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View Poll Results: new K-x or lightly used K200D
K-x (new) 5187.93%
K200D (used) 712.07%
Voters: 58. You may not vote on this poll

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02-24-2010, 01:47 PM   #1
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I need your opinion... K-x or a lightly used K200D?

I originally wanted a Pentax K20D but bought a Samsung Gx-20 instead because it was about $150 cheaper here in Poland. But unfortunately, the camera, 3 lens, and my metz 36 af-p were stolen while I was on vacation

Now I have the funds to get back into photography again.
In Poland the K-x with the 18-55 DAL runs approx. $673 (usd) with tax
A used K200D with 18-55 DA II runs about $510 (usd) no tax cause it's used...

Now the type of shooting I will be doing will be some macros, portraits, low light photography, indoor, wildlife, outdoors, kinda everything that I can take a picture of...

Here's the thing, if the K-x was weather sealed, this would be a non-issue. The K200D is weather sealed (which I like), but I'm afraid that it's electronics might leave me wanting more low light ISO capabilities.

Lens I will be acquiring with the camera to use are DA 35mm limited (for sure), and possibly either the DA 70mm limited or the DFA 100mm macro (non WR).

What would you guys get? I would love to get a new K20D here but they run about $1k (usd here with tax). K-7? Fahgettabout it! They run $1.4k plus!

Thank you for your help and insight. You guys have helped me learn so much about photography and continue to help me develop my passion for photos just by reading about other people's problems, solutions, and experiences!

Theperception2008


Last edited by theperception2008; 02-24-2010 at 11:20 PM. Reason: added some text
02-24-2010, 02:00 PM   #2
YJD
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I don't have neither of them but for the price difference I'll go with a brand new K-x (K-x is great at high ISO).

Just my 2 cents!
02-24-2010, 02:07 PM   #3
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i have the K10D (same sensor as the K200D?) and the Kx... if i had to keep only ONE camera, i hate to admit, but i think i'd keep the Kx... it is VERY versatile because of the ISO...
02-24-2010, 04:29 PM   #4
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It really depends if the high ISO abilities matter to you...

02-24-2010, 05:25 PM   #5
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I have a K200D and my daughter has a KX - so this is a comparison of the two from my point of view

My K200D
  • has weather sealing - its saved me several times in my travels (particularly in Ireland - thats a very wet place!!!)
  • the 18-55 ALII has a metal mount & lens hood with quickshift (though I rarely use that lens now)
  • good, intuitive menus, but they need some more burrowing at times
  • the top LCD is very handy - great for a quick glance to see where you are
  • the body size is just that bit better for me
  • easy optical DOF check with the on/off/DOF switch

However, the KX has
  • better low light performance
  • brilliant intuitive menus
  • more on board processing of JPEGs
  • rear LCD is effective, but not quite the same as the top LCD
  • DOF check is not as nice - you assign it to the green button, but then lose that for other things ..... hmmmm
  • easier access to important functions like ISO, WB etc
  • faster to focus
  • no visual indication of focus point - but it is audible - just remember where it is

In the end, its all about the images you produce - and if you shoot low light and want snappier adjustments, go for the KX.

If you need that weather sealing, more effective DOF & focus point indication and are prepared to take your time, go for the K200D. They are both great bits of kit.

Good luck with your decision!

Cheers
02-24-2010, 05:56 PM   #6
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Both are nice cameras.

K200D is solid as a rock, great IQ, weather-sealed, feels better in hand, has battery grip.

K-x has 20% more resolution, great IQ, great high-ISO, faster AF, better JPG engine, highlight/shadow/lens correction built-in (for JPG's), is slightly more compact.

Personally if it was either/or I'd go with the K-x, but it depends on your shooting needs really.

