New entry level Fuji with X-trans sensor

PBandJ · 06-21-2013, 04:45 AM

Pretty similar to the k-01 with a much prettier body.

From http://www.fujirumors.com/
So our sources werer right… I told you ! This is the Fuji X-M1 with no viewfinder and tilting screen. Here are the images via Digicaminfo! And you also see the new 16-50mm f/3.5-5.6 and 27mm f/2.8 lens. Great! This will be Fuji’s entry level X system camera and likely priced at around $600-650 (body only).

The camera will be announced next week on June 25 and feature exactly the same X-E1 and X-PRO1 16 megapixel X-Trans sensor. And as yous ee from the pictures there is also a “WiFi” mark. There will be the new 27mm pancake too and a new firmware update for both, the X-E1 and X PRO 1 cameas.

Last edited by PBandJ; 06-21-2013 at 05:31 AM. Reason: made link clickable

K-9 · 06-21-2013, 05:24 AM

Link?

PBandJ · 06-21-2013, 05:29 AM

Originally posted by K-9

Link?

it/s in the post, but not clickable. here it is again:

Fuji Rumors

Emacs · 06-21-2013, 05:59 AM

There will be bayer sensor camera as well. Hope fuji will abandon this crap xtrans idea: there are better methods of noise reduction.

deadwolfbones · 06-21-2013, 07:56 AM

Can't argue with the X-Trans results.

Rupert · 06-21-2013, 08:58 AM - **1 Like**

Looks just like my X20, a great looking camera with build quality to match its handsome looks. Few cameras have this build quality and "in the hand" feel at anywhere near the price.
I'm not sure I could live with no viewfinder, it renders it useless outside in the bright sun. I hear many say they are just fine with only the LCD in bright sun.....mostly those that are already legally blind.
Regards!

top-quark · 06-21-2013, 09:18 AM

Looks like there's something missing from those lenses - an aperture ring. I've been looking forward to the pancake, but not sure now how it's supposed to work on my X-E1.

deadwolfbones · 06-21-2013, 10:56 AM

Your X-E1 doesn't have a control dial?

top-quark · 06-21-2013, 03:01 PM

Originally posted by deadwolfbones

Your X-E1 doesn't have a control dial?

Well, I kinda wanted Fuji to do a "hyper program" job where the rear dial puts the camera into aperture priority when the aperture ring is set to "A" mode. Looks as though they might have to do this after all to make these new lenses work with the two older bodies. Prototype pancake had a 58mm filter thread but it looks as though the production model will have a 39mm thread, which is a PITA.

By the way, any other Fuji users looking to standardize on 58mm, Fotodiox do a 39->58 step-up ring. This is the only one I've been able to find.

Rupert · 06-23-2013, 03:06 PM

Maybe it's just me....but if it doesn't have a viewfinder it's not a camera it's a phone with no dial tone. This X-M1 is gorgeous, and undoubtedly the same great build quality as my X10/X20, with a fantastic sensor and the ability to select the lens for the job at hand. Still, without a viewfinder, it would be worthless here on those very bright sunny days, which we have at least 85% of the time. Nothing is more frustrating than guessing at what you are trying to shoot. Like a painter wearing a blindfold, it's hit or miss, and mainly miss.

Further, I recently learned another lesson regarding the OVF advantage when shooting inside for fast moving action. The X20 is very fast to focus on moving targets, and the accuracy is excellent......but I was having great difficulty getting the shots I wanted with the LCD. It just seemed impossible to frame your shot and time it with the screen. I switched to the OVF and all of a sudden I was able to get exactly what I was wanting and the information on the OVF let me know if the speed and aperture were where I wanted to be, without ever moving my eye. It made a huge difference in ease of shooting...and makes me conclude that the absence of a viewfinder is a deal killer for me. If they come up with a mountable viewfinder for the X-M1, I might change my mind, even if it is not perfect, just workable. Otherwise, they will need to put some buttons on it and a dial tone......

Regards!

Shooting action with the X20 is a snap using the OVF....
[IMG]

[/IMG]

Although you only get an 85% view through the OVF...you get enough to hit your target...in particular if it is one you can't miss!

[IMG]

[/IMG]

pingflood · 06-24-2013, 12:48 AM

Everything's bigger in Texas, eh?

dylansalt · 06-24-2013, 01:36 PM

Well in Africa can I dare say we get even "brighter sun" lol but the Sony RX100'S LCD in sunny weather mode is easy to see

A bright sunny shot

Rupert · 06-24-2013, 02:10 PM

Quote:
"Well in Africa can I dare say we get even "brighter sun" lol but the Sony RX100'S LCD in sunny weather mode is easy to see."

