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10-19-2013, 11:32 AM   #16
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56mm F1.2 coming next year, they are very impressive lenses, I should have really got out and tried some of the Pentax primes but never got around to it.... never had to money....

For some reason I just prefer having the aperture setting on the lens, Might be because I was late to digital, and I preferred my T90 to my EOS1.

Cheers, Steve

10-19-2013, 05:52 PM   #17
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I have been struggling with this for the last 3-4 months. Part of me desperately wants to buy into the X system - 35 f1.4, 18 f2.0, 23 f1.4 - really?!?! amazing lenses and quite small compared to what the K-mount equivalent would have to be. Furthermore, the X-e1 is simply a sexy as hell camera. What I consistently come back to though - I can't bring myself to part with the K-5 and the DA*50-135. I have the DA*16-50, 21mm LTD, DA 35 f2.4 - I could take or leave these, but the 50-135...just can't not have this lens.

I see things going one of three ways:
1. Use the K-5 as a telephoto system, start with DA*50-135, at some time add DA*300, otherwise, buy into X-e1 and rock out on the XF 18-55mm and prime lenses
2. Use Pentax for WR capacity, sell the 21mm & 35mm and buy a X100 or X100s
3. Abandon Pentax altogether and go into the fuij system, including the XF 55-200 as well as prime lenses.

At the moment, options 1 & 2 have the most weight. I really struggle with giving up the DA*50-135.

Last edited by Gareth.Ig; 10-19-2013 at 05:53 PM. Reason: Spelling
10-19-2013, 06:52 PM - 1 Like   #18
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QuoteOriginally posted by Gareth.Ig Quote
I have been struggling with this for the last 3-4 months. Part of me desperately wants to buy into the X system - 35 f1.4, 18 f2.0, 23 f1.4 - really?!?! amazing lenses and quite small compared to what the K-mount equivalent would have to be. Furthermore, the X-e1 is simply a sexy as hell camera. What I consistently come back to though - I can't bring myself to part with the K-5 and the DA*50-135. I have the DA*16-50, 21mm LTD, DA 35 f2.4 - I could take or leave these, but the 50-135...just can't not have this lens.

I see things going one of three ways:
1. Use the K-5 as a telephoto system, start with DA*50-135, at some time add DA*300, otherwise, buy into X-e1 and rock out on the XF 18-55mm and prime lenses
2. Use Pentax for WR capacity, sell the 21mm & 35mm and buy a X100 or X100s
3. Abandon Pentax altogether and go into the fuij system, including the XF 55-200 as well as prime lenses.

At the moment, options 1 & 2 have the most weight. I really struggle with giving up the DA*50-135.
What I said.....there is some loss in every system change. I can relate to not wanting to give up the DA*50-135, it is a superb lens, even if the SDM is often an expensive problem. It is a perfect range for a broad array of shooting and has near prime quality throughout the range.
Whatever I may buy, Pentax will be a big part of my system. Like the 50-135, I will never give up my Bigma 50-500, and it is a joy to use on my K5...probably even better on the K3?
Laid up here, I can only shoot through my windows, and there is nothing that Fuji has to allow me to do what I can do with the K5 and Bigma in this circumstance. It makes me realize just how versatile the Pentax is. There are lenses for most everything, and for an amateur like me, more than adequate in selection.

Maybe you have noticed, I shoot some squirrels every so often......the Pentax/Bigma fill my needs, so although I might add a Fuji and a couple of their lenses, I will be staying with Pentax too.

Through my office windows....1/100 (Love the in body Pentax SR!) f6.7 ISO 5000 @ 500mm handheld, cropped about 50% of the original. Not perfect, but plenty good for an old squirrel shooter!
[IMG] [/IMG]
Regards!
10-20-2013, 06:42 AM   #19
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QuoteOriginally posted by Gareth.Ig Quote
the X-e1 is simply a sexy as hell camera
What are you doing with it!?
QuoteOriginally posted by Gareth.Ig Quote
1. Use the K-5 as a telephoto system, start with DA*50-135, at some time add DA*300, otherwise, buy into X-e1 and rock out on the XF 18-55mm and prime lenses
I would choose this option (considering E2, not E1). Pentax' DSLR is a good versatile all around WR system, but sometimes would be nice to have a compacter and lighter option ... (and Sony a7r is too expensive for me).
Sigma SD1M is a special complimentary system, its sharpness is equivalent to 34 Mp and Nikon 800e/Sony a7r is rubbish against it .
To hold three systems is crazy but I will try!
QuoteOriginally posted by Rupert Quote
I shoot some squirrels every so often...the Pentax/Bigma fill my needs
Hmm, no any privacy for squirrels around!

