A new boy on the street

Tord · 10-18-2011, 12:44 AM

Yes, I'm a Pentax fan, but some things are indeed missing with my K-5 (it is off to the doctor, AGAIN! Sigh!). That was an aside, actually, but there are some features I'd love if they were added, things this little beauty already have: http://www.dpreview.com/news/1110/11101810canoneos1dx.asp

For instance: double cards, hefty omboard processing (three in all: two amazing fast processors, and one just as good as my K-5's, just handling the AF), FX format would have been very welcome (APS-C is good enough for me, but even less noise, which comes with bigger pixels - the EOS 1D X has FX format and just 18MP, so they are almost twice as big! And the sensor itself is more advanced. later generation hardware).

But the real great detail is a highspeed Ethernet! WOW! And of course it can be controlled remotely (known as tethered), over the LAN!

In short, at a price lower than the 645D, it delivers a lot more (don't know if the price announced for the X includes a lens, though)!

asp1880 · 10-18-2011, 02:56 AM

Yeah well, everytime you stuff in a bigger sensor, more ports, more slots, more processors, bigger battery, more buttons, the camera body bulges out. Some people claim it doesn't have to, but I disagree. A Pentax camera with all that sh-tuff would lose the unique compactness that is a Pentax selling point.

You say the features are "missing", I'd say they are deliberately omitted to gain something else, namely a small semipro camera, which is something quite particular to the Pentax brand.

People who want the kitchen sink big camera are already well served by other brands.

Regards,
--Anders.

Emacs · 10-18-2011, 04:12 AM

Originally posted by asp1880

A Pentax camera with all that sh-tuff would lose the unique compactness that is a Pentax selling point.

Wake up! EVILs have captured this niche.

Asahiflex · 10-18-2011, 05:06 AM

Originally posted by Emacs

Wake up! EVILs have captured this niche.

There are two wrongs in that sentence. It's not a niche, and EVILs are not necessarily smaller (especially with zooms attached).

@Tord: you're comparing apples with melons

Emacs · 10-18-2011, 05:22 AM

Originally posted by Asahiflex

There are two wrongs in that sentence. It's not a niche, and EVILs are not necessarily smaller (especially with zooms attached).

1) And then what is the compact camera niche, if it isn't a niche?
2) It's MUCH smaller in general, and it's enough for me: I'm buying the NEX-7, since it's smaller, twice lighter and that is the PAIN to focus with K-5's OVF and A 50 f1.2. Always use the LV for it. The OLED EVF seems to be superior solution for this task.

Didn't you get it? Pentax is losing background.

Asahiflex · 10-18-2011, 05:40 AM

Originally posted by Emacs

1) And then what is the compact camera niche, if it isn't a niche?

To me the word "niche" makes the EVIL part of the market too small, smaller than it is in reality.

Quote:

2) It's MUCH smaller in general, and it's enough for me: I'm buying the NEX-7, since it's smaller, twice lighter and that is the PAIN to focus with K-5's OVF and A 50 f1.2. Always use the LV for it. The OLED EVF seems to be superior solution for this task.

Have fun with the NEX-7. It's a great camera. I'd buy a GOOD ground glass screen for the K-5 however. I'll only seriously consider the NEX system if they can offer FF in that small package.

jogiba · 10-18-2011, 06:36 AM

No 1080p60 is a showstopper for me.

Emacs · 10-18-2011, 06:50 AM

Originally posted by Asahiflex

To me the word "niche" makes the EVIL part of the market too small, smaller than it is in reality.

But the small sized DSLR is a niche

**Aristophanes** · 10-18-2011, 07:05 AM

Originally posted by Emacs

1) And then what is the compact camera niche, if it isn't a niche?
2) It's MUCH smaller in general, and it's enough for me: I'm buying the NEX-7, since it's smaller, twice lighter and that is the PAIN to focus with K-5's OVF and A 50 f1.2. Always use the LV for it. The OLED EVF seems to be superior solution for this task.

Didn't you get it? Pentax is losing background.

They are hardly "losing ground" if your reference point for performance is a 30 year-old, manual focus lens that costs more now than it did new!

That is a niche market.

