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08-11-2015, 05:27 AM - 1 Like   #46
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QuoteOriginally posted by jonsalty Quote
I did a panning shot with the k500 and it was really staggered. I don't know whether that was because I was using 24 fps at 1/50 and should be using something slightly higher? I know the k3 goes up to 60i fps. Do you think that will solve the panning issues.
Sucky panning performance is an on going issue for all cameras with a Rolling Shutter.

QuoteOriginally posted by jonsalty Quote
so I will likely be doing a coupe of 24 hour days lol.
Cinematographers, that's how we roll.
I did 6 hours of driving Sunday to go from Melbourne to the Otway Ranges in south west Victoria to shoot a single fight scene ( 3 hours each way ) for a Teaser Trailer, only to be on set for a feature film by 3am Monday morning, and back to the feature for a midnight start Tuesday morning,... And all of it was worth it.

If the trailer gets us the funding for the feature, it's off to the Philippines to shoot the Feature.

K-01 doing Behind Scenes Media on both of these.

08-12-2015, 02:49 PM   #47
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I have just re read through everything on here and must say a massive thank you for everyone's advice. I really appreciate hearing everyone's thoughts.

I have managed to pick up another videography contract which starts in 3 days time and another one for a youtube fitness coach which will be once a fortnight (2 weeks).

I work as a freelance project manager for events so everything I do comes down to an event and a good 70% of the events are documented either as a case study or for social media. Now it would save me a lot of money if instead of hiring my videographer at 700-1000 a time I could charge my client that and actually do it myself.
With a lot more videography work coming in as my career develops (I'm still 24) I think that investing in a 'big boys camera' is the right thing to do.
This evening I have been looking into Canon 5d mark ii and mark iii a Canon 70D, Panasonic GH4, and the Sony A7.
Now on average whether brand new or second hand with accessories they are around the 1500 mark.
I think this is where I am looking at for a video camera that I can use primarily for events, these events are experiential activations which usually take place outside or in shopping centres, the environment is fairly controllable. I like the ability to have a wide lens and short depth of field shot. But more importantly if I am in and out of the event space depending on the site footprint I want to be able to have a piece of kit that means the footage isn't going to wobble about if I am moving around consumers and I can have a steady panning shot with out a patchy frame lag.

The k500 that I've got now has been great for headshots and with the 3 lenses that I have I've enjoyed doing landscape photography and bits of videography but I certainly feel that I am restricted and am constantly worried that my equipment is holding me back from what I want to create.
I'd still like a camera that I can do photography on but for the paid work is the videography.

Once again thank you for your advice thus far and I'd buy you all a beer if I could. I look forward to hearing everyone's thoughts in the above.
08-12-2015, 04:08 PM   #48
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QuoteOriginally posted by jonsalty Quote
I have just re read through everything on here and must say a massive thank you for everyone's advice. I really appreciate hearing everyone's thoughts.

I have managed to pick up another videography contract which starts in 3 days time and another one for a youtube fitness coach which will be once a fortnight (2 weeks).

I work as a freelance project manager for events so everything I do comes down to an event and a good 70% of the events are documented either as a case study or for social media. Now it would save me a lot of money if instead of hiring my videographer at 700-1000 a time I could charge my client that and actually do it myself.
With a lot more videography work coming in as my career develops (I'm still 24) I think that investing in a 'big boys camera' is the right thing to do.
This evening I have been looking into Canon 5d mark ii and mark iii a Canon 70D, Panasonic GH4, and the Sony A7.
Now on average whether brand new or second hand with accessories they are around the 1500 mark.
I think this is where I am looking at for a video camera that I can use primarily for events, these events are experiential activations which usually take place outside or in shopping centres, the environment is fairly controllable. I like the ability to have a wide lens and short depth of field shot. But more importantly if I am in and out of the event space depending on the site footprint I want to be able to have a piece of kit that means the footage isn't going to wobble about if I am moving around consumers and I can have a steady panning shot with out a patchy frame lag.

The k500 that I've got now has been great for headshots and with the 3 lenses that I have I've enjoyed doing landscape photography and bits of videography but I certainly feel that I am restricted and am constantly worried that my equipment is holding me back from what I want to create.
I'd still like a camera that I can do photography on but for the paid work is the videography.

