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02-28-2020, 03:31 PM   #31
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Tess and I have been camera shopping. We settled on a Panasonic Lumix DMC ZS100. But we were looking for a pocket camera that actually fits in your pocket.

Panasonic ZS100 Review

We'd own 3 1:2.3 cameras. We are tired of the technical deficiencies of the smaller sensor. But we also want a camera that does everything we do on our hikes. The 1 inch sensor looks great. In good light it's resolution is close to a K-3. I'm guessing the diffraction limit is around ƒ5. So our main use will be limited to whatever is less than ƒ5, (250mm equivalent is 5.9) but it's nice to have the extra reach for emergency use.

02-28-2020, 07:28 PM   #32
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QuoteOriginally posted by rawr Quote
For sports or events, where you often need telephoto (ie a long, dark lens) and will be shooting in less than optimal lighting (evening, overcast, poor indoor lighting), decent low-light/high ISO performance is just as (if not more) important than top of the line AF.

In fact, in low-light camera AF will often go flaky, so it can be a double whammy - poor IQ + struggling AF. m4/3's sensors will usually be at a disadvantage here.
Sure, I don't mean to imply that the Oly combo is going to match the D500 that @clackers suggested, but that the overall experience will be on the same level as the OP's Pentax setup.

I feel like because the OP had, in the past, shot college sports, some folks are assuming he'll mostly be doing that again. But he stated that he "out of the photography world for a while" so he wasn't working as a sports photog. So, I am assuming that he is looking at more of a generalist photography kit.

Perhaps he will expound more in a further post...
02-28-2020, 07:39 PM   #33
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QuoteOriginally posted by bwDraco Quote
...

Your thoughts on this?

Draco
I have meet + shoot with handful of Pro switch to Olympus. 2 of them are a kind of famous guys doing wildlife photo, and they all love it. It is a good system and the Autofocus system, the weather seal are very very good too. Though.. I can't wrap my head around its menu system! Hope you will be happy with the switch.
02-29-2020, 03:49 AM   #34
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QuoteOriginally posted by bwDraco Quote
I've looked into the Nikon D500 myself but ultimately decided not to go in that direction because 1) it's still quite large and 2) the D500 is four years old.

It is true that the sensor and EVF used in the otherwise new E-M1 Mark III are not new and have been around for the last several years as well. However, after a trip to B&H to try it out (it was on display with the M.Zuiko 12-100mm f/4 PRO attached), I came away impressed at the performance and compactness of this setup, being not much larger than the Panasonic FZ1000 I've been using the last couple of years. The autofocus, while not flawless, is exceedingly fast in low light and tracks moving targets much better than expected. While I'm pretty sure the Nikon D500 will outperform the E-M1 Mark III in AF and low-light performance, the D500 + 2.8/70-200 combination is substantially heavier than the E-M1.3 + 2.8/40-150 setup.

To be honest, this isn't an easy call. I'm still strongly leaning towards the mirrorless solution but will be looking at other possibilities as well.

Draco
As far as the age goes, the D500 is still pretty cutting edge with regard to auto focus and sensor performance. It isn't like we are churning out new and better sensors every day. I guess I was looking at it more from a cost standpoint where a Sigma/Tamron 70-200 f2.8 plus a D500 is bound to out perform the Olympus EM 1 III and would cost less, but as you say, it would also be heavier and that may be worth the extra expense.

I guess the other thing to mention with regard to Olympus is that they are in much the same boat as Pentax, but perhaps a bit worse, in that the imaging side of their company has consistently lost money over the last ten years. It is likely that they are going to start trimming things on the camera side of things (although their company as a whole is doing quite well) and now might not be the best time to jump into Olympus (Panasonic might be a better choice for micro four thirds gear).

02-29-2020, 11:48 AM   #35
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QuoteOriginally posted by Rondec Quote
As far as the age goes, the D500 is still pretty cutting edge with regard to auto focus and sensor performance. It isn't like we are churning out new and better sensors every day. I guess I was looking at it more from a cost standpoint where a Sigma/Tamron 70-200 f2.8 plus a D500 is bound to out perform the Olympus EM 1 III and would cost less, but as you say, it would also be heavier and that may be worth the extra expense.