Well, I'll take your word for it over the DPR review where they noted "Screen hard to see in direct sunshine, despite WhiteMagic technology"

So far I have yet to see any LCD that works around here with your back to the Texas sun. Maybe there are some, but I've never seen a one even come close, but I haven't used an RX100, so I can't rule it out.

As I stated earlier, the OVF is also a treasure for shooting action shots, where you can isolate your moving subject and track it with ease and accuracy not available using the LCD. At least that was my experience. Regardless, whatever works for you or anyone with any camera is what works best.
Can't deny, nor would I want to, that you have a great doggie shot there...and a fine looking doggie!

Regards!

sunny16 · 06-24-2013, 11:11 PM

Originally posted by Rupert

Maybe it's just me....but if it doesn't have a viewfinder it's not a camera it's a phone with no dial tone.

Not every camera has to have OVF/EVF. I am guessing (I don't work for Fuji's development team) that some features have to go to hit lower price points and truthfully, for every one who won't buy a camera without a finder there seem to be many who are happy using their iPhones with their big reflective screens to take the majority of their photos... so I don't know that it is really EVERYONE'S #1 priority.

Don't get me wrong, I really do get your point. I am sure if a person is out shooting in the middle of a sunny day, it probably is difficult with some of these LCD screens. And personally, most of the camera's I buy do have viewfinders (though I've gotten by just fine at times with an LCD only camera.) But to make the comment about a Fuji camera, who is better than most in regards of offering cameras with viewfinders (even some with both an optical and electronic to choose from) seems kind of odd. It's not so much about it being a legitimate argument but it has become almost cliche... see how many comments it takes someone to declare the lack of viewfinder will doom said camera (even if the economics of the industry don't back that up.) Some people care about it; most don't seem to.

Honestly, I'm glad you know what works for you and I don't mean this to be pointed so much specifically at you (Rupert) as much as the comment in general. Full disclosure: I did grow up in Wisconsin where we don't see the sun very often between November and April... so maybe it's just me

Cheers!

Rupert · 06-25-2013, 12:08 AM

Well, there is no doubt that millions and millions...billions even..shoot with the screen on their phones and find it acceptable. However, they don't really have much of a choice, so we don't know if the do it by preference or because they can't do anything else?

I can see where this very handsome Fuji might be a good seller, after all, as you said...plenty don't mind shooting with a LCD screen.

Here is my reason for personal bias, beyond the valid (for me) reasons I have already listed in my point of view.

You see a couple of years back I bought Mrs Rupert this really nice Panny small camera. It was highly rated at the time and among the most expensive too. She wanted something to shoot at parties, gatherings, work, and when we took little trips and I was shooting with my Pentax DSLR. The first few trips out...in the bright sun...she complained she couldn't see the screen. I got her one of those screen cover contraptions to stop the glare. Didn't work worth a damn really....Then I adjusted the screen brightness to the max allowable..it helped, but only a little.
So we were out one day on the river and I was snapping away, getting some nice shots of wildlife etc, while she was complaining that she couldn't see a damn thing to shoot, just a black blob of faint outlines. Perhaps she had been complaining more than I had noticed, or maybe I was not listening all that well, but when I heard her let out a string of words that Mrs Rupert doesn't use with any regularity...or ever...and saw her arm go back and that Panny sail out to the middle of the river and sink like a rock, I knew I would never get her another camera with no viewfinder!
She loves the X10.....it was the next camera I bought her, then promptly took it for myself. When I got the X20, I finally relinquished all rights to her X10 and she has not complained of it a single time. She shot a wedding with it..in the bright sun, and never whimpered a time. One of her shots from that wedding....she got a lot of shots that day and most all were fully useable, or better!
[IMG]

[/IMG]

So, you can see my bias against cameras with no viewfinder.

Just a little tip beyond cameras....cars need to have nice large and plentiful cup holders. Women find this imperative...I just got in after midnight from a trip to the city with Mrs Rupert to shop for her a new car.....Audi TT coupe. I found one just the right color and with the right equipment, every option you could dream of, and a few more. So we drove two hours to look it over, drive it and hopefully, buy it. She loved the color, the interior, the driving, the handling, the options, everything about it! Except the cup holders, they were too few and too little. As we stood there, with me admiring this beautiful little car, I asked her if the cup holder issue was serious enough to kill the deal? She said no, go ahead and buy it, but it might just end up in the river along with that damn camera you bought me a couple of years ago. We came home without the car....I guess we will be looking at some other models....

Best Regards!

