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05-02-2013, 09:55 AM   #1
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Canon 5D II + Canon 50mm f1.2 - advise?

Hi, I am considering getting a digital full-frame camera. As I think waiting for PENTAX FF is just too tiring....
(in the mean time I bought two PENTAX 67 though...sigh)

I am looking for a slightly "outdated" FF camera + a really good prime lens as my full-frame kit.
I like Canon 5D II (~ $1600?) + Canon 50mm f1.2 ($1620), total about $3300? I am not sure where to find good price for the 5D II (new) yet.

Nikon doesn't have AF 50mm f1.2 lens, else I would have prefer Nikon.

I am also thinking accessories (extra batteries, memory cards, will cost several hundred more).

As I am just looking into Canon FF system, did I missed anything? or you would recommend a comparable Nikon offering?

Many thanks!
Lee

05-02-2013, 10:02 AM   #2
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QuoteOriginally posted by LFLee Quote
Hi, I am considering getting a digital full-frame camera. As I think waiting for PENTAX FF is just too tiring....
(in the mean time I bought two PENTAX 67 though...sigh)

I am looking for a slightly "outdated" FF camera + a really good prime lens as my full-frame kit.
I like Canon 5D II (~ $1600?) + Canon 50mm f1.2 ($1620), total about $3300? I am not sure where to find good price for the 5D II (new) yet.

Nikon doesn't have AF 50mm f1.2 lens, else I would have prefer Nikon.

I am also thinking accessories (extra batteries, memory cards, will cost several hundred more).

As I am just looking into Canon FF system, did I missed anything? or you would recommend a comparable Nikon offering?

Many thanks!
Lee
Get a D600 with the 50mm F1.4. Sure it's not a F1.2, but you will get better files. Or even step it up to a D800, it'll still end up being under $3300. Canon does have a few lenses that are better than Nikon's offerings, but IMO Nikon makes up for it with their killer sensors.

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05-02-2013, 10:03 AM   #3
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Wow, I never thought about it, but Nikon is still selling the AI-S lens for 1.2. The 5d2 is a really nice camera, but the AF is lacking. Have you tried the D600 with the 50/1.4 lens? Perhaps that will be sufficient for you(on a full frame). It would save you a ton of money and net you a current camera. The D600 can be had for 1600, from Cameta, as a refurb. You could also buy the Sigma 85/1.4, take a few steps back, and have the same DOF as the 50/1.2(all for less than the 5d2 and the 50/1.2 combo).

Last edited by kenafein; 05-02-2013 at 10:09 AM.
05-02-2013, 10:17 AM   #4
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Thanks for the recommendation... I shall look into the "low cost" FF body.

Eventually, I would like to have Canon 35mm f1.4 (last lens), and Canon 85mm f1.4 (next lens), (+ this 50mm f1.2) making it a 3 prime lenses kit for my full-frame kit. So I need to consider the lenses from Nikon.

Let me see if I can find comparable Nikon offering (and their price) for this 3 focal length, I do like the D800e (but it is too expensive).

Another option, I think is getting lens from Sigma (which offer 35mm, 50mm, and 85mm at f1.4)?

05-02-2013, 10:21 AM   #5
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QuoteOriginally posted by LFLee Quote
Thanks for the recommendation... I shall look into the "low cost" FF body.

Eventually, I would like to have Canon 35mm f1.4 (last lens), and Canon 85mm f1.4 (next lens), (+ this 50mm f1.2) making it a 3 prime lenses kit for my full-frame kit. So I need to consider the lenses from Nikon.

Let me see if I can find comparable Nikon offering (and their price) for this 3 focal length, I do like the D800e (but it is too expensive).

