw some conclusion only if testing with certain number of different lenses, not just one, especially 500 mm telephoto ("mirror lens", i guess)
Reading again Op's message, I see he was using manual focusing 500mm mirror lens, which makes the determination of proper focus calibration even harder. Is is more the accident then the rule that manual focusing lens matches the "focus confirmation" of the camera. I have 4 MF lensed and used them on 3 different bodies, and never did they match the focus confirmation by the camera. Even more, any of those lenses needed different amount of adjustment on same camera body (though some of them really minor). So, to determine if the focusing of the camera is malfunctioning, you have to make proper focus test with several lenses, make needed adjustment, and only if achieving focus is not possible, or difference with camera confirmation is really significant, you should consider that something is wrong with camera.

What i am saying that you should not be discouraged by the first not so successful shoots, and gave up on camera easily.

Last edited by Jadran; 02-12-2010 at 05:04 PM.
02-12-2010, 08:01 PM   #15
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"I can't seem to get any shake stability in movie mode. It won't turn on SR even with it set to on. (maybe some other setting I haven't found yet)"

You might check to see if you have the Wireless or Cabled Shutter Release Remote set to "ON". I had the same problem and found out I had the Shutter Release Remote set to "ON" in the Movie Mode. I had set up my camera on my tripod and turned on the Wireless Remote Shutter Release so I could get in some video and when I finished I didn't turn it off when I finished. I was a little frustrated till I figured out that the SR would not work until I set it to "OFF". Hope this helps.

Last edited by ggray; 02-13-2010 at 06:48 PM.
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