Full frame Mirrorless cameras...are they going to dominate ? Who will buy?

Fogel70 · 09-09-2018, 10:15 PM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by rawr

But mechanical shutter seems best at overcoming the 'rolling shutter' that plagues digital video. So no camera maker is going to kill mechanical shutter just to make flash sync work better.

Isn't that the same issue? Beause electronic shutters are so slow the jelly effect get worse and flash sync will be too slow.

But as soon as electronic shutter gets as fast as or faster than mechanical shutters there will not be much advantage of mechhanical shutters.

rawr · 09-09-2018, 10:53 PM

Originally posted by Fogel70

Isn't that the same issue? Beause electronic shutters are so slow the jelly effect get worse and flash sync will be too slow.

Makes sense.

repaap · 09-10-2018, 02:46 AM

There is also one more thing. It has been researched that blue light(LED screens) is really hard on your eyes. Can even harm your vision in longer run. Blue light can also trigger mental illness like depression. All radiation is not good for you from equiptment anyway. This is fact. So keep that in mind. Blue light is also adding addiction to people who uses it too much. So you spend all day staring a screen. Instead of actually seeing it your self throught VF. One aspect what comes in mind when having this EVF discussions..

**PJ1** · 09-10-2018, 03:00 AM

Originally posted by repaap

blue light(LED screens) is really hard on your eyes

True. But the amount of time one would spend looking through an EVF would be very small compared to computer time (PP), looking at a phone or just watching TV.

**Rondec** · 09-10-2018, 03:06 AM

Originally posted by PJ1

True. But the amount of time one would spend looking through an EVF would be very small compared to computer time (PP), looking at a phone or just watching TV.

Your eye would be a lot closer to the screen than with any of the other sort of devices that you mention. At least I don't usually sit with my eyeball pressed against any other screens.

Regardless, there is a whole industry now designing glasses to cut the blue light out of screen devices. I haven't tried them to see if they would help my EVF related eye strain issues, but I would hate to think that I need to wear special glasses to use my camera when I don't need to the rest of the time.

repaap · 09-10-2018, 03:39 AM

Originally posted by Rondec

Your eye would be a lot closer to the screen than with any of the other sort of devices that you mention. At least I don't usually sit with my eyeball pressed against any other screens.

Regardless, there is a whole industry now designing glasses to cut the blue light out of screen devices. I haven't tried them to see if they would help my EVF related eye strain issues, but I would hate to think that I need to wear special glasses to use my camera when I don't need to the rest of the time.

And your phone and TV/led monitor and... suppose that if they invent that glass it will be in front of devices screen..

reh321 · 09-10-2018, 05:10 AM

Originally posted by repaap

There is also one more thing. It has been researched that blue light(LED screens) is really hard on your eyes. Can even harm your vision in longer run. Blue light can also trigger mental illness like depression. All radiation is not good for you from equiptment anyway. This is fact. So keep that in mind. Blue light is also adding addiction to people who uses it too much. So you spend all day staring a screen. Instead of actually seeing it your self throught VF. One aspect what comes in mind when having this EVF discussions..

Do you have any real science to back these concerns? I remember when people used to fret about getting brain cancer from cell phones - but I haven't heard anything about that in awhile.

normhead · 09-10-2018, 05:27 AM

Bottom line, if people say it doesn't work for them, it doesn't work for them.

repaap · 09-10-2018, 05:50 AM

Originally posted by reh321

Do you have any real science to back these concerns? I remember when people used to fret about getting brain cancer from cell phones - but I haven't heard anything about that in awhile.

Well it is in finnish, but you there is also one video in English? you can find several articles about it.
here: http://www.magneettimedia.com/sininen-led-valo-on-haitallista-aivoille/
that says that 'blue light is harmful to brains. But it also destroys some cells in eye that can in prolonged use cause partial blindness. Now you don't put that label next to 'buy this screen with amazing colour reproduction' sign.

Mobilphones do actually affect our body. Even in user manual they do not engourage people to use phone near their ear while talking. Bluetooth earpeace is recommennded. also keeping it in let's say left jeans pocket, it can reduce your fertility. Not much about cancer, but they have actually proven this much. Some people are really sensitive to electric waves, thus can't use mobile network or mobile phone for example. THEY are sensitive and can have illness. But most of us are not sensitive. it still can(and do) affect us. What do you think about pollution and connection to global heating? lot of people seems to deny that too, or that having some chemicals to preserve food for example, that they are not harmful to us? Believe it or not. This is what is going on.

There.

reh321 · 09-10-2018, 05:55 AM

Originally posted by normhead

Bottom line, if people say it doesn't work for them, it doesn't work for them.

and if people say it does work for them, it does work for them.

reh321 · 09-10-2018, 06:02 AM

Originally posted by repaap

Well it is in finnish, but you there is also one video in English? you can find several articles about it.
here: http://www.magneettimedia.com/sininen-led-valo-on-haitallista-aivoille/
that says that 'blue light is harmful to brains. But it also destroys some cells in eye that can in prolonged use cause partial blindness. Now you don't put that label next to 'buy this screen with amazing colour reproduction' sign.