Another option, I think is getting lens from Sigma (which offer 35mm, 50mm, and 85mm at f1.4)?
The Sigma 35/1.4 is being called the best 35mm DSLR lens, ever. You can get it on Nikon or Canon though, so that shouldn't affect your choice of bodies. The refurb D800 is 2350, from Cameta, with a 1 yr Nikon warranty.
05-02-2013, 10:30 AM   #6
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QuoteOriginally posted by LFLee Quote
Hi, I am considering getting a digital full-frame camera. As I think waiting for PENTAX FF is just too tiring....
(in the mean time I bought two PENTAX 67 though...sigh)

I am looking for a slightly "outdated" FF camera + a really good prime lens as my full-frame kit.
I like Canon 5D II (~ $1600?) + Canon 50mm f1.2 ($1620), total about $3300? I am not sure where to find good price for the 5D II (new) yet.

Nikon doesn't have AF 50mm f1.2 lens, else I would have prefer Nikon.

I am also thinking accessories (extra batteries, memory cards, will cost several hundred more).

As I am just looking into Canon FF system, did I missed anything? or you would recommend a comparable Nikon offering?

Many thanks!
Lee
My recommendation would be based on what your shooting needs are and your budget.
Between Nikon and Canon (and I shoot the latter along with Pentax), Canon telephoto lens offerings under $2000 are better quality. If wildlife and sports matter to you, that's a good reason to go with Canon. That said, the 5DM2 has an older and slower AF system so it is recommended for more passive shooting. From what I hear, however, the 5DMk3 has a state-of-the-art AF system.

If wildlife and sports are not highly relevant to your shooting needs, or your budget is tight, then Nikon is also excellent.

M
05-02-2013, 10:39 AM   #7
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QuoteOriginally posted by LFLee Quote
So I need to consider the lenses from Nikon.
Nikon AF-S NIKKOR 35mm f/1.4G Wide-Angle Lens 2198 B&H Photo
Nikon AF-S NIKKOR 85mm f/1.4G Classic Portrait Lens 2195 B&H

Both are great (Canon has a 85mm F1.2, not 1.4 AFAIK), but you could also look at the Sigma 35mm F1.4, which is about half the price and still about as good.


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05-02-2013, 11:34 AM   #8
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Thanks Adam,

Options:
I don't shoot with long lens (DA*60-250 is my longest reach lens), and plan only 3 prime lens (I really like my FA*85 on K5IIs), so I think with FF, the sequence to get the lenses is 50mm, 85mm, 35mm. As 50mm is more versatile.
I put together this, based on price from Amazon.

Comparing "low cost" FF offering from Nikon and Canon w/ these 3 focal lengths:

1. Nikon D600 + 35mm f1.4 + 50mm f1.4 + 85mm f1.4 = $2000 + $1620 + $440 + $1560 = $5620, (Initial "investment" Camera + 50mm = $2440)
2. Canon 6D + 35mm f1.4 + 50mm f1.2 + 85mm f1.2 = $1900 + $1330 + $1620 +$1925 = $6745, (Initial "investment" Camera + 50mm = $3520)
***As Canon has offering of 50mm f1.4 and 85mm f1.8***
3. Canon 6D + 35mm f1.4 + 50mm f1.4 + 85mm f1.8 = $1900 + $1330 + $310 +$365 = $3905, (Initial "investment" Camera + 50mm = $2210)

Using Sigma lenses:
3. Nikon D600 + Sigma 35mm f1.4 + 50mm f1.4 + 85mm f1.4 = $2000 + $900 + $450 + $900 = $4150
4. Canon 6D + Sigma 35mm f1.4 + 50mm f1.4 + 85mm f1.4 = $1900 + $900 + $450 + $900 = $4250

Did I missed anything in my calculation? I can start to see selling of some of my PENTAX lenses, I could put together this system.

Last edited by LFLee; 05-02-2013 at 11:53 AM.
05-03-2013, 06:18 AM   #9
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If I'd be unbiased (I own a 5Dc), I'd go for the Nikon System - sealing, usability and pricing I consider to be better at least for the moment. But why do you want 35/50/85? Would be to close for me - but I don't like that 50mm PoV.
05-03-2013, 08:38 AM   #10
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QuoteOriginally posted by Sinister Quote
If I'd be unbiased (I own a 5Dc), I'd go for the Nikon System - sealing, usability and pricing I consider to be better at least for the moment. But why do you want 35/50/85? Would be to close for me - but I don't like that 50mm PoV.
I agree with the above, except that I like 50mm.

