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09-16-2012, 12:27 AM   #31
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QuoteOriginally posted by Winder Quote
And it is going to be a huge seller. Sony will finally break through and start gaining market share.
If the RX1 and the Nex 9 are as popular as some expect, the irony will be that the Sony FF DSLRs weren't much of a success, while the Sony mirrorless FF are successful. Perhaps Pentax should keep an eye on sony's success with the mirrorless FF and see if it might be the way forward for them.

09-16-2012, 12:49 AM   #32
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Assualt?
I don't think so, though for Pentaxians w/o a FF option, one might be lead to think so.

It does not change the status quo as SONY has had 2 FF DSLRs before this (A850; A900).
Take up was pretty luke warm for the previous two vs Canikon.

Based on Sony's SLT camera performance vs DSLRs and even APS-C MILCs, I don't see the A99 being able to take on Canikon other than being a brochure comparison champion, which the SLT series have always been tuned up to be (ie. win the layman over by having the spec sheet with the best numbers)

The RX1 is a niche product for the rich enthusiast and maybe a few pros who can justify the price, so I have doubts on market penetration.

The prices for both are nowhere near mainstream.
09-16-2012, 01:40 AM   #33
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So this is the smallest FF digital camera, right?
09-16-2012, 03:00 AM   #34
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As per sonyalpharumour website

QuoteQuote:
The RX1 is not an expensive camera. If you would buy the NEX-7 (APS-C sensor) and the Zeiss 24mm f/1.8 you would have to spend around $2,200. There is “only” a $600″ price difference with the Full Frame RX1.


09-16-2012, 04:53 AM - 1 Like   #35
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"Assualt? I don't think so, though for Pentaxians w/o a FF option, one might be lead to think so. It does not change the status quo as SONY has had 2 FF DSLRs before this (A850; A900). Take up was pretty luke warm for the previous two vs Canikon. "

Yes, but neither one of these new FF models are anything remotely similar to the A850 and A900, not that those were bad bodies at all. What if everyone judged Pentax only on what they put out 2-3 years ago...K-m/K-7?


"Based on Sony's SLT camera performance vs DSLRs and even APS-C MILCs, I don't see the A99 being able to take on Canikon other than being a brochure comparison champion, which the SLT series have always been tuned up to be (ie. win the layman over by having the spec sheet with the best numbers) "

I dont think Sony is trying to do that, hence a difference approach with these two camera models and the rumored FF NEX perhaps by mid 2013.

"The RX1 is a niche product for the rich enthusiast and maybe a few pros who can justify the price, so I have doubts on market penetration. The prices for both are nowhere near mainstream."

With the RX1, there is nothing to compare it to in that category, so it is priced what it is They seem to be selling very well according to the pre-orders. Same with the A99, it is priced just right for what it is, certainly more robust than the D600 and the upcoming 6D.


Either way you look at it and no matter if you like Sony or not, what they are doing is bringing fresh and innovative product out on the market lighting a fire under other companies and the benefits will be for everyone.

Jason

Last edited by Jasvox; 09-16-2012 at 04:59 AM.
09-16-2012, 05:23 AM   #36
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QuoteOriginally posted by hcarvalhoalves Quote
The RX-1 looks like a response to Fuji X-Pro, not to FF DSLRs.

The price is ridiculous too.

EDIT: It's fixed lens, so it doesn't even compete with X-Pro. Meh...
The new hybrid still/video full frame E mount NEX-VG900 would work with any FF/APS-C lens out there with low cost adapters.


Last edited by jogiba; 09-16-2012 at 05:32 AM.
09-16-2012, 07:36 AM - 1 Like   #37
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Yes, but neither one of these new FF models are anything remotely similar to the A850 and A900, not that those were bad bodies at all. What if everyone judged Pentax only on what they put out 2-3 years ago...K-m/K-7?
>> It does more than you'd think.
As I've mentioned, Sony released 2 FF options before this. One was at a great price. CZ glass.
All wrt competitors offerings at that same point of time (so I don't see how you draw that line of argument of Km/K7)

The previous cameras did not make much of a dent on Canikon FF market dominance.

Now, these 2 new offerings don't have that much over Canikon just like before.
The RX1 may catch the attention of some, but ~$2.8k does not fall readily off the hands of most ppl already trying to save of a $1500 advanced APS-C or FF (ie, in the price range of a 5DII; D700; D600 and the A850/A900)

In other words, to go FF, its the same large commitment of money as was just before this with the above listed cameras (ie, 5DII, D700, etc at current prices).
So to play it safe, Canikon will be the prime choice for ppl, since they will be spending a substantial sum.

If the RX1 was the FF NEX, then yes, I'd think it having something significant over Canikon to break the status quo.
But at this moment. No.





With the RX1, there is nothing to compare it to in that category, so it is priced what it is They seem to be selling very well according to the pre-orders. Same with the A99, it is priced just right for what it is, certainly more robust than the D600 and the upcoming 6D.