10-20-2013, 07:25 AM   #20
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You have my sympathy... one of the reasons I stay with Pentax, is it's absolutely mind numbing looking at alternatives. There are so many with so many different features. I just don't care to figure it all out. I'd rather just go out and shoot some pictures.

But is something isn't working for you, far be it from me to try and talk you out of it.

QuoteQuote:
I am slightly leaning to the Fuji because of the enjoyment the X10 give me, plus aperture ring
Well then, what are you waiting for? You've got a Pentax, you don't like it as much as the Fuji... what more needs to be said? IQ schsmI Q, I say. Any modern APS-c 16 Mp APS-c sensor is going to work for you. Buy what brings you joy. In the long run, you'll use it more, get better images with it (just based on more images and being in a better mood when you're shooting.) You can't let your Pentax become your heavy weight around your neck that you just have to use for some reason. Then photography becomes work, and photos become drab and lifeless.
10-20-2013, 11:09 AM   #21
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QuoteOriginally posted by normhead Quote
You can't let your Pentax become your heavy weight around your neck that you just have to use for some reason. Then photography becomes work, and photos become drab and lifeless.
Agree Norm, no one should shoot with a camera that doesn't bring them some joy to use. I think that is why I use my little X10/X20 so often, they bring joy to use......but not necessarily the IQ that I sometimes require. You and Tess turn out some of the best photos posted here at PF, and do it on a regular basis, proving that Pentax is a fully functional system that can deliver superior IQ repeatedly and consistently. I'm not near the shooter you guys are, but I find the same thing, Pentax delivers.
That's not to say that I don't have a desire to play with other toys once in a while, but for a system that I can rely on and always find joy in using, I haven't seen anything better than Pentax.

Regards!
10-20-2013, 11:43 AM   #22
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Don't get me wrong I enjoy my K-r, maybe I should have upgraded earlier/invested in some more glass to get the most out of the camera.
I went out this evening a made sure I used both cameras, not had a chance to compare what I took... but the K-r is a nice camera to use.
Also agree that the Pentax system is a very capable one, and to hold one of the best systems around.
I'm in no hurry, so am going to wait until a review of the K3 comes out, the AA systems sound interesting and am waiting to see results.
The thing that impressive me about the X Trans system is the sharpness with minimum moire.

Cheers Steve

10-20-2013, 12:30 PM   #23
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Just a little thingy I have noticed on several sites, including PF. It appears that many are shooting with various Pentax bodies, but with none of the really superior glass available. I think it leads them to believe that FF is the answer for getting better IQ, when in fact the answer is in getting better lenses. I dallied around a few years before I ventured into the great glass, and then realized immediately that glass can, and usually does, make all the difference in the outcome of your efforts.
The Ltd lenses give superb results, and although a little pricey, well worth the expense. A few of the Sigma and Tamron lenses are also up near the Ltd standards, but are also pricey...just maybe a little less so. Before I would be investing in FF or changing systems, I would be exploring the great Pentax glass available, in the long run it can save you a fortune!

Regards!

For a budget, the best choice might be the DA*50-135. It has a versatile range, is near prime throughout the range, fast and despite some SDM failures, is one of the best Pentax lenses I have used. It will cover a lot of range for the price.

...@ 85mm range...really handy for portraits, let's you get close or back up in limited space.
[IMG] [/IMG]

Last edited by Rupert; 10-20-2013 at 12:43 PM.
10-20-2013, 01:23 PM   #24
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Thanks for the input Rupert been very informative and down to earth, I was expecting a load of "don't do it!".
I normally hang around the 18-35mm range, like to play with my 10-17mm as well for some Marty Feldman vision, did have a telephoto but the boy dropped it... but never used it when I had it!

