[Class A]

I understand that, but this still means that if this sensor was cropped to what you might call "100 mm-e", you still often cannot get pictures with the same perspective as you could with an actual 100 mm-e lens...

Of course you can. Changing focal length does not change perspective. Neither does cropping. Cropping and zooming are equivalent (module pixel numbers).

Otherwise, it wouldn't be possible to undo a crop (say moving from FF to APS-C) with a change in focal length (say from 43mm to 28mm). Images from a 28mm lens on APS-C lens will look the same as images from a 43mm on FF (provided you adapt other shooting parameters as well). You can view this as turning a 28mm lens into a 43mm lens just by cropping. That's why the link Falk provided is relevant.

[Docrwm]

Here's a photo comparing the 808 sensor to two other sensors

[bossa]

Of course you can. Changing focal length does not change perspective. Neither does cropping. Cropping and zooming are equivalent (module pixel numbers).

Otherwise, it wouldn't be possible to undo a crop (say moving from FF to APS-C) with a change in focal length (say from 43mm to 28mm). Images from a 28mm lens on APS-C lens will look the same as images from a 43mm on FF (provided you adapt other shooting parameters as well). You can view this as turning a 28mm lens into a 43mm lens just by cropping. That's why the link Falk provided is relevant.

Perspective does change when the image is enlarged to fill the output format. Perspective is interactive with the viewer and the moment you magnify the output from the crop relative to the viewer the perspective is changed. Perspective is not something that exists by itself and separate from the viewer.

[kh1234567890]

At some point, all parts of the image will be larger than the circle of confusion and the effective depth of field will be 0 due to the lack of resolution in the source image. Does anyone know how this is accounted for?

Because it is all to do with angles not lengths. As you zoom with your mouse wheel into the classic dof picture of the scale on a ruler you should also be wheeling back in your chair to keep the angle subtended by a feature in the image in your eye the same. In this case you'd fall off the edge of the world at infinity before reaching zero dof

[Ex Finn.]

This is not a camera, it is a phone. We need a new section on forums for ...NOKIA phone takes on cameras.. Or is it a camera.

[jogiba]

There's a saying among photographers that "the best camera is the one that's with you," and for many of us nowadays, that camera happens to be a smartphone too. That's where Nokia's 808 PureView smartphone and its 41-megapixel/1080p camera plans to come in.

Nokia's 808 PureView smartphone packs 41-megapixel camera - latimes.com

[pichur]

When my wife came to me 3 weeks ago and suggested we not purchase a new p&s for my daughter's birthday next month, but instead just get her a pre-paid phone with a camera on it, I knew the p&s market is in for an upsetting trend! You better believe the days of the p&s are limited.

[ElJamoquio]

When my wife came to me 3 weeks ago and suggested we not purchase a new p&s for my daughter's birthday next month, but instead just get her a pre-paid phone with a camera on it, I knew the p&s market is in for an upsetting trend! You better believe the days of the p&s are limited.

Maybe I'm a just off the curve, like most of us here, but I can't imagine going to a beautiful national park and having to use my phone's rather archaic input system to take pictures.

[jogiba]

Maybe I'm a just off the curve, like most of us here, but I can't imagine going to a beautiful national park and having to use my phone's rather archaic input system to take pictures.

Anyone on this forum is not going to travel to a National Park without their main camera but if you are going on a bike ride in your local area you are very likely to have your phone with you.

[ElJamoquio]

Anyone on this forum is not going to travel to a National Park without their main camera but if you are going on a bike ride in your local area you are very likely to have your phone with you.

Believe me, I have many, many, many, camera phone snapshots from my bike rides. Some pretty nice ones actually. OK, a couple of nice ones and lots of terrible ones. But I had the opportunity to take nice pics.

But we're talking in the context of the death of P&S's. I had a P&S that I only rarely took with me on rides, but I still wouldn't think of going to a National Park with just a phone. Even ignoring the image quality... the input method and form factor were hell.

On the other hand, I was just in Yosemite yesterday and I saw people whipping out their cells to take a pic of half dome.

[hcarvalhoalves]

I hope they also put manual control on these cameras.... big plus against smartphones

I still have a 4 MP Samsung compact I got back in 2003 which I've always been fond of because it offered manual controls. I took plenty of good pics with it, and sometimes tweaking aperture, shutter or ISO proved useful, where auto mode only rendered dark, noisy or blurry pics. I wish more manufacturers offered manual controls on their compacts.

[starbase218]

When my wife came to me 3 weeks ago and suggested we not purchase a new p&s for my daughter's birthday next month, but instead just get her a pre-paid phone with a camera on it, I knew the p&s market is in for an upsetting trend! You better believe the days of the p&s are limited.

Am I really the only one here who chooses a phone based on other criteria than what kind of camera it has? The thing is, if you want all that functionality in one device, you have to compromise somewhere. There is a point where you push too much functionality in a single device. That's why there still are separate music/movie players, and why the P&S will not die. Sales may go down as phones get better cameras, but it will still sell.

[Clavius]

Am I really the only one here who chooses a phone based on other criteria than what kind of camera it has? The thing is, if you want all that functionality in one device, you have to compromise somewhere. There is a point where you push too much functionality in a single device. That's why there still are separate music/movie players, and why the P&S will not die. Sales may go down as phones get better cameras, but it will still sell.

Exactly my thoughts. Instead, it should be made easier for seperate devices to 'talk' with each other. The electronics that make a device capable of bluetooth are tiny, with a tiny costprice to go with it. Wifi is only a tad bit bigger and more expensive. A camera that can have it's files accessed by my phone can be easily made. Not everybody will use it, but it would be a great feature for many.

[pichur]

Perhaps some are failing to observe the "next generation" of users. A customer of mine last night whipped out his phone last night to take a pic of his new toy to post on facebook, which he did on the spot after taking the shot, and the image was as good as any point and shoot I have ever seen. Certainly equal to the Nikon P&S we usually use for the same purpose. When I see on the college campus where my son goes to school, all the kids carrying photo phones, it seems obvious the p&s does have a limited sales potential in the future. Simply put, the 20 somethings and under use technology much differently than us 30 somethings and older. Hence the K01. Great idea for the next generation of photographers who will use it as a dslr is used today. The times are a changin'.

[Clavius]

Perhaps some are failing to observe the "next generation" of users. A customer of mine last night whipped out his phone last night to take a pic of his new toy to post on facebook, which he did on the spot after taking the shot, and the image was as good as any point and shoot I have ever seen.

Exactly, but this function would be very usefull to pro's too. Putting WIFI or bluetooth in a DSLR body, or grip, would be a great advantage. If Photographer A is in the field, shooting away, and his colleague at the office is receiving his raw's so he can start editing.

There's really no excuse for not putting such connectivity in all camera's.