Either way you look at it and no matter if you like Sony or not, what they are doing is bringing fresh and innovative product out on the market lighting a fire under other companies and the benefits will be for everyone.

>> FF NEX, yes, innovative, something the others don't offer now.
By M mount users alone, I think a FF NEX will already make a killing profit.
SLT FF, RX1, does not bring as much to the market.

RX1 may seem to sell well now, but don't forget that the US has good/lax customer return laws.
Ppl can choose to try and return.
Anyway, ~$2800 is not a small sum.
If you think there will be a sustained high level of buyer interest in a FF compact camera that is your choice to believe it.
I doubt it based on how "easy" it is to part with ~$2800, and how most folks have to save/struggle to get a higher end DSLR/ILC of any brand.
I liken it to the Fuji X100 (not cheap too at launch for a fixed lens aps-c camera)
Be an early adopter and bask in the limelight for a year.
Then be overshadowed by the interchangeable lens versions (ie. Xpro1; XE-1) in such a short span of time.

Last edited by pinholecam; 09-16-2012 at 08:37 AM.
09-16-2012, 07:48 AM   #38
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QuoteOriginally posted by JinDesu Quote
It's a cool concept and at 1500 would probably sell loads...
I'd bet it's going to sell loads anyway, regardless of price.

And then reallity will set in for many buyers and you'll be able to pick one up at a more reasonable cost secondhand. And barely used at that.

09-16-2012, 08:48 AM   #39
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QuoteOriginally posted by hcarvalhoalves Quote
The price is ridiculous too....
Is it? Assume you're paying around $1200 for the Zeiss glass on the front (not unreasonable). Now that leaves $1600 for the body, making the RX1 not only the smallest digital full-frame body ever but also the cheapest
09-16-2012, 09:44 AM   #40
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The Leica 35mm F2.0 lens is $3,195 and I bet that 35mm F2.0 Zeiss quality is great also.
Leica 35mm f/2.0 Summicron M Aspherical Manual Focus Lens 11879
09-16-2012, 09:51 AM   #41
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RX1 looks really nice, for those who can spill that much cash.
09-16-2012, 12:51 PM   #42
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QuoteOriginally posted by pinholecam Quote
Yes, but neither one of these new FF models are anything remotely similar to the A850 and A900, not that those were bad bodies at all. What if everyone judged Pentax only on what they put out 2-3 years ago...K-m/K-7?
>> It does more than you'd think.
As I've mentioned, Sony released 2 FF options before this. One was at a great price. CZ glass.
All wrt competitors offerings at that same point of time (so I don't see how you draw that line of argument of Km/K7)

The previous cameras did not make much of a dent on Canikon FF market dominance.

Now, these 2 new offerings don't have that much over Canikon just like before.
The RX1 may catch the attention of some, but ~$2.8k does not fall readily off the hands of most ppl already trying to save of a $1500 advanced APS-C or FF (ie, in the price range of a 5DII; D700; D600 and the A850/A900)

In other words, to go FF, its the same large commitment of money as was just before this with the above listed cameras (ie, 5DII, D700, etc at current prices).
So to play it safe, Canikon will be the prime choice for ppl, since they will be spending a substantial sum.

If the RX1 was the FF NEX, then yes, I'd think it having something significant over Canikon to break the status quo.
But at this moment. No.





With the RX1, there is nothing to compare it to in that category, so it is priced what it is They seem to be selling very well according to the pre-orders. Same with the A99, it is priced just right for what it is, certainly more robust than the D600 and the upcoming 6D.

Either way you look at it and no matter if you like Sony or not, what they are doing is bringing fresh and innovative product out on the market lighting a fire under other companies and the benefits will be for everyone.

>> FF NEX, yes, innovative, something the others don't offer now.
By M mount users alone, I think a FF NEX will already make a killing profit.
SLT FF, RX1, does not bring as much to the market.

RX1 may seem to sell well now, but don't forget that the US has good/lax customer return laws.
Ppl can choose to try and return.
Anyway, ~$2800 is not a small sum.
If you think there will be a sustained high level of buyer interest in a FF compact camera that is your choice to believe it.
I doubt it based on how "easy" it is to part with ~$2800, and how most folks have to save/struggle to get a higher end DSLR/ILC of any brand.
I liken it to the Fuji X100 (not cheap too at launch for a fixed lens aps-c camera)
Be an early adopter and bask in the limelight for a year.
Then be overshadowed by the interchangeable lens versions (ie. Xpro1; XE-1) in such a short span of time.

I am not planning on buying one, for reasons other than price, but that does not mean it's not a very cool little camera. If they release one with a standard zoom, maybe...Or perhaps they will release a future model with a G series lens for a thousand less?

My 5N is good enough for my needs anyway.

Jason
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