Cheers, Steve
10-20-2013, 01:42 PM   #25
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If you want to use XPro1 camera, then consider it using as an MF camera — for slow, premeditative work.

I have owned X100, loaned XPro1, and tried X20 too, and they all felt ... cheaper. Than K5, than K7. And are slow. Compared to any recent Pentax camera. Especially the lenses have that feeling of compromised quality. They feel m4/3 plasticky instead of old school SLR feel, full metal construction, manual focus, etc. like my DA Limiteds.

Those cameras have virtues too: that OVF/EVF combo is fantastic. For people who love that, it's wonderful. In the end, that was the only feature I liked in their cameras and that was worrying. The images from the original X100, when focusing works and aperture blades don't stick together, can be really beautiful — good lens optically, but yucky feel when using it.

For those who haven't tried anything better, it may be best thing in the world, but who has tried Pentax or Leica, forget it.

But despite that, I personally think XPro1 is way over-valued, because that camera in terms of operability can be frustrating to the n-th degree. But it may be just perfect for some folks who love slow work. I personally think X100 / X100s may be better than XPro1 as an overall package.

In addition, I don't see XPro1 images any better than K5 images, in any respect. One can get a K5 and a DA Limited of choice for the price of a XPro1 alone.

After K5/K3 league of cameras and DA Limiteds, trying Fuji's stuff felt like stepping down quality wise — considerably. And I'm not looking forward to try any more Fuji's stuff — the quality isn't there. Pentax quality is way above it — and speed, dependability, operability, etc. is a league of its own.

Don't need to mention that I eagerly wait for some retro looking DSLR from Pentax because no, Fuji can't make it as good as Pentax can.

Last edited by Uluru; 10-20-2013 at 04:31 PM.
10-20-2013, 01:52 PM   #26
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QuoteOriginally posted by Uluru Quote
Don't need to mention that I eagerly wait for some retro looking DSLR from Pentax.
Yes they proved they can do it with the MX-1, shame they haven't done a K-01 with similar styling.
What won me over about the X10 when compared to the MX-1 is the manual zoom, so much nicer then the electronic switch jobs.

Cheers, Steve
10-20-2013, 04:37 PM   #27
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QuoteOriginally posted by skankin_giant Quote
Yes they proved they can do it with the MX-1, shame they haven't done a K-01 with similar styling. What won me over about the X10 when compared to the MX-1 is the manual zoom, so much nicer then the electronic switch jobs.
I never took K-01 too seriously. It looks like it was designed with a minimum of effort. Because Pentax simply wasn't interested in another half-baked X-Pro1 or Canon M and call it a new line of cameras.
Instead of a new line announced with a fanfare, they gave us an experiment around the same mount. And therefore I congratulate them for not rising our expectations in vain.

I think many bits and pieces required for a premium product at that time (2011/2012) weren't as good as to invest in them and deliver a killer solution or a new line of products. Plus the company was restructuring and the market in general was in deep plunge.

So I personally think that with the level of tech and achievements signalised in the new K-3, we can expect new cameras that do justice to a new and better design philosophy as well. Only then it makes sense. But before, that was not possible. Or, it was possible, but any more serious attempt (I believe) was a waste of time and money.

Last edited by Uluru; 10-20-2013 at 04:47 PM.
10-20-2013, 04:54 PM   #28
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As someone that used to shoot with dSLRs (K10 > K-7 and now K-5), and now use the Fuji-X cameras (X-Pro1 + X-E1) as my primary system, here are some of my thoughts:

- weather sealing: how often have you NEEDED weathersealing, or do you anticipate shooting in, say, pouring rain, sub-zero temperatures, etc? I've shot with my Fuji-X cameras in light drizzle, and haven't had any issues. Of course, I admit it's better to have weather sealing than not, but for me, I don't think it's that much of an issue
- AF: don't expect the Fuji-X cameras to have the speed of dSLR focusing. Even with all the firmware updates, which has substantially improved the X-Pro1 since launch, dSLR focusing is still faster. That is not to say the Fuji-X focusing is slow, but if you're shooting a lot of fast movement, they're probably not the best choice. Have a look at the Olympus E-M5 and E-M1 cameras if AF speed is important. I do find that for most situations that I shoot in, AF speed is fast enough. And unlike dSLRs where you can have possible front/back focus issues, AF is dead on.
- aperture ring/shutter dial. I had an X100 for a few months before selling that for an X-Pro1, and I think having the physical aperture and shutter controls are definitely one of the big attractions of the Fuji-X cameras. It actually makes using the cameras a fun and enjoyable experience. Something that's definitely got to be experienced to grasp what I'm talking about
- size: stormtech posted the size comparison shot earlier, and from that perspective, the X-Pro1 isn't that much smaller. I was quite surprised myself how big it was when I put my X-Pro1 and K-5 back to back. Height and width wise, if you flattened out the pentaprism hump of the K-5, that's how big the X-Pro1 is. But the X-Pro1 is thinner and just feels that much more compact in the hand. It's also lighter than a dSLR, and the size and weight difference is much appreciated, especially when carrying cameras around for a while.

The Fuji-X cameras are great cameras and I love mine, but they aren't for everyone, for every situation. For most of my shooting, I now shoot X-pro1/X-E1 or Leica M6. But the reasons why I haven't ditched dSLRs completely are for shooting with long glass (70-200/2.8 and the absolutely gorgeous FA* 250-600/5.6), and because they're the right tools for the job when I shoot paid event work.
10-20-2013, 08:01 PM   #29
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QuoteOriginally posted by pop4 Quote
A
- weather sealing: how often have you NEEDED weathersealing, or do you anticipate shooting in, say, pouring rain, sub-zero temperatures, etc? I've shot with my Fuji-X cameras in light drizzle, and haven't had any issues. Of course, I admit it's better to have weather sealing than not, but for me, I don't think it's that much of an issue
... It's also lighter than a dSLR, and the size and weight difference is much appreciated, especially when carrying cameras around for a while.
And we can ask same question for everything: how fast AF one really needs, because X-Pro1 can't focus on anything moving faster than walking speed — but hey, photography isn't about moving subjects alone, isn't it. Etc, etc. Excuses, excuses.

Where do you draw the line in denial of common sense conclusions?

As stated above in different ways, one issue I had with X-Pro1 was definite: that its name isn't right. It's misleading and deceiving. Compared to modern K cameras, it feels plasticky and compromised and that is also why it's lighter. It's easy to gain weight like that — where there is no need to fulfil some real pro cause but pretend.

On the other hand, I have just found out that K-3 is slightly heavier than the K-5 because the steel chassis and mag-alloy were further enhanced on the back of the camera, to make it even sturdier.

That is what I call a real pro approach to things. Yet they call K-3 a semipro camera and X-Pro1 has a pro in its name?

Compared to X-Pro1, both K-5 and K-3 cameras should be Super Pro, dear bro.

Last edited by Uluru; 10-20-2013 at 08:19 PM.
10-20-2013, 08:53 PM   #30
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QuoteOriginally posted by Uluru Quote
And we can ask same question for everything: how fast AF one really needs, because X-Pro1 can't focus on anything moving faster than walking speed.
Please, don't misrepresent your opinion as fact. Evidence: 20120930 - 001 Bicycle Wheelie | Flickr, 20120318 - 006 Formula 1 Australian Grand Prix | Flickr

QuoteOriginally posted by Uluru Quote
As stated above in different ways, one issue I had with X-Pro1 was definite: that its name isn't right. It's misleading and deceiving.
...
That is what I call a real pro approach to things. Yet they call K-3 a semipro camera and X-Pro1 has a pro in its name?
That's marketing, and one area where Pentax has failed quite badly. At the end of the day "pro" is just a label, and even then, "pro" means different things to different people; just do a search on all the threads where people discuss what being a "pro" means

QuoteOriginally posted by Uluru Quote
Compared to modern K cameras, it feels plasticky and compromised and that is also why it's lighter.
And compared to my Leica M6 or Hasselblad Xpan2, my friend's Nikon F2, etc etc, modern K cameras also feel plasticy and compromised, and they're lighter too...
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