Tord · 12-01-2011, 03:46 AM

The Sony NEX range has suffered some setbacks, due to the flooding in Bangkok (but that affected Nikon even worse). Still it sells better than anything else with exchangeable lenses! I too am now a NEX owner, using my Pentax FA lenses to good effect.

Still dream of a NEX-7-like FF Pentax, though!

nickthetasmaniac · 12-01-2011, 05:16 PM

Originally posted by Asahiflex

There are two wrongs in that sentence. It's not a niche, and EVILs are not necessarily smaller (especially with zooms attached).

EVIL's (at least Micro Four Thirds, which is the system I'm familiar with) are much smaller with zooms attached - it's in the lenses that the lack of mirror-box really allows things to be shrunk...

séamuis · 12-02-2011, 01:54 AM

Originally posted by Tord

Yes, I'm a Pentax fan, but some things are indeed missing with my K-5 (it is off to the doctor, AGAIN! Sigh!). That was an aside, actually, but there are some features I'd love if they were added, things this little beauty already have

I'm sure Pentax could also give you those things, but don't expect it to be as small as the K-5, or as cheap. you are comparing the K-5 against the best and most expensive digital SLR canon makes. like Asahiflex said. 'apples and melons'! also, 'little' has to be the biggest understatement in terms of cameras I've ever read. there is nothing little about this camera. in some ways that great, in others its terrible.

jogiba · 12-02-2011, 07:56 AM

Originally posted by nickthetasmaniac

EVIL's (at least Micro Four Thirds, which is the system I'm familiar with) are much smaller with zooms attached - it's in the lenses that the lack of mirror-box really allows things to be shrunk...

Panasonic Gf3 w/14-42 OIS power zoom vs Sony NEX-3C with 18-55mm zoom :

10-18-2011, 12:44 AM	#1
Tord Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Gothenburg, aka Göteborg Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 233	A new boy on the street Yes, I'm a Pentax fan, but some things are indeed missing with my K-5 (it is off to the doctor, AGAIN! Sigh!). That was an aside, actually, but there are some features I'd love if they were added, things this little beauty already have: http://www.dpreview.com/news/1110/11101810canoneos1dx.asp For instance: double cards, hefty omboard processing (three in all: two amazing fast processors, and one just as good as my K-5's, just handling the AF), FX format would have been very welcome (APS-C is good enough for me, but even less noise, which comes with bigger pixels - the EOS 1D X has FX format and just 18MP, so they are almost twice as big! And the sensor itself is more advanced. later generation hardware). But the real great detail is a highspeed Ethernet! WOW! And of course it can be controlled remotely (known as tethered), over the LAN! In short, at a price lower than the 645D, it delivers a lot more (don't know if the price announced for the X includes a lens, though)!

10-18-2011, 02:56 AM	#2
asp1880 Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Lyngby, Copenhagen Photos: Albums Posts: 742	Pentax shouldn't try to out-Canikon Canikon Yeah well, everytime you stuff in a bigger sensor, more ports, more slots, more processors, bigger battery, more buttons, the camera body bulges out. Some people claim it doesn't have to, but I disagree. A Pentax camera with all that sh-tuff would lose the unique compactness that is a Pentax selling point. You say the features are "missing", I'd say they are deliberately omitted to gain something else, namely a small semipro camera, which is something quite particular to the Pentax brand. People who want the kitchen sink big camera are already well served by other brands. Regards, --Anders.

10-18-2011, 05:22 AM	#5
Emacs Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: Moscow Posts: 1,223	Originally posted by Asahiflex There are two wrongs in that sentence. It's not a niche, and EVILs are not necessarily smaller (especially with zooms attached). 1) And then what is the compact camera niche, if it isn't a niche? 2) It's MUCH smaller in general, and it's enough for me: I'm buying the NEX-7, since it's smaller, twice lighter and that is the PAIN to focus with K-5's OVF and A 50 f1.2. Always use the LV for it. The OLED EVF seems to be superior solution for this task. Didn't you get it? Pentax is losing background. Last edited by Emacs; 10-18-2011 at 05:33 AM.

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10-18-2011, 04:12 AM	#3
Emacs Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: Moscow Posts: 1,223	Originally posted by asp1880 A Pentax camera with all that sh-tuff would lose the unique compactness that is a Pentax selling point. Wake up! EVILs have captured this niche.