Once again thank you for your advice thus far and I'd buy you all a beer if I could. I look forward to hearing everyone's thoughts in the above.
I spent 25 years working as a media specialist in the meetings and conventions industry here in the States, retiring as an area director (responsible for media activities in a group of convention centers). Events was our business, from weddings to corporate product roll-outs. With that in mind, narrowly focus upon what you can do now. Avoid jobs beyond your capability. However, let those jobs finance your gear. With a signed contract you can acquire what you need (but only what is necessary) that will significantly enhance the profit margin of the next job. Allow yourself to grow slowly. You can not grow without some risk. Try to keep that risk under control.

My advice: SONY. They have been heavy hitters in the video world for fifty years, and based upon the comments of the B&H Events OPTIC 15 roster of speakers, they appear to have acquired a lot of professional fans.

Good luck.
08-12-2015, 04:16 PM   #49
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Well we have SONY sensors in our Pentax DSLRs.. Sadly the P/R engineers haven't made the best of them for video.

08-12-2015, 04:31 PM   #50
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QuoteOriginally posted by winkler Quote
I spent 25 years working as a media specialist in the meetings and conventions industry here in the States, retiring as an area director (responsible for media activities in a group of convention centers). Events was our business, from weddings to corporate product roll-outs. With that in mind, narrowly focus upon what you can do now. Avoid jobs beyond your capability. However, let those jobs finance your gear. With a signed contract you can acquire what you need (but only what is necessary) that will significantly enhance the profit margin of the next job. Allow yourself to grow slowly. You can not grow without some risk. Try to keep that risk under control.

My advice: SONY. They have been heavy hitters in the video world for fifty years, and based upon the comments of the B&H Events OPTIC 15 roster of speakers, they appear to have acquired a lot of professional fans.

Good luck.
Thanks very much Winkler. Great to know that you're in a similar industry.
Thankfully the styles of work I am doing videography for tend to be for social media which can cover up any mistakes quite nicely. But I agree risk management is important to consider.
I've just watched this review here and they speak highly of the Canon 70D. Although not a full frame, it seems to be competing well against the likes of the 5d and it will be a lot cheaper too.
Steve what are your thoughts on this?
Thanks as always folks.
08-12-2015, 05:00 PM   #51
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QuoteOriginally posted by jonsalty Quote
I have managed to pick up another videography contract which starts in 3 days time and another one for a youtube fitness coach which will be once a fortnight (2 weeks)....

I work as a freelance project manager for events so everything I do comes down to an event and a good 70% of the events are documented either as a case study or for social media....

I think this is where I am looking at for a video camera that I can use primarily for events, these events are experiential activations which usually take place outside or in shopping centres, the environment is fairly controllable. I like the ability to have a wide lens and short depth of field shot. But more importantly if I am in and out of the event space depending on the site footprint I want to be able to have a piece of kit that means the footage isn't going to wobble about if I am moving around consumers and I can have a steady panning shot with out a patchy frame lag ....

I'd still like a camera that I can do photography on but for the paid work is the videography....
You've provided a bit of new information in your post above. At the risk of offending the large sensor enthusiasts, I will suggest that you should also consider a video camera with native XLR audio inputs, a smaller sensor for greater depth of field for easier focusing, and less rolling shutter which is a problem for most of the larger sensor cameras.

There is a reason that dedicated video cameras have built in XLR. Dedicated controls for zoom, focus, and iris. Built-in ND filters. Real dedicated buttons to pull up histograms and focus peaking. And a button to switch between monochrome and color display in the viewfinder.

By the way, I have a Panasonic GH4 and it is a great creative tool. It is extremely capable and I can recommend it to just about anyone. But if I were being paid for event videography, I would probably stick to a video camera. Still cameras are improving, but have a way to go for ENG work. Actually, I think still cameras will never get there, since that is not really their intended use, and there will always be a need for ENG cameras.

Some options: XA-20, HF-G30, HC-X920, HC-X1000, AF-100a, AG-AC90/130, PXW-X70, many others. (These are NTSC model designations, don't know the PAL equivalents off the top of my head.)