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06-21-2013, 04:45 AM	#1
PBandJ Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Washington DC metro area Photos: Gallery Posts: 480	New entry level Fuji with X-trans sensor Pretty similar to the k-01 with a much prettier body. From http://www.fujirumors.com/ So our sources werer right… I told you ! This is the Fuji X-M1 with no viewfinder and tilting screen. Here are the images via Digicaminfo! And you also see the new 16-50mm f/3.5-5.6 and 27mm f/2.8 lens. Great! This will be Fuji’s entry level X system camera and likely priced at around $600-650 (body only). The camera will be announced next week on June 25 and feature exactly the same X-E1 and X-PRO1 16 megapixel X-Trans sensor. And as yous ee from the pictures there is also a “WiFi” mark. There will be the new 27mm pancake too and a new firmware update for both, the X-E1 and X PRO 1 cameas. Last edited by PBandJ; 06-21-2013 at 05:31 AM. Reason: made link clickable

06-21-2013, 05:24 AM	#2
K-9 Veteran Member Join Date: May 2009 Location: USA Photos: Albums Posts: 1,971	Link?

06-21-2013, 05:29 AM	#3
PBandJ Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2013 Location: Washington DC metro area Photos: Gallery Posts: 480 Original Poster	Originally posted by K-9 Link? it/s in the post, but not clickable. here it is again: Fuji Rumors

06-21-2013, 05:59 AM	#4
Emacs Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: Moscow Posts: 1,223	There will be bayer sensor camera as well. Hope fuji will abandon this crap xtrans idea: there are better methods of noise reduction.

06-21-2013, 07:56 AM	#5
deadwolfbones Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: La Crescenta, CA Posts: 7,450	Can't argue with the X-Trans results.

06-21-2013, 08:58 AM - 1 Like	#6
Rupert Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Texas Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 25,123	Looks just like my X20, a great looking camera with build quality to match its handsome looks. Few cameras have this build quality and "in the hand" feel at anywhere near the price. I'm not sure I could live with no viewfinder, it renders it useless outside in the bright sun. I hear many say they are just fine with only the LCD in bright sun.....mostly those that are already legally blind. Regards!

06-21-2013, 09:18 AM	#7
top-quark Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: Aylesbury, Bucks Photos: Albums Posts: 492	Looks like there's something missing from those lenses - an aperture ring. I've been looking forward to the pancake, but not sure now how it's supposed to work on my X-E1.

06-21-2013, 10:56 AM	#8
deadwolfbones Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: La Crescenta, CA Posts: 7,450	Your X-E1 doesn't have a control dial?

06-21-2013, 03:01 PM	#9
top-quark Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: Aylesbury, Bucks Photos: Albums Posts: 492	Originally posted by deadwolfbones Your X-E1 doesn't have a control dial? Well, I kinda wanted Fuji to do a "hyper program" job where the rear dial puts the camera into aperture priority when the aperture ring is set to "A" mode. Looks as though they might have to do this after all to make these new lenses work with the two older bodies. Prototype pancake had a 58mm filter thread but it looks as though the production model will have a 39mm thread, which is a PITA. By the way, any other Fuji users looking to standardize on 58mm, Fotodiox do a 39->58 step-up ring. This is the only one I've been able to find.

06-23-2013, 03:06 PM	#10
Rupert Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Texas Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 25,123	Maybe it's just me....but if it doesn't have a viewfinder it's not a camera it's a phone with no dial tone. This X-M1 is gorgeous, and undoubtedly the same great build quality as my X10/X20, with a fantastic sensor and the ability to select the lens for the job at hand. Still, without a viewfinder, it would be worthless here on those very bright sunny days, which we have at least 85% of the time. Nothing is more frustrating than guessing at what you are trying to shoot. Like a painter wearing a blindfold, it's hit or miss, and mainly miss. Further, I recently learned another lesson regarding the OVF advantage when shooting inside for fast moving action. The X20 is very fast to focus on moving targets, and the accuracy is excellent......but I was having great difficulty getting the shots I wanted with the LCD. It just seemed impossible to frame your shot and time it with the screen. I switched to the OVF and all of a sudden I was able to get exactly what I was wanting and the information on the OVF let me know if the speed and aperture were where I wanted to be, without ever moving my eye. It made a huge difference in ease of shooting...and makes me conclude that the absence of a viewfinder is a deal killer for me. If they come up with a mountable viewfinder for the X-M1, I might change my mind, even if it is not perfect, just workable. Otherwise, they will need to put some buttons on it and a dial tone...... Regards! Shooting action with the X20 is a snap using the OVF.... [IMG] [/IMG] Although you only get an 85% view through the OVF...you get enough to hit your target...in particular if it is one you can't miss! [IMG] [/IMG]

06-24-2013, 12:48 AM	#11
pingflood Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Borås, Sweden Photos: Gallery Posts: 3,169	Everything's bigger in Texas, eh?

