Quality of K-7 video

gazonk · 05-11-2009, 12:03 AM

Quote:

Canon always had very good and fast internal processors, they have a very successfully history in making professional and consumer video cameras, I just cannot see how Pentax can make the video mode of the K7 better than the 5D2.
.

I've never been impressed by the consumer videocams from Canon. Had one for less than a day before returning it. Low light IQ was a disaster, sound even worse. I now have a Panasonic, excellent value for money. Had a nice Sony, too.

nosnoop · 05-11-2009, 12:07 AM

Originally posted by blende8

It shows the effect of shallow DoF, but else it's crap, sorry.

Some videographers have this obsession with shallow DOF, just like some photographers with bokeh.... and shallow DOF too

The difference is that shallow DOF is easily achieved with camera, and much harder (if not impossible) with previous consumer video cam.

Gimbal · 05-11-2009, 12:08 AM

Originally posted by Saaby

60 frames looks more like TV and video because, well, TV and Video (in the USA, sorry European folk...but yours is close) are 60 frames per second.

It’s not 60 full frames per second though, it’s interlaced so each frame only holds every second line. We in Europe have 50 interlaced frames but higher resolution, and in the end it’s the same amount of data/second.

nosnoop · 05-11-2009, 12:13 AM

Originally posted by Gimbal

It’s not 60 full frames per second though, it’s interlaced so each frame only holds every second line. We in Europe have 50 interlaced frames but higher resolution, and in the end it’s the same amount of data/second.

Yes, the TV signal is approx 60 fields per second (NTSC). The current flat panel display would deinterlace the signal to display it as 60 frames per second.

Gimbal · 05-11-2009, 12:29 AM

Originally posted by nosnoop

Yes, the TV signal is approx 60 fields per second (NTSC). The current flat panel display would deinterlace the signal to display it as 60 frames per second.

How does it do that? It only receives 30 entire frames per second. I’m guessing a video camera records 30 fps and sends them as 60 interlaced pictures. Or is a camera recording at 60 interlaced fps?

Om81 · 05-11-2009, 12:30 AM

Quote:

I highly doubt that the video iq can be much better than a 5D mark 2 . The same things were told about the iq of the K20D (pictures) in comparative to full frames DSLR or even higher cameras (medium format) and we seen that it wasn't the case.

Video IQ... still picture IQ.. what are we talk about??? Video is not a still picture!

Quote:

Video from 5D mark2 is spectacular, in no way a 720p native video coming from an apsc will be better than a native 1080p video coming from a sensor that is more than twice the size.

Video stream is uncomressed??? May be, it consists from TIFF files?

Dont forget, Canon has a video cameras in produce!!!

Steelski · 05-11-2009, 12:40 AM

Originally posted by nosnoop

Yes, the TV signal is approx 60 fields per second (NTSC). The current flat panel display would deinterlace the signal to display it as 60 frames per second.

Both wrong.
NTSC is 30 images per second on a 60 Hertz display frequency.
Only 30 pictures displayed at 60FPS.
PAL is 25 images at 50 FPS.
Movie is 24 images on 24 frames.
The signals are not 60FPS or 50FPS. Simply the Television displays each frame twice to make 50 or 60 FPS.
Unless you use progressive DVD which is cooler.

Steelski · 05-11-2009, 12:48 AM

Originally posted by Om81

Video IQ... still picture IQ.. what are we talk about??? Video is not a still picture!

Video stream is uncomressed??? May be, it consists from TIFF files?

Dont forget, Canon has a video cameras in produce!!!

Somebody needs to spill the beans on this bundle video things.... I am literally not feeling good at all. I have developed an unhealthy obsession with up and coming Pentax gear. I NEED TO KNOW!!!!!!!!!
All this guessing has gone on for too long. I need facts or I could suffer a cardiac arrest.

Mike.P® · 05-11-2009, 12:56 AM

Originally posted by blende8

It shows the effect of shallow DoF, but else it's crap, sorry.

I think it's rather good actually .. sorry.

blende8 · 05-11-2009, 01:00 AM

Originally posted by Mike.P®

I think it's rather good actually .. sorry.

What exactly do you like about it?

falconeye · 05-11-2009, 01:35 AM

Originally posted by Saaby

Check . Simply stunning stuff, at a simply stunning price point.

Hi, thanks for the link to the sample video.

It played 720p for me and I guess this is the "full resolution" you mentioned.

I am still watching out to see true 1080p samples from the GH1. Partially because the GH1 has twice the compression rate of 5Dmkii. Anybody posted 1080p?

asdf · 05-11-2009, 03:57 AM

Originally posted by blende8

Well, you like THAT?
This only shows that it is very difficult to use this stuff with advantage.
I am not sure what he did. Focus manually with the Zeiss?
It's often out of focus, often overexposed.
It shows the effect of shallow DoF, but else it's crap, sorry.