I guess the other thing to mention with regard to Olympus is that they are in much the same boat as Pentax, but perhaps a bit worse, in that the imaging side of their company has consistently lost money over the last ten years. It is likely that they are going to start trimming things on the camera side of things (although their company as a whole is doing quite well) and now might not be the best time to jump into Olympus (Panasonic might be a better choice for micro four thirds gear).
D500 with 70-200mm f4 will absolutely "kill" any Olympus camera with equivalent lens in terms of af performance, especially in challenging situations. The EVF from Oly cameras (including E-M1X) is outdated, has lag and in my opinion Oly gear is way overpriced compared to competition. I rather look at Fuji if Sony isn't likable before looking at Oly.
02-29-2020, 12:41 PM   #36
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QuoteOriginally posted by Dan Rentea Quote
D500 with 70-200mm f4 will absolutely "kill" any Olympus camera with equivalent lens in terms of af performance, especially in challenging situations. The EVF from Oly cameras (including E-M1X) is outdated, has lag and in my opinion Oly gear is way overpriced compared to competition. I rather look at Fuji if Sony isn't likable before looking at Oly.
I personally would have a look at Sony. The af performance of the Alpha9 II really impressed me a lot, I found it to be superior to the Nikon D850, and in a different world compared to the K1 II.
02-29-2020, 12:49 PM   #37
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QuoteOriginally posted by WorksAsIntended Quote
I personally would have a look at Sony. The af performance of the Alpha9 II really impressed me a lot, I found it to be superior to the Nikon D850, and in a different world compared to the K1 II.
If he wants light gear, full frame won't help due to heavy and expensive bodies and lenses. But a Sony A6600 with the new Tamron 28-75mm f2.8 and Tamron 70-180mm f2.8 will be superior to Oly in terms of af performance and image quality while keeping the weight quite similar. Same for Fuji... I like Oly, but as I said, in my opinion there are better options for the money.

02-29-2020, 12:55 PM   #38
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QuoteOriginally posted by Dan Rentea Quote
If he wants light gear, full frame won't help due to heavy and expensive bodies and lenses. But a Sony A6600 with the new Tamron 28-75mm f2.8 and Tamron 70-180mm f2.8 will be superior to Oly in terms of af performance and image quality while keeping the weight quite similar. Same for Fuji... I like Oly, but as I said, in my opinion there are better options for the money.
The a9 body is not as big as the d500 you talked about before, at least it feels smaller to me (maybe it isnt in numbers).
The lenses however, well, yeah, I have to agree, those are bigger.
If the 70-180 is at the price rumoured it will be a competitive lense for many. I would still wait for a few reviews about bokeh and such before buying it.

---------- Post added 02-29-20 at 12:56 PM ----------

Just checked back, the a9 is much smaller indeed.
02-29-2020, 01:43 PM   #39
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So... I'll clarify that I'm moving towards nature and wildlife photography. As stated earlier, indoor sports photography is no longer a focus. Reduced size and weight, and high shooting performance, are key. From what I've read, the 20MP Four Thirds sensor is just about as good as the Pentax K-3 II's sensor despite the smaller size, though the pixel count is a bit lower.

Sony looks incredibly tempting to me. Exmor image sensors are the industry standard, and Sony's Real-Time Tracking AF technology is often considered to be the best available in any camera, reflex or mirrorless, but I'm not sure I want to buy into a full-frame system. Besides size and weight, Sony glass tends to be very expensive, more so than Canon and Nikon.

It's still a very hard call to make. Perhaps I'll end up maintaining two mirrorless systems (Micro Four Thirds and Sony Alpha) and selling my Pentax kit? I don't know. For the time being, I still feel M4/3 is the best solution for my needs.

Draco

Last edited by bwDraco; 02-29-2020 at 01:56 PM.
02-29-2020, 02:43 PM   #40
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QuoteOriginally posted by WorksAsIntended Quote
The a9 body is not as big as the d500 you talked about before, at least it feels smaller to me (maybe it isnt in numbers).
The lenses however, well, yeah, I have to agree, those are bigger.
If the 70-180 is at the price rumoured it will be a competitive lense for many. I would still wait for a few reviews about bokeh and such before buying it.

---------- Post added 02-29-20 at 12:56 PM ----------

Just checked back, the a9 is much smaller indeed.
A9 II is smaller and lighter than D500, but it costs 3 times the price of a D500 (4500$ vs. 1500$). Olympus E-M1 Mark II is 1400$ and E-M1 Mark III is 1800$.
02-29-2020, 02:51 PM   #41
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QuoteOriginally posted by bwDraco Quote
[...]