From my perspective: if you are spending 1600 or more for a body, go with Nikon. I like the ergonomics better. The sensors are much better.

But you can get into full frame for 500 with the 5DC, so long as you are seeking the full frame look with reasonable DR and not seeking supreme autofocus. I chose the 5DC route, got a bunch of lenses, and when the 5D2 drops to more reasonable prices then I'll consider an upgrade.

I think 5D2 prices are sitting on a cliff, sure to drop when the next thing comes along.
05-03-2013, 09:20 AM   #11
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QuoteOriginally posted by LFLee Quote
I really like my FA*85 on K5IIs
Then don't you need to look at options ~135mm for equivalent FOV?

Max shutter speed of D600 is 1/4000, depending on your shooting style you could easily hit that limit with fast lenses so add ND filters to the budget if you don't already have them.

I do like your thinking though, last year I put together a used D700 with used 35/2, 50/1.8 and 85/1.8 'D' lenses, essentially a lower budget version of what you plan.

Again depending on your shooting style, it's worth remembering that you can use your FA* glass on a Canon with a focus-confirm adaptor and save a few dollars.

Last edited by digitalCG; 05-03-2013 at 01:23 PM. Reason: minor corection
05-03-2013, 09:43 AM   #12
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hehe, I've the same setup - 5Dc, 35/2, 50/1.8 and 85/1.8 plus a Tamron 17-35 and a Zenitar 16mm Fish...

QuoteOriginally posted by LFLee Quote
Hi, I am considering getting a digital full-frame camera. As I think waiting for PENTAX FF is just too tiring....
What are the reasons you want to have fullframe? I have realized that I hardly "need" it, only a fast 35mm prime really drives me to have FF. Everything else, especially landscape and architecture, I can do way better with Pentax. Though I don't need a fast AF to be fair.

Life would be easier for me if I could easily drop my Pentax gear. I'd have a solid APS-C setup with a 5Dc for primes. But my K5 was a present I am attached to Pentax somehow...
05-04-2013, 09:54 PM   #13
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Or pick up a used Sony A850 or A900 and go the alpha mount route. Ziess glass that autofocuses. Supposedly lots of decent reasonably priced Minolta glass around too.
05-05-2013, 12:10 AM   #14
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It depends on what you want out of FF.
For me, I only want it for the shallower DOF with wider FOV look (usually its my family shots that I prefer using it)
Also, I have a good span of M42 lenses to form a system (17/4; 28/2.8 (mod) 35/3.5; 50/1.7 (mod); 55/1.8; 85/1.9; 135/2.5
I don't need megapixels nor pixel peeping.
The K30 does very well almost all other aspects (AF, DR, handling).


I settled on a 5Dc until a Pentax FF arrives (or not)
Can't argue with the price of one now.
If Pentax does come up with a FF, I either keep this for other LBA or sell it off at rock bottom with little loss, since its already rock bottom.

5Dc and 5DII, AF is poor and imo the K30 betters both, K5IIs will be better.
So if you need better AF, then look at the 6D or D600.
DR is again better on Pentax.


If you need a good overall camera, then look at the newer offerings like D600, 6D.
If you are like me (only want the DOF/FOV thingy), then 5Dc is very little money.
Just get the EF 35/2; 50/1.8 and 85/1.8 and you are done with it. (cheap and good)
There is really little need to go f1.2/1.4 and dig another hole in the pocket for a 'play around system' (mho)

The 5DII is viable too if you don't mind a bit more money.
Its advantages over 5Dc, being enough megapix as most enthusiasts will ever need; LV; video

The advantages of getting a Canon FF :
1. Can mount quite a range of lenses with an adapter
2. Cheapest FF 2nd hand
3. Usually cheap lenses and some relatively affordable 'L' lenses that are good (eg. 135/2; 70-200/4; 17-40; 24-105)
05-06-2013, 08:29 AM   #15
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QuoteOriginally posted by digitalCG Quote
Then don't you need to look at options ~135mm for equivalent FOV?