"There was a bum behind me..." "She got kinda scared..."

It's crappy and offensive.

NunoBarbosa · 05-11-2009, 04:38 AM

Originally posted by Om81

Video IQ... still picture IQ.. what are we talk about??? Video is not a still picture!

Video stream is uncomressed??? May be, it consists from TIFF files?

Dont forget, Canon has a video cameras in produce!!!

Are you saying that K7 video files are img sequences?
For me that's ok, i work in video production and img sequences are better than
to compressed and lossy files.

The 5d mark II files are a nightmare to work with, but the quality of each frame is better than anything under 10000 euros, or even higher.... And in low light it's BETTER than RED ONE. If you say it's better than 5d, i am very anxious!!!

I think that k7 will be a good surprise, but it's a pitty not to have 1080p.

falconeye · 05-11-2009, 05:36 AM

Originally posted by NunoBarbosa

And in low light it's BETTER than RED ONE. If you say it's better than 5d, i am very anxious!!!

If 5Dmkii is supposed to outperform RED One in low light, than it is safe to assume that 5Dmkii does supersample, not subsample.

-- As explained in post #2 in this thread -- https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/577687-post2.html

The current rumor (same 1024 line limit as with K20D) points to a subsampling techniques where only every 3rd line is read.

So, I am close to bed that the video frame quality from a K-7 won't be even close to anything which does supersampling. Most likely just HD camcorder quality.

mattdm · 05-11-2009, 05:48 AM

Originally posted by falconeye

So, I am close to bed that the video frame quality from a K-7 won't be even close to anything which does subsampling. Most likely just HD camcorder quality.

Which sounds find to me, because this is where we get into that question of whether there's a price premium for video. I'm happy with them adding whatever capabilities are necessary to keep up with the features checklists, but I'd really, really not like to pay an extra $200 for video features I don't want.

05-11-2009, 05:36 AM	#149
falconeye Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Munich, Alps, Germany Photos: Gallery Posts: 6,871 Original Poster	Originally posted by NunoBarbosa And in low light it's BETTER than RED ONE. If you say it's better than 5d, i am very anxious!!! If 5Dmkii is supposed to outperform RED One in low light, than it is safe to assume that 5Dmkii does supersample, not subsample. -- As explained in post #2 in this thread -- https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/577687-post2.html The current rumor (same 1024 line limit as with K20D) points to a subsampling techniques where only every 3rd line is read. So, I am close to bed that the video frame quality from a K-7 won't be even close to anything which does supersampling. Most likely just HD camcorder quality. Last edited by falconeye; 05-11-2009 at 09:01 AM.

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05-11-2009, 12:03 AM	#136
gazonk Pentaxian Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Oslo area, Norway Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 3,746	Quote: Canon always had very good and fast internal processors, they have a very successfully history in making professional and consumer video cameras, I just cannot see how Pentax can make the video mode of the K7 better than the 5D2. . I've never been impressed by the consumer videocams from Canon. Had one for less than a day before returning it. Low light IQ was a disaster, sound even worse. I now have a Panasonic, excellent value for money. Had a nice Sony, too.

05-11-2009, 12:07 AM	#137
nosnoop Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Posts: 1,299	Originally posted by blende8 It shows the effect of shallow DoF, but else it's crap, sorry. Some videographers have this obsession with shallow DOF, just like some photographers with bokeh.... and shallow DOF too The difference is that shallow DOF is easily achieved with camera, and much harder (if not impossible) with previous consumer video cam.

05-11-2009, 12:08 AM	#138
Gimbal Pentaxian Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Sweden Posts: 2,106	Originally posted by Saaby 60 frames looks more like TV and video because, well, TV and Video (in the USA, sorry European folk...but yours is close) are 60 frames per second. It’s not 60 full frames per second though, it’s interlaced so each frame only holds every second line. We in Europe have 50 interlaced frames but higher resolution, and in the end it’s the same amount of data/second.

05-11-2009, 12:13 AM	#139
nosnoop Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Posts: 1,299	Originally posted by Gimbal It’s not 60 full frames per second though, it’s interlaced so each frame only holds every second line. We in Europe have 50 interlaced frames but higher resolution, and in the end it’s the same amount of data/second. Yes, the TV signal is approx 60 fields per second (NTSC). The current flat panel display would deinterlace the signal to display it as 60 frames per second.