Mobilphones do actually affect our body. Even in user manual they do not engourage people to use phone near their ear while talking. Bluetooth earpeace is recommennded. also keeping it in let's say left jeans pocket, it can reduce your fertility. Not much about cancer, but they have actually proven this much. Some people are really sensitive to electric waves, thus can't use mobile network or mobile phone for example. THEY are sensitive and can have illness. But most of us are not sensitive. it still can(and do) affect us. What do you think about pollution and connection to global heating? lot of people seems to deny that too, or that having some chemicals to preserve food for example, that they are not harmful to us? Believe it or not. This is what is going on.

There.

Looking on-line, the main issue raised by a Harvard study is that blue light affects sleep. OK, I don't use my camera much near bedtime - bulbs and TV are a much worse issue.

Blue light has a dark side - Harvard Health

normhead · 09-10-2018, 06:04 AM

Originally posted by reh321

and if people say it does work for them, it does work for them.

I never said different.
Buy all the EVFs you want. it makes no difference to me, unless you get in my face about it.

repaap · 09-10-2018, 06:08 AM

Originally posted by reh321

Looking on-line, the main issue raised by a Harvard study is that blue light affects sleep. OK, I don't use my camera much near bedtime - bulbs and TV are a much worse issue.

Blue light has a dark side - Harvard Health

Yes, that is one of those things. Also there is some about LED bluelight wave lengt killing eye cells, just like UV-waves which our eye can not see, and react, so it makes damage.

Things add up. but anyway, that is what it is.

reh321 · 09-10-2018, 06:26 AM

Originally posted by repaap

Yes, that is one of those things. Also there is some about LED bluelight wave lengt killing eye cells, just like UV-waves which our eye can not see, and react, so it makes damage.

Things add up. but anyway, that is what it is.

Remember cold fusion??

normhead · 09-10-2018, 06:34 AM

Originally posted by reh321

Remember cold fusion??

Ya, you're right, every new identified health risk is just like cold fusion.

09-10-2018, 06:04 AM	#42
normhead Pentaxian Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Near Algonquin Park Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 40,451	Originally posted by reh321 and if people say it does work for them, it does work for them. I never said different. Buy all the EVFs you want. it makes no difference to me, unless you get in my face about it. Last edited by normhead; 09-10-2018 at 06:10 AM.

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09-09-2018, 10:15 PM - 1 Like	#31
Fogel70 Pentaxian Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Stockholm, Sweden Photos: Albums Posts: 3,062	Originally posted by rawr But mechanical shutter seems best at overcoming the 'rolling shutter' that plagues digital video. So no camera maker is going to kill mechanical shutter just to make flash sync work better. Isn't that the same issue? Beause electronic shutters are so slow the jelly effect get worse and flash sync will be too slow. But as soon as electronic shutter gets as fast as or faster than mechanical shutters there will not be much advantage of mechhanical shutters.

09-09-2018, 10:53 PM	#32
rawr Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 11,913	Originally posted by Fogel70 Isn't that the same issue? Beause electronic shutters are so slow the jelly effect get worse and flash sync will be too slow. Makes sense.

09-10-2018, 02:46 AM	#33
repaap Pentaxian Join Date: Oct 2010 Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 6,242	There is also one more thing. It has been researched that blue light(LED screens) is really hard on your eyes. Can even harm your vision in longer run. Blue light can also trigger mental illness like depression. All radiation is not good for you from equiptment anyway. This is fact. So keep that in mind. Blue light is also adding addiction to people who uses it too much. So you spend all day staring a screen. Instead of actually seeing it your self throught VF. One aspect what comes in mind when having this EVF discussions..

09-10-2018, 03:00 AM	#34
PJ1 Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Jul 2012 Location: Toowoomba, Australia Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 5,484	Originally posted by repaap blue light(LED screens) is really hard on your eyes True. But the amount of time one would spend looking through an EVF would be very small compared to computer time (PP), looking at a phone or just watching TV.

09-10-2018, 03:06 AM	#35
Rondec Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Gladys, Virginia Photos: Gallery Posts: 27,653	Originally posted by PJ1 True. But the amount of time one would spend looking through an EVF would be very small compared to computer time (PP), looking at a phone or just watching TV. Your eye would be a lot closer to the screen than with any of the other sort of devices that you mention. At least I don't usually sit with my eyeball pressed against any other screens. Regardless, there is a whole industry now designing glasses to cut the blue light out of screen devices. I haven't tried them to see if they would help my EVF related eye strain issues, but I would hate to think that I need to wear special glasses to use my camera when I don't need to the rest of the time.

09-10-2018, 03:39 AM	#36
repaap Pentaxian Join Date: Oct 2010 Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 6,242	Originally posted by Rondec Your eye would be a lot closer to the screen than with any of the other sort of devices that you mention. At least I don't usually sit with my eyeball pressed against any other screens. Regardless, there is a whole industry now designing glasses to cut the blue light out of screen devices. I haven't tried them to see if they would help my EVF related eye strain issues, but I would hate to think that I need to wear special glasses to use my camera when I don't need to the rest of the time. And your phone and TV/led monitor and... suppose that if they invent that glass it will be in front of devices screen..