06-24-2013, 01:36 PM	#12
dylansalt Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Durban, South Africa Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,052	Well in Africa can I dare say we get even "brighter sun" lol but the Sony RX100'S LCD in sunny weather mode is easy to see A bright sunny shot

06-24-2013, 02:10 PM	#13
Rupert Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Texas Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 25,123	Quote: "Well in Africa can I dare say we get even "brighter sun" lol but the Sony RX100'S LCD in sunny weather mode is easy to see." Well, I'll take your word for it over the DPR review where they noted "Screen hard to see in direct sunshine, despite WhiteMagic technology" So far I have yet to see any LCD that works around here with your back to the Texas sun. Maybe there are some, but I've never seen a one even come close, but I haven't used an RX100, so I can't rule it out. As I stated earlier, the OVF is also a treasure for shooting action shots, where you can isolate your moving subject and track it with ease and accuracy not available using the LCD. At least that was my experience. Regardless, whatever works for you or anyone with any camera is what works best. Can't deny, nor would I want to, that you have a great doggie shot there...and a fine looking doggie! Regards!

06-24-2013, 11:11 PM	#14
sunny16 Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: Maryland, USA Photos: Albums Posts: 309	Originally posted by Rupert Maybe it's just me....but if it doesn't have a viewfinder it's not a camera it's a phone with no dial tone. Not every camera has to have OVF/EVF. I am guessing (I don't work for Fuji's development team) that some features have to go to hit lower price points and truthfully, for every one who won't buy a camera without a finder there seem to be many who are happy using their iPhones with their big reflective screens to take the majority of their photos... so I don't know that it is really EVERYONE'S #1 priority. Don't get me wrong, I really do get your point. I am sure if a person is out shooting in the middle of a sunny day, it probably is difficult with some of these LCD screens. And personally, most of the camera's I buy do have viewfinders (though I've gotten by just fine at times with an LCD only camera.) But to make the comment about a Fuji camera, who is better than most in regards of offering cameras with viewfinders (even some with both an optical and electronic to choose from) seems kind of odd. It's not so much about it being a legitimate argument but it has become almost cliche... see how many comments it takes someone to declare the lack of viewfinder will doom said camera (even if the economics of the industry don't back that up.) Some people care about it; most don't seem to. Honestly, I'm glad you know what works for you and I don't mean this to be pointed so much specifically at you (Rupert) as much as the comment in general. Full disclosure: I did grow up in Wisconsin where we don't see the sun very often between November and April... so maybe it's just me Cheers!

06-25-2013, 12:08 AM	#15
Rupert Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Texas Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 25,123	Well, there is no doubt that millions and millions...billions even..shoot with the screen on their phones and find it acceptable. However, they don't really have much of a choice, so we don't know if the do it by preference or because they can't do anything else? I can see where this very handsome Fuji might be a good seller, after all, as you said...plenty don't mind shooting with a LCD screen. Here is my reason for personal bias, beyond the valid (for me) reasons I have already listed in my point of view. You see a couple of years back I bought Mrs Rupert this really nice Panny small camera. It was highly rated at the time and among the most expensive too. She wanted something to shoot at parties, gatherings, work, and when we took little trips and I was shooting with my Pentax DSLR. The first few trips out...in the bright sun...she complained she couldn't see the screen. I got her one of those screen cover contraptions to stop the glare. Didn't work worth a damn really....Then I adjusted the screen brightness to the max allowable..it helped, but only a little. So we were out one day on the river and I was snapping away, getting some nice shots of wildlife etc, while she was complaining that she couldn't see a damn thing to shoot, just a black blob of faint outlines. Perhaps she had been complaining more than I had noticed, or maybe I was not listening all that well, but when I heard her let out a string of words that Mrs Rupert doesn't use with any regularity...or ever...and saw her arm go back and that Panny sail out to the middle of the river and sink like a rock, I knew I would never get her another camera with no viewfinder! She loves the X10.....it was the next camera I bought her, then promptly took it for myself. When I got the X20, I finally relinquished all rights to her X10 and she has not complained of it a single time. She shot a wedding with it..in the bright sun, and never whimpered a time. One of her shots from that wedding....she got a lot of shots that day and most all were fully useable, or better! [IMG] [/IMG] So, you can see my bias against cameras with no viewfinder. Just a little tip beyond cameras....cars need to have nice large and plentiful cup holders. Women find this imperative...I just got in after midnight from a trip to the city with Mrs Rupert to shop for her a new car.....Audi TT coupe. I found one just the right color and with the right equipment, every option you could dream of, and a few more. So we drove two hours to look it over, drive it and hopefully, buy it. She loved the color, the interior, the driving, the handling, the options, everything about it! Except the cup holders, they were too few and too little. As we stood there, with me admiring this beautiful little car, I asked her if the cup holder issue was serious enough to kill the deal? She said no, go ahead and buy it, but it might just end up in the river along with that damn camera you bought me a couple of years ago. We came home without the car....I guess we will be looking at some other models.... Best Regards!