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07-04-2012, 07:48 AM   #16
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QuoteOriginally posted by Unsinkable II Quote
And I would look forward to that comparison. It would be very interesting seeing the relative performance within the image circle.

I would hope the Oly produces the better results on a M4/3. Though it can be guaranteed that it will produce inferior results at APS-C and FF.

The FA77 can do all three. The Oly can only do one small one.
One of the initial comments was about lack of vignetting, but I would expect the FA 77 (which is of course designed for full frame) to have minimal vignetting when tested on a four thirds camera as well. As you say, the issue is really the statement "FA 77 killer," not whether or not it is a good lens for micro four thirds cameras.

07-04-2012, 08:17 AM   #17
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QuoteOriginally posted by Unsinkable II Quote
But a flawed comparison needs to be called out.

The majority of the members on this forum probably use APS-C and are aware that their FA50/1.4 won't behave the same on their crop as it would on their film. So, comparing the two stops slower, narrower FOV Oly with the FA77 is disingenuous.
OK, I'll call out the flaws. ƒ/1.8 is ƒ/1.8. This lens isn't "two stops slower". It may provide less DOF at a given aperture when compared to a different lens, 150mm, used on full frame. And that DOF may correspond to using a different 150mm FF lens and stopping it down. But the current lens will have a two stops quicker shutter speed to achieve the same appearance. It isn't slower. It has a different DOF.

And if you can't achieve subject isolation or the more popular "DOF Control" at these distances and apertures, then you aren't trying. So I find complaining about characteristics related to subject isolation, when applied to this lens, to be petulant and irritating.

As for the commentary about how this isn't an FA77 killer, I'll respond that I've enjoyed shooting Olympus more than Pentax ever since I gave µ4/3 a try. When the E-M5 arrived and I could use ISO 6400 again, just like on my K-5, I quickly sold my K-5 and have been determining whether to sell my FA 77 or to keep it for occasional use with my other "lesser" Pentax bodies. So in a real sense, I've found the µ4/3 system to be a winning system over one including the FA77. For me. I'm a two prime shooter, formerly DA40 and FA77, and I hardly ever chose Pentax once I acquired the PL25 and Oly 45. I may even sell the FA77 and use the proceeds to buy the Oly 75.
07-04-2012, 08:26 AM   #18
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If it's anything like the Zuiko 45mm, it's going to produce some seriously nice results...
07-04-2012, 09:30 AM   #19
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QuoteOriginally posted by Zav Quote
Don't call it a 77 killer if you want to avoid the sensor size comparison ;-) Otherwise, it can be a 645 75mm f2:8 killer as well!
Well stated.

It can't be a '77ltd killer' unless it comes in K-mount. On aps-c and FF/35mm. On MFT it's a different (but very good) little beast.

From SLRgear:

"...
The Olympus 75mm ƒ/1.8 is one of the sharpest lenses we've ever tested. It is tack-sharp even wide open at ƒ/1.8, gets a little sharper through to ƒ/8, and stays sharp even stopped down to ƒ/16. At ƒ/22 there is a bit of diffraction limiting that exhibits a little generalized softness."

And I like the quality of the bokeh, form the Robin Wong examples...

.


Last edited by jsherman999; 07-04-2012 at 09:51 AM.
07-04-2012, 10:18 AM   #20
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QuoteOriginally posted by wjjstu Quote
150mm is a bit long for anything more than specialized use IMO. Indoor basketball or volleyball maybe?
For that purpose it maybe is even perfect.
07-04-2012, 10:22 AM   #21
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QuoteOriginally posted by Aegon Quote
OK, I'll call out the flaws. ƒ/1.8 is ƒ/1.8. This lens isn't "two stops slower". It may provide less DOF at a given aperture when compared to a different lens, 150mm, used on full frame. And that DOF may correspond to using a different 150mm FF lens and stopping it down. But the current lens will have a two stops quicker shutter speed to achieve the same appearance. It isn't slower. It has a different DOF.
I see. Let me rephrase. The combination of lens and sensor allows FOUR TIMES LESS LIGHT overall. And the FOV and DOF of 150mm/F3.6. Doesn't sound so super to me.


QuoteOriginally posted by Aegon Quote
And if you can't achieve subject isolation or the more popular "DOF Control" at these distances and apertures, then you aren't trying.
So anyone using anything with a shallower DOF than 150mm/F3.6 is just being lazy? The 85mm/1.4 lenses are for people that don't try?

QuoteOriginally posted by Aegon Quote
So I find complaining about characteristics related to subject isolation, when applied to this lens, to be petulant and irritating.
"Petulant" and "Irritating"? You are too funny! Irritation is borne through petulance. My comments have been based on facts as I know them. You appear to be on an emotional tangent.

QuoteOriginally posted by Aegon Quote
As for the commentary about how this isn't an FA77 killer, I'll respond that I've enjoyed shooting Olympus more than Pentax ever since I gave µ4/3 a try. When the E-M5 arrived and I could use ISO 6400 again, just like on my K-5, I quickly sold my K-5 and have been determining whether to sell my FA 77 or to keep it for occasional use with my other "lesser" Pentax bodies. So in a real sense, I've found the µ4/3 system to be a winning system over one including the FA77. For me. I'm a two prime shooter, formerly DA40 and FA77, and I hardly ever chose Pentax once I acquired the PL25 and Oly 45. I may even sell the FA77 and use the proceeds to buy the Oly 75.
Great. Why are you wasting your time here?

You are certainly not holding back from showing a great deal of bias.