Last edited by rawr; 02-24-2010 at 10:03 PM. Reason: typo
02-24-2010, 08:00 PM   #7
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Low light shooting with the K200D means long exposures on a tripod as it only goes to 1600 iso, all the weather sealed lenses have gotten really expensive so the plastic bag is back in fashion

If i had a choice now, i'd go Kx with the plastic bag when caught in really bad weather build on your lens collection and later invest in the K7 if you know you'll be shooting in extreme areas and that's an only if scenario.
02-24-2010, 08:30 PM   #8
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QuoteOriginally posted by Clicker Quote
Low light shooting with the K200D means long exposures on a tripod as it only goes to 1600 iso
No law against underexposing and push processing for the effective equivalent of shooting higher ISO; I do it all the time. If you're shooting JPEG, the K-x does quite a bit better in these situations, though. Differences is rather smaller in RAW.

02-24-2010, 09:32 PM   #9
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I am new, but I have the K-x..and I love it. I also shot in Raw and Jpeg. I truly do not notice any differance to my eye, anyway. It is fab in low light. Which is most shots anyway, like anywhere in doors or even cloudy days..I like all its features, such as the Museum mode. I do some post processing, from my memory card then save once to a file...I think the pics look good to me.
That is what matters, what you feel pulled to....
02-24-2010, 11:29 PM   #10
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Original Poster
QuoteOriginally posted by MoiVous Quote
I have a K200D and my daughter has a KX - so this is a comparison of the two from my point of view

My K200D
  • has weather sealing - its saved me several times in my travels (particularly in Ireland - thats a very wet place!!!)
  • the 18-55 ALII has a metal mount & lens hood with quickshift (though I rarely use that lens now)
  • good, intuitive menus, but they need some more burrowing at times
  • the top LCD is very handy - great for a quick glance to see where you are
  • the body size is just that bit better for me
  • easy optical DOF check with the on/off/DOF switch

However, the KX has
  • better low light performance
  • brilliant intuitive menus
  • more on board processing of JPEGs
  • rear LCD is effective, but not quite the same as the top LCD
  • DOF check is not as nice - you assign it to the green button, but then lose that for other things ..... hmmmm
  • easier access to important functions like ISO, WB etc
  • faster to focus
  • no visual indication of focus point - but it is audible - just remember where it is

In the end, its all about the images you produce - and if you shoot low light and want snappier adjustments, go for the KX.

If you need that weather sealing, more effective DOF & focus point indication and are prepared to take your time, go for the K200D. They are both great bits of kit.

Good luck with your decision!

Cheers
This is the list of goodies that has me split! Poland is a fairly wet climate to live in, rain for most of spring, lotsa snow in the winter, esp this last one, and a few months of sunshine... At the same time, even outdoors shooting will by pushing 600 -800 iso just from looking outside this morning.

Where's the K-wr? K-x sensor with some weather seals! :-P that would instantly solve my problems... :-( and Yes I would drop some more dough just to have a weather sealed K-x.

I want the durability of the K200D and the performance of the K-x.

Being able to have a grip for the K200D is a nice accessory too...

hmm decisions decsisions...
02-24-2010, 11:32 PM   #11
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Original Poster
QuoteOriginally posted by Marc Sabatella Quote
No law against underexposing and push processing for the effective equivalent of shooting higher ISO; I do it all the time. If you're shooting JPEG, the K-x does quite a bit better in these situations, though. Differences is rather smaller in RAW.
How far underexposed could I go? My current computer setup isn't good enough for raw processing yet, will be upgrading in a few months to something that will be able to work on raw easily. 21.5 inch iMac :-) (I hope!!!). So in the meantime I will probably shoot more jpegs.
02-25-2010, 12:03 AM   #12
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QuoteOriginally posted by theperception2008 Quote
Poland is a fairly wet climate to live in, rain for most of spring, lotsa snow in the winter, esp this last one, and a few months of sunshine... At the same time, even outdoors shooting will by pushing 600 -800 iso just from looking outside this morning.
I also have a lot of overcast, wet times where I am, but that is more an argument for the K-x than the K200D. Irrespective of the weather-sealing issue, when the light is bad and you have to work with slow lenses outdoors (eg telephoto), the K-x gives you a degree of easy high-ISO headroom (ie quality images at 3200 ISO and above) that lets you get photos that you just can't get with the K200D.