Sony looks incredibly tempting to me. Exmor image sensors are the industry standard, and Sony's Real-Time Tracking AF technology is often considered to be the best available in any camera, reflex or mirrorless, but I'm not sure I want to buy into a full-frame system. Besides size and weight, Sony glass tends to be very expensive, more so than Canon and Nikon.

[...]

Draco
Well, if you look at the z mount lenses or rf mount lenses its quite the opposite imho.
Also the third party lenses available for e mount are immensly, partly because e mount has an open documentation.

Generally speaking, all mirrorless mounts are more expensive than the older dslr mounts.

I am not trying to talk you into Sony. For the mirrorless market a lot of changes will be comming soon with the z8 and z1 (?), R5, R6 and a lot of new lenses on the horizon. It is really hard to predict the future of milc right now.
At the current state, the Sigma and Tamron lenses (and a few other third party lenses too) are a real plus for e mount against rf and z mount, but this may change quite soon.
E, rf, z, all those mounts are pretty expensive when going for first party lenses.
02-29-2020, 03:02 PM   #42
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QuoteOriginally posted by bwDraco Quote
So... I'll clarify that I'm moving towards nature and wildlife photography.
Keep in mind that wildlife is demanding, at least if we talk about BIF.

QuoteOriginally posted by bwDraco Quote
As stated earlier, indoor sports photography is no longer a focus. Reduced size and weight, and high shooting performance, are key.
Then again, in my opinion "high shooting performance, are key" will be easier to achieve with D500, Sony A6600 or Fuji X-T3. Even Canon M6 Mark II will outperform E-M1 Mark II or E-M1X but it doesn't have native lenses and that's why I'm not suggesting it.

QuoteOriginally posted by bwDraco Quote
From what I've read, the 20MP Four Thirds sensor is just about as good as the Pentax K-3 II's sensor despite the smaller size, though the pixel count is a bit lower.
Lower details than K-3 II and close in terms of high ISO. But K-3 II is not known as a high ISO camera. I had it and ISO wasn't something to talk about...

QuoteOriginally posted by bwDraco Quote
Sony looks incredibly tempting to me. Exmor image sensors are the industry standard, and Sony's Real-Time Tracking AF technology is often considered to be the best available in any camera, reflex or mirrorless, but I'm not sure I want to buy into a full-frame system. Besides size and weight, Sony glass tends to be very expensive, more so than Canon and Nikon.
Sony A6600 has quite good tracking, has the support ot Tamron which has quite good lenses at good prices. And there is also Fuji which has good options in APS-C boat. I would take a closer look to Fuji first, then Sony for mirrorless, or at Nikon D500/Canon 90D for DSLR. The 90D with 100-400mm L lens will also make an excelent combo, but you'll need to shoot more carefully with it due to the demanding 36mp sensor.

QuoteOriginally posted by bwDraco Quote
It's still a very hard call to make. Perhaps I'll end up maintaining two mirrorless systems (Micro Four Thirds and Sony Alpha) and selling my Pentax kit? I don't know. For the time being, I still feel M4/3 is the best solution for my needs.

Draco
Why not wait to see how the new Pentax APS-C will look like? It can't be far away...

I'm not saying that Oly can't be the best choice for you, but try to rent it and shoot with it in some difficult scenarious.

Last edited by Dan Rentea; 02-29-2020 at 03:09 PM.
02-29-2020, 03:13 PM   #43
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QuoteOriginally posted by Dan Rentea Quote
I'm moving towards nature and wildlife photography.
Keep in mind that wildlife is demanding, at least if we talk about BIF.
Demanding on the technology, and also the wallet. Long fast primes, big fast zooms, fancy tripods and gimbals. Money pit alert!
02-29-2020, 04:53 PM   #44
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QuoteOriginally posted by rawr Quote
Demanding on the technology, and also the wallet. Long fast primes, big fast zooms, fancy tripods and gimbals. Money pit alert!
It's pretty funny that the Oly 300/4 PRO is larger and heavier than the Pentax DA* 300/4...
02-29-2020, 06:14 PM   #45
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QuoteOriginally posted by bwDraco Quote
So... I'll clarify that I'm moving towards nature and wildlife photography....
This is one of the guy I meet who switched to Olympus and very happy with the system. He is extremely professional. He also uses a Sony full frame mirrorless for pro work outside of wildlife photography. Another extremely good photographer is confidential. Looking at their works, and the way they use the camera system. I pretty sure it can do whatever you want to throw at it when talk about wildlife work.
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