10-18-2011, 05:06 AM	#4
Asahiflex Pentaxian Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Netherlands Photos: Gallery Posts: 2,795	Originally posted by Emacs Wake up! EVILs have captured this niche. There are two wrongs in that sentence. It's not a niche, and EVILs are not necessarily smaller (especially with zooms attached). @Tord: you're comparing apples with melons

10-18-2011, 05:40 AM	#6
Asahiflex Pentaxian Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Netherlands Photos: Gallery Posts: 2,795	Originally posted by Emacs 1) And then what is the compact camera niche, if it isn't a niche? To me the word "niche" makes the EVIL part of the market too small, smaller than it is in reality. Quote: 2) It's MUCH smaller in general, and it's enough for me: I'm buying the NEX-7, since it's smaller, twice lighter and that is the PAIN to focus with K-5's OVF and A 50 f1.2. Always use the LV for it. The OLED EVF seems to be superior solution for this task. Have fun with the NEX-7. It's a great camera. I'd buy a GOOD ground glass screen for the K-5 however. I'll only seriously consider the NEX system if they can offer FF in that small package.

10-18-2011, 06:36 AM	#7
jogiba Banned Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Millstone,NJ Posts: 6,491	No 1080p60 is a showstopper for me.

10-18-2011, 06:50 AM	#8
Emacs Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: Moscow Posts: 1,223	Originally posted by Asahiflex To me the word "niche" makes the EVIL part of the market too small, smaller than it is in reality. But the small sized DSLR is a niche

10-18-2011, 07:05 AM	#9
Aristophanes Site Supporter Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Rankin Inlet, Nunavut Photos: Albums Posts: 3,948	Originally posted by Emacs 1) And then what is the compact camera niche, if it isn't a niche? 2) It's MUCH smaller in general, and it's enough for me: I'm buying the NEX-7, since it's smaller, twice lighter and that is the PAIN to focus with K-5's OVF and A 50 f1.2. Always use the LV for it. The OLED EVF seems to be superior solution for this task. Didn't you get it? Pentax is losing background. They are hardly "losing ground" if your reference point for performance is a 30 year-old, manual focus lens that costs more now than it did new! That is a niche market.

12-01-2011, 03:46 AM	#10
Tord Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Gothenburg, aka Göteborg Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 233 Original Poster	The Sony NEX range has suffered some setbacks, due to the flooding in Bangkok (but that affected Nikon even worse). Still it sells better than anything else with exchangeable lenses! I too am now a NEX owner, using my Pentax FA lenses to good effect. Still dream of a NEX-7-like FF Pentax, though!

12-01-2011, 05:16 PM	#11
nickthetasmaniac Pentaxian Join Date: Dec 2008 Posts: 2,361	Originally posted by Asahiflex There are two wrongs in that sentence. It's not a niche, and EVILs are not necessarily smaller (especially with zooms attached). EVIL's (at least Micro Four Thirds, which is the system I'm familiar with) are much smaller with zooms attached - it's in the lenses that the lack of mirror-box really allows things to be shrunk...

12-02-2011, 01:54 AM	#12
séamuis Banned Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Savannah, U.S./Baguio City, P.H. Posts: 5,979	Originally posted by Tord Yes, I'm a Pentax fan, but some things are indeed missing with my K-5 (it is off to the doctor, AGAIN! Sigh!). That was an aside, actually, but there are some features I'd love if they were added, things this little beauty already have I'm sure Pentax could also give you those things, but don't expect it to be as small as the K-5, or as cheap. you are comparing the K-5 against the best and most expensive digital SLR canon makes. like Asahiflex said. 'apples and melons'! also, 'little' has to be the biggest understatement in terms of cameras I've ever read. there is nothing little about this camera. in some ways that great, in others its terrible.

12-02-2011, 07:56 AM	#13
jogiba Banned Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Millstone,NJ Posts: 6,491	Originally posted by nickthetasmaniac EVIL's (at least Micro Four Thirds, which is the system I'm familiar with) are much smaller with zooms attached - it's in the lenses that the lack of mirror-box really allows things to be shrunk... Panasonic Gf3 w/14-42 OIS power zoom vs Sony NEX-3C with 18-55mm zoom :

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