05-11-2009, 12:29 AM	#140
Gimbal Pentaxian Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Sweden Posts: 2,106	Originally posted by nosnoop Yes, the TV signal is approx 60 fields per second (NTSC). The current flat panel display would deinterlace the signal to display it as 60 frames per second. How does it do that? It only receives 30 entire frames per second. I’m guessing a video camera records 30 fps and sends them as 60 interlaced pictures. Or is a camera recording at 60 interlaced fps?

05-11-2009, 12:30 AM	#141
Om81 Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Moscow Posts: 39	Quote: I highly doubt that the video iq can be much better than a 5D mark 2 . The same things were told about the iq of the K20D (pictures) in comparative to full frames DSLR or even higher cameras (medium format) and we seen that it wasn't the case. Video IQ... still picture IQ.. what are we talk about??? Video is not a still picture! Quote: Video from 5D mark2 is spectacular, in no way a 720p native video coming from an apsc will be better than a native 1080p video coming from a sensor that is more than twice the size. Video stream is uncomressed??? May be, it consists from TIFF files? Dont forget, Canon has a video cameras in produce!!!

05-11-2009, 12:40 AM	#142
Steelski Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Varna Posts: 470	Originally posted by nosnoop Yes, the TV signal is approx 60 fields per second (NTSC). The current flat panel display would deinterlace the signal to display it as 60 frames per second. Both wrong. NTSC is 30 images per second on a 60 Hertz display frequency. Only 30 pictures displayed at 60FPS. PAL is 25 images at 50 FPS. Movie is 24 images on 24 frames. The signals are not 60FPS or 50FPS. Simply the Television displays each frame twice to make 50 or 60 FPS. Unless you use progressive DVD which is cooler.

05-11-2009, 12:48 AM	#143
Steelski Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Varna Posts: 470	Originally posted by Om81 Video IQ... still picture IQ.. what are we talk about??? Video is not a still picture! Video stream is uncomressed??? May be, it consists from TIFF files? Dont forget, Canon has a video cameras in produce!!! Somebody needs to spill the beans on this bundle video things.... I am literally not feeling good at all. I have developed an unhealthy obsession with up and coming Pentax gear. I NEED TO KNOW!!!!!!!!! All this guessing has gone on for too long. I need facts or I could suffer a cardiac arrest.

05-11-2009, 12:56 AM	#144
Mike.P® Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: New Milton, Hampshire, UK Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 2,154	Originally posted by blende8 It shows the effect of shallow DoF, but else it's crap, sorry. I think it's rather good actually .. sorry.

05-11-2009, 01:00 AM	#145
blende8 Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Bremen, Germany Photos: Albums Posts: 1,521	Originally posted by Mike.P® I think it's rather good actually .. sorry. What exactly do you like about it?

05-11-2009, 01:35 AM	#146
falconeye Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Munich, Alps, Germany Photos: Gallery Posts: 6,871 Original Poster	Originally posted by Saaby Check . Simply stunning stuff, at a simply stunning price point. Hi, thanks for the link to the sample video. It played 720p for me and I guess this is the "full resolution" you mentioned. I am still watching out to see true 1080p samples from the GH1. Partially because the GH1 has twice the compression rate of 5Dmkii. Anybody posted 1080p?

05-11-2009, 03:57 AM	#147
asdf Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Canada Posts: 1,252	Originally posted by blende8 Well, you like THAT? This only shows that it is very difficult to use this stuff with advantage. I am not sure what he did. Focus manually with the Zeiss? It's often out of focus, often overexposed. It shows the effect of shallow DoF, but else it's crap, sorry. "There was a bum behind me..." "She got kinda scared..." It's crappy and offensive.

05-11-2009, 04:38 AM	#148
NunoBarbosa Senior Member Join Date: May 2009 Location: Portugal Posts: 112	Originally posted by Om81 Video IQ... still picture IQ.. what are we talk about??? Video is not a still picture! Video stream is uncomressed??? May be, it consists from TIFF files? Dont forget, Canon has a video cameras in produce!!! Are you saying that K7 video files are img sequences? For me that's ok, i work in video production and img sequences are better than to compressed and lossy files. The 5d mark II files are a nightmare to work with, but the quality of each frame is better than anything under 10000 euros, or even higher.... And in low light it's BETTER than RED ONE. If you say it's better than 5d, i am very anxious!!! I think that k7 will be a good surprise, but it's a pitty not to have 1080p.

05-11-2009, 05:48 AM	#150
mattdm Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Boston, MA Photos: Gallery Posts: 2,948	Originally posted by falconeye So, I am close to bed that the video frame quality from a K-7 won't be even close to anything which does subsampling. Most likely just HD camcorder quality. Which sounds find to me, because this is where we get into that question of whether there's a price premium for video. I'm happy with them adding whatever capabilities are necessary to keep up with the features checklists, but I'd really, really not like to pay an extra $200 for video features I don't want.