Max shutter speed of D600 is 1/4000, depending on your shooting style you could easily hit that limit with fast lenses so add ND filters to the budget if you don't already have them.

I do like your thinking though, last year I put together a used D700 with used 35/2, 50/1.8 and 85/1.8 'D' lenses, essentially a lower budget version of what you plan.

Again depending on your shooting style, it's worth remembering that you can use your FA* glass on a Canon with a focus-confirm adaptor and save a few dollars.
I like the 85mm, but often I have to stitch the using several frame to cover more area. So a 85mm on FF I think will have a FOV that I like... thanks for the info on using Pentax glass on Canon - I didnt know you can get focus confirmation. One advantage goes to Canon.

QuoteOriginally posted by Sinister Quote
hehe, I've the same setup - 5Dc, 35/2, 50/1.8 and 85/1.8 plus a Tamron 17-35 and a Zenitar 16mm Fish...

What are the reasons you want to have fullframe? I have realized that I hardly "need" it, only a fast 35mm prime really drives me to have FF. Everything else, especially landscape and architecture, I can do way better with Pentax. Though I don't need a fast AF to be fair.

Life would be easier for me if I could easily drop my Pentax gear. I'd have a solid APS-C setup with a 5Dc for primes. But my K5 was a present I am attached to Pentax somehow...
I want FF for the following reasons: DOF, fast wide angle. Like 31mm prime in APSC really don't have the same feel as on FF.

QuoteOriginally posted by RyanW Quote
Or pick up a used Sony A850 or A900 and go the alpha mount route. Ziess glass that autofocuses. Supposedly lots of decent reasonably priced Minolta glass around too.
Sony.... not a fan of their camera design. I can tolerate Nikon and Canon, but not sony.

QuoteOriginally posted by pinholecam Quote
It depends on what you want out of FF.
For me, I only want it for the shallower DOF with wider FOV look (usually its my family shots that I prefer using it)
Also, I have a good span of M42 lenses to form a system (17/4; 28/2.8 (mod) 35/3.5; 50/1.7 (mod); 55/1.8; 85/1.9; 135/2.5
I don't need megapixels nor pixel peeping.
The K30 does very well almost all other aspects (AF, DR, handling).


I settled on a 5Dc until a Pentax FF arrives (or not)
Can't argue with the price of one now.
If Pentax does come up with a FF, I either keep this for other LBA or sell it off at rock bottom with little loss, since its already rock bottom.

5Dc and 5DII, AF is poor and imo the K30 betters both, K5IIs will be better.
So if you need better AF, then look at the 6D or D600.
DR is again better on Pentax.


If you need a good overall camera, then look at the newer offerings like D600, 6D.
If you are like me (only want the DOF/FOV thingy), then 5Dc is very little money.
Just get the EF 35/2; 50/1.8 and 85/1.8 and you are done with it. (cheap and good)
There is really little need to go f1.2/1.4 and dig another hole in the pocket for a 'play around system' (mho)

The 5DII is viable too if you don't mind a bit more money.
Its advantages over 5Dc, being enough megapix as most enthusiasts will ever need; LV; video

The advantages of getting a Canon FF :
1. Can mount quite a range of lenses with an adapter
2. Cheapest FF 2nd hand
3. Usually cheap lenses and some relatively affordable 'L' lenses that are good (eg. 135/2; 70-200/4; 17-40; 24-105)
Same reason as you why I want a FF. :-) 5Dc ? is that a Canon model name used in other country?

Your suggestion is good... I hope I can borrow a Canon FF and shoot for couple days with the prime lenses I am looking for.

Thanks for all the suggestions. Hope I can make a decision soon!


Lee
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