How about a visit to Tubeshooter for some additional practical suggestions? He's got a great YouTube channel too, just sit back and enjoy.
Tube Shooter - The website magazine for people shooting video for the Internet
https://www.youtube.com/user/TubeShooterMag
https://www.youtube.com/user/UKAirscape
08-13-2015, 12:26 AM   #52
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Here is the link I forgot to add in my previous post. It looks at the 70d compared with the 5d's
.
08-13-2015, 03:44 AM   #53
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QuoteOriginally posted by Tanzer Quote
You've provided a bit of new information in your post above. At the risk of offending the large sensor enthusiasts, I will suggest that you should also consider a video camera with native XLR audio inputs, a smaller sensor for greater depth of field for easier focusing, and less rolling shutter which is a problem for most of the larger sensor cameras.

There is a reason that dedicated video cameras have built in XLR. Dedicated controls for zoom, focus, and iris. Built-in ND filters. Real dedicated buttons to pull up histograms and focus peaking. And a button to switch between monochrome and color display in the viewfinder.

By the way, I have a Panasonic GH4 and it is a great creative tool. It is extremely capable and I can recommend it to just about anyone. But if I were being paid for event videography, I would probably stick to a video camera. Still cameras are improving, but have a way to go for ENG work. Actually, I think still cameras will never get there, since that is not really their intended use, and there will always be a need for ENG cameras.

Some options: XA-20, HF-G30, HC-X920, HC-X1000, AF-100a, AG-AC90/130, PXW-X70, many others. (These are NTSC model designations, don't know the PAL equivalents off the top of my head.)

How about a visit to Tubeshooter for some additional practical suggestions? He's got a great YouTube channel too, just sit back and enjoy.
Tube Shooter - The website magazine for people shooting video for the Internet
https://www.youtube.com/user/TubeShooterMag
https://www.youtube.com/user/UKAirscape
I've used the HC-X900 before, and there's a lot to like about it... except for the image quality. It is dreadful. Colors are horrible, easily blown out (i.e. the sky turns turquoise and then white), etc. The dynamic range is terrible. etc. And the everything in focus look looks cheap IMHO. In terms of control over the image I find my K-5 easier to use too.

I would avoid Canon for video work, unless you are talking about a Cinema EOS.

For me, unless you have the money to go for the big boys, something like a Samsung NX1, Sony A7S, Olympus OM-D E-M5 Mark II or Panasonic GH4 seem to be the best options. I'd probably go for the Olympus, since it stabilizes every lens, and very well at that. 4K isn't necessary for your work (though it would enable you to "zoom in" in post whenever you want to, so you can cut back and forth). The NX1 is a bit of a headache in terms of codec, for the moment, so if a quick turn around is what matters... Or, well, a Pentax K-5, if you want to stay with Pentax and don't mind manual focus or the lack of a flippy screen. There is a hot pixel problem shooting low light for a long time, but otherwise the image quality is beautiful, the video is stabilized, editing the files is a blast being MJPEG, compression artifacts don't exist...

08-13-2015, 04:21 AM   #54
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QuoteOriginally posted by kadajawi Quote
I've used the HC-X900 before, and there's a lot to like about it... except for the image quality. It is dreadful. Colors are horrible, easily blown out (i.e. the sky turns turquoise and then white), etc. The dynamic range is terrible. etc. And the everything in focus look looks cheap IMHO. In terms of control over the image I find my K-5 easier to use too..
I have to come to the defense of the 3MOS Panasonic camcorder because I have the model before the 900 series (700) which is physically identical.
I know what you mean about the colours and the sky. But, that's very likely because you didn't use custom white balance and probably not a video hood.
I do and the colours are absolutely spot on. Yes, the dynamic range is limited, but so too is the K-01 and K-50 video, it really is.
Yes, the DoF is massive, but with a 12x Optical zoom you can get shallow DoF the same way you do with a Pentax zoom lens.
I also have manual control with the HDC-HS700.
In my view, used thoughtfully, the HD 700 is an excellent camcorder.
Recent example (shot through the house window).


08-13-2015, 06:59 AM   #55
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Hi,

Congrats on the continued work. Its 2am in the morning here in New Zealand, so I won't write much. Can't sleep tonight.