Especially when you have crappy (cheap) telephoto lenses that don't deliver any decent sharpness until you (a) use a fast shutter speed and (b) stop them down to f8 or f11 or so...
02-25-2010, 12:03 AM   #13
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QuoteOriginally posted by MoiVous Quote
  • has weather sealing - its saved me several times in my travels (particularly in Ireland - thats a very wet place!!!)
  • the 18-55 ALII has a metal mount & lens hood with quickshift (though I rarely use that lens now)
  • good, intuitive menus, but they need some more burrowing at times
  • the top LCD is very handy - great for a quick glance to see where you are
  • the body size is just that bit better for me
  • easy optical DOF check with the on/off/DOF switch
Let's add that the K200D has the red focus indicators in the viewfinder. I will definitely miss them on a Kx.

I don't have experience with a Kx, so can not compare further.
02-25-2010, 01:19 PM   #14
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QuoteOriginally posted by theperception2008 Quote
How far underexposed could I go? My current computer setup isn't good enough for raw processing yet, will be upgrading in a few months to something that will be able to work on raw easily. 21.5 inch iMac :-) (I hope!!!). So in the meantime I will probably shoot more jpegs.
Well, there's no arbitrary limit that says you can go this far and no further; noise just gets progressively worse. Same as raising ISO, really. And our perception of noise also depends a lot on the specifics of the scene and the exposure - the type and color of light, whether you're more interested in the lights or the shadows, the type of textures and details.

But from a subjective standpoint, I'd say that shooting RAW on my K200D and processing with ACDSee Pro 3, I can almost always push up to one full stop and still be happy enough with the appearance of the lights without necessarily needing any more NR than I do by default at ISO 1600. The shadows become less attractive, but assuming they are of less interest, I can just keep them darker. Or I can be more aggressive with NR if I feel I need to. No question that the IQ won't be as good as shot that was already well exposed at ISO 1600, but it's not like suddenly falling off a cliff, either. Somewhere between 1 and 2 stops - depending on the specifics of the scene - I perceive a "knee" in the curve. That is, the difference between ISO 6400 and ISO 3200 (equivalent) strikes me as more dramatic than the difference between 1600 and 3200. There are a few ISO 6400 equivalent images that manage to surprise me with how clean they stay. They are usually the ones shot in pretty intense but directed light so all the interest is in the lights and the shadows can be safely kept as dark as they were in the original.

Again, this is shooting RAW and using ACDSee Pro. You might get different results with a different PP program. Shooting JPEG, I'd kind expect that "knee" in the curve to occur somewhat sooner, but I'd imagine that with decent NR, you could be pretty happy with up to a one full stop push "most" of the time. It also depends, of course, on your personal tolerance for noise.

Here's a web resolution version of a recent shot with a one stop push, making the equivalent of ISO 3200, in which I did not do any additional NR beyond what I nromally do at ISO 1600 (50% strength color, 5% strength luminance)



Here's a link to a somewhat larger but still not full size version. If you're not OK with this level of noise, you can always be more aggressive with NR, but as always, you start to lose detail, so I personally prefer not to most of the time:

http://marcsabatella.zenfolio.com/img/v10/p467677435.jpg

My impression from doing a bunch of comparisons is that the K-x improves on this "some" but not hugely. However, if you shoot JPEG, you'll still be able to do just as well on the K-x, and it's in-camera NR for JPEG is quite good to my eyes. You will probably struggle to do as well with the K200D.
02-25-2010, 01:23 PM   #15
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Of course, you could go for the K20D - weather sealing, ISO 3200, and the red focus indicator!! A complete package.
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