I'm enjoying my wife's RX100 greatly. Sensor size certainly isn't everything, but if I see foolish comments being written, I have an equal right to inject a sense of perspective.
07-04-2012, 10:36 AM   #22
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QuoteQuote:
And I would look forward to that comparison. It would be very interesting seeing the relative performance within the image circle.

I would hope the Oly produces the better results on a M4/3. Though it can be guaranteed that it will produce inferior results at APS-C and FF.

The FA77 can do all three. The Oly can only do one small one.
Exactly... given that the Oly only works on a 4/3, how is it going to "kill" a lens that works on FF and APS-c.

It's more likely the 77 will be an Oly killer. If it's not better, why would anyone buy even one copy? It's heavier, how does that fit with going on a lighter more transportable system?

07-04-2012, 10:54 AM   #23
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I don't have a dog in this fight......I love Oly and Pentax......don't have a 77 Ltd (do have a superb 43Ltd!) or any Oly gear...and want everyone to have just what they want, no matter what it may be.

....I'll just leave it at this.....when Otis, who is fully familiar with the 77Ltd read "77Killer" he laughed so damn hard he almost fell out of his perch 80 feet up in his magnificent Office of Head Squirrel! When he stopped laughing, he suggested that someone might look into having a little "mental evaluation"....and also get acquainted with the "Real World".

I never argue with Otis......easy to see why, the damn Squirrel is smarter than most people!

Regards!
07-04-2012, 01:36 PM   #24
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QuoteOriginally posted by Unsinkable II Quote
I see. Let me rephrase. The combination of lens and sensor allows FOUR TIMES LESS LIGHT overall. And the FOV and DOF of 150mm/F3.6. Doesn't sound so super to me.
And how are you going to use that light? On the Pentax full frame camera? My point here was that you are getting all huffy about the lens being "slow", and I want to be clear that the lens isn't slow.

QuoteOriginally posted by Unsinkable II Quote
So anyone using anything with a shallower DOF than 150mm/F3.6 is just being lazy? The 85mm/1.4 lenses are for people that don't try?
What I'm saying here is that complaining about the 75/1.8 because it can't control DOF is somewhat crazy.

QuoteOriginally posted by Unsinkable II Quote
"Petulant" and "Irritating"? You are too funny! Irritation is borne through petulance
Some people are petulant causing annoyance. You are petulant causing irritation. Petulance is not irritation. Language can be used to communicate.

QuoteOriginally posted by Unsinkable II Quote
Great. Why are you wasting your time here?
I've been wasting only a few minutes. Most of my time here is better spent.

QuoteOriginally posted by Unsinkable II Quote
You are certainly not holding back from showing a great deal of bias.
My biggest point is that ƒ/1.8 is ƒ/1.8. That is a fact, not bias. Equivalent FOV and DOF can be compared all day, but saying that the lens is slower is simply false.
07-04-2012, 01:44 PM   #25
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QuoteOriginally posted by Aegon Quote
And how are you going to use that light? On the Pentax full frame camera? My point here was that you are getting all huffy about the lens being "slow", and I want to be clear that the lens isn't slow.



What I'm saying here is that complaining about the 75/1.8 because it can't control DOF is somewhat crazy.



Some people are petulant causing annoyance. You are petulant causing irritation. Petulance is not irritation. Language can be used to communicate.



I've been wasting only a few minutes. Most of my time here is better spent.



My biggest point is that ƒ/1.8 is ƒ/1.8. That is a fact, not bias. Equivalent FOV and DOF can be compared all day, but saying that the lens is slower is simply false.

The biggest problem that I have with "equivalency" is that people want to have it both ways. They want a 75mm lens on micro four thirds to be the same as a 150mm lens on full frame (which, of course it isn't) and at the same time, they want f1.8 to be f1.8 (which of course, it is). I'm fine with four thirds sensors, I just think you have to understand what truly happens to lens when you mount it on a smaller sized sensor, which is approximately nothing.
07-04-2012, 07:48 PM   #26
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I'm still with Otis......the idea that something has come along that has "Killed the 77Ltd", and I assume, buried it 6 ft under...is just plain absurd and ridiculous. Why does anyone want to invite criticism they must know will come from such a heading? If anyone truly believes such a bizarre statement, they are most certainly not anyone that would receive respect for that belief.......so ....what's the point of such a post?

Maybe "Oly Hits A Home Run"......"Oly Has a New Winner"..... but why does Oly need to kill something? Just wondering.....?

Regards!
07-04-2012, 07:53 PM   #27
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"The new Olympus 75mm F1.8! A wonderful lens!"

Sounds much better in my head. Probably would reduce the amount of arguing in this thread too.
07-04-2012, 07:57 PM   #28
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Um, the lens doesn't bring in 4 times less light, it's exactly the same amount. The image circle compares to the sensor size, so the amount of light never changes on the same sensor.

Seriously, you didn't know that?
07-04-2012, 09:24 PM   #29
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When I take my 90mm lens from my 4X5 to my 5X7 the aperture is exactly the same and the speed of the lens remains the same, otherwise might need a different light meter for each format. What happens is with the 4X5 some of the light that enters the black box ends up not following on the light sensitive material whether it be film or a sensor. But the lens is a 5.6 regardless of what format and if it had slightly larger coverage I could use it on a whole plate which is over twice the size of 4X5 without changing the speed of the lens. It will always be a 5.6 lens.
07-04-2012, 09:29 PM   #30
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we are approaching singularity.... again....
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