09-10-2018, 05:10 AM	#37
reh321 Pentaxian Join Date: Nov 2014 Location: South Bend, IN, USA Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 23,180	Originally posted by repaap There is also one more thing. It has been researched that blue light(LED screens) is really hard on your eyes. Can even harm your vision in longer run. Blue light can also trigger mental illness like depression. All radiation is not good for you from equiptment anyway. This is fact. So keep that in mind. Blue light is also adding addiction to people who uses it too much. So you spend all day staring a screen. Instead of actually seeing it your self throught VF. One aspect what comes in mind when having this EVF discussions.. Do you have any real science to back these concerns? I remember when people used to fret about getting brain cancer from cell phones - but I haven't heard anything about that in awhile.

09-10-2018, 05:27 AM	#38
normhead Pentaxian Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Near Algonquin Park Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 40,451	Bottom line, if people say it doesn't work for them, it doesn't work for them.

09-10-2018, 05:50 AM	#39
repaap Pentaxian Join Date: Oct 2010 Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 6,242	Originally posted by reh321 Do you have any real science to back these concerns? I remember when people used to fret about getting brain cancer from cell phones - but I haven't heard anything about that in awhile. Well it is in finnish, but you there is also one video in English? you can find several articles about it. here: http://www.magneettimedia.com/sininen-led-valo-on-haitallista-aivoille/ that says that 'blue light is harmful to brains. But it also destroys some cells in eye that can in prolonged use cause partial blindness. Now you don't put that label next to 'buy this screen with amazing colour reproduction' sign. Mobilphones do actually affect our body. Even in user manual they do not engourage people to use phone near their ear while talking. Bluetooth earpeace is recommennded. also keeping it in let's say left jeans pocket, it can reduce your fertility. Not much about cancer, but they have actually proven this much. Some people are really sensitive to electric waves, thus can't use mobile network or mobile phone for example. THEY are sensitive and can have illness. But most of us are not sensitive. it still can(and do) affect us. What do you think about pollution and connection to global heating? lot of people seems to deny that too, or that having some chemicals to preserve food for example, that they are not harmful to us? Believe it or not. This is what is going on. There.

09-10-2018, 05:55 AM	#40
reh321 Pentaxian Join Date: Nov 2014 Location: South Bend, IN, USA Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 23,180	Originally posted by normhead Bottom line, if people say it doesn't work for them, it doesn't work for them. and if people say it does work for them, it does work for them.

09-10-2018, 06:02 AM	#41
reh321 Pentaxian Join Date: Nov 2014 Location: South Bend, IN, USA Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 23,180	Originally posted by repaap Well it is in finnish, but you there is also one video in English? you can find several articles about it. here: http://www.magneettimedia.com/sininen-led-valo-on-haitallista-aivoille/ that says that 'blue light is harmful to brains. But it also destroys some cells in eye that can in prolonged use cause partial blindness. Now you don't put that label next to 'buy this screen with amazing colour reproduction' sign. Mobilphones do actually affect our body. Even in user manual they do not engourage people to use phone near their ear while talking. Bluetooth earpeace is recommennded. also keeping it in let's say left jeans pocket, it can reduce your fertility. Not much about cancer, but they have actually proven this much. Some people are really sensitive to electric waves, thus can't use mobile network or mobile phone for example. THEY are sensitive and can have illness. But most of us are not sensitive. it still can(and do) affect us. What do you think about pollution and connection to global heating? lot of people seems to deny that too, or that having some chemicals to preserve food for example, that they are not harmful to us? Believe it or not. This is what is going on. There. Looking on-line, the main issue raised by a Harvard study is that blue light affects sleep. OK, I don't use my camera much near bedtime - bulbs and TV are a much worse issue. Blue light has a dark side - Harvard Health

09-10-2018, 06:08 AM	#43
repaap Pentaxian Join Date: Oct 2010 Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 6,242	Originally posted by reh321 Looking on-line, the main issue raised by a Harvard study is that blue light affects sleep. OK, I don't use my camera much near bedtime - bulbs and TV are a much worse issue. Blue light has a dark side - Harvard Health Yes, that is one of those things. Also there is some about LED bluelight wave lengt killing eye cells, just like UV-waves which our eye can not see, and react, so it makes damage. Things add up. but anyway, that is what it is.

09-10-2018, 06:26 AM	#44
reh321 Pentaxian Join Date: Nov 2014 Location: South Bend, IN, USA Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 23,180	Originally posted by repaap Yes, that is one of those things. Also there is some about LED bluelight wave lengt killing eye cells, just like UV-waves which our eye can not see, and react, so it makes damage. Things add up. but anyway, that is what it is. Remember cold fusion??

09-10-2018, 06:34 AM	#45
normhead Pentaxian Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Near Algonquin Park Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 40,451	Originally posted by reh321 Remember cold fusion?? Ya, you're right, every new identified health risk is just like cold fusion.