Reading your post I felt there is some good enthusiasm there. I liked that. Wanted to add though that Videography is quite a vast subject. I'd pay a lot of attention to what makes a good product and what aspects detract from it, in your line of work.

Sound is a surprisingly important factor. Do not overlook it as a contributor to producing a top class output.

That narrow depth of field look is cool, no doubt, but it can be incredibly difficult to work with. If you go down that route, make sure you have something that can assist you to control the focus point. Either focus peaking that you can tune the sensitivity of, or a larger monitor to help visualise it better etc. Often it's safer to mix a wider shot with a lot of the image in focus, with overlays of narrow depth of field shots for interest etc.

Always be thinking of the money shot. That's the one that whilst not necessarily artistically perfect, you've at least got it to fall back on, even if it's not exciting. Audio backing tracks are useful too, for ambient sounds etc. You're going to need to get your head around a video editing software package also. Apologies if you've got this covered, but honing your skills in this area once again will assist significantly in how professional your videos feel.

Plenty of event video work is done on DSLR type bodies. Plenty. Production values is what will set you apart. How you use your tools is more important that than the tools you have, up until a certain point. All the best.

Food for thought also:
08-13-2015, 12:40 PM   #56
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QuoteOriginally posted by Steve.Ledger Quote
I have to come to the defense of the 3MOS Panasonic camcorder because I have the model before the 900 series (700) which is physically identical.
I know what you mean about the colours and the sky. But, that's very likely because you didn't use custom white balance and probably not a video hood.
I do and the colours are absolutely spot on. Yes, the dynamic range is limited, but so too is the K-01 and K-50 video, it really is.
Yes, the DoF is massive, but with a 12x Optical zoom you can get shallow DoF the same way you do with a Pentax zoom lens.
I also have manual control with the HDC-HS700.
In my view, used thoughtfully, the HD 700 is an excellent camcorder.
Recent example (shot through the house window).


Olive Backed Sunbird - YouTube
Can't watch the video now, sadly. But yeah, the white balance was... odd. It always had a bit of a green tint. Not sure how the white balance could fix physical limitations of the sensor though, clipping is clipping. Also not sure how a video hood would help... aren't those just large lens hoods? Or do you mean I'd have to use gradual NDs?

I recorded a video of a relatively easy outdoor scene with my K-5, and the owner of the HC-X900 did the same. The result of the K-5 is better. Hands down.

You can get sort of shallow DoF with the small sensor, but you'd be zooming in a lot, which gives you a different look again. I'll put on a 50mm 1.8 and have that nice creamy look at a focal length that is much easier to manage, especially indoors.

The SR of the X900 is ridiculously good (though a bit artificial looking IMHO), and the encoder does a lot with the relatively low bitrates (24 Mbps? The K-3 has 20 Mbps, and nowhere near as much detail to compress, yet the X900 has no problem with compression artifacts).
08-16-2015, 09:59 AM   #57
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Hi all,

I did my first professional shoot yesterday on my k500 and go pro hero4. Camera performed better than I thought even if I was hand holding a lot. Followed a lot of your tips.

Here is the video: (please do not share, this is for internal use only)



I also popped in to my local camera store (jessops) and had a play with the g7. That is a great piece of kit and I think this will be the one I invest In.

With a 14-45mm lens and then I'd also get the Panasonic 100-300 lens. It would cost about 1000 but I am happy and it seems to be a lot more video focused than a canon would be, plus it shoots in 4k.

Cheers
08-16-2015, 01:33 PM   #58
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Pretty good. Next time try an sync up the music to the bands playing
08-16-2015, 01:43 PM   #59
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QuoteOriginally posted by Steve.Ledger Quote
Pretty good. Next time try an sync up the music to the bands playing
I wondered who'd point that out, and I'm glad you did.

Basically there was no power on site, this was purely for video purposes so I took one of their recorded tracks added a bit of live acoustics, a bit of traffic and there ya go. You couldn't hear the guys even if you were stood next to them!!
08-16-2015, 01:53 PM   #60
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LOL.. Fair enough. I did notice the closeup of the Mustang player looked a little odd.
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