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07-17-2014, 02:03 AM - 1 Like   #691
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QuoteOriginally posted by wildman Quote
Are we processing for how it was or how we remember it?
Traditional dilemma for the post processor- do we go for accuracy or feel?

Your version of the night scene looks very noirish, with just a hint of colour. Very stylish.

I quite like forcing night shots to a colour temperature of 5500 - it gives a very warmish look which appeals to me, hence my preference for the former.

I sometimes think photographers are more obsessed about colour temperature than an average person. We get quite emotional about it too. I remember once spending a bit of time with a shot of some flowers in the evening just after rain trying to get the colours to reflect what I felt I saw. Only to have someone immediately criticise me for using the wrong colour temperature setting - apparently this person thinks it should look like I've shot the flowers in broad daylight.

Monet for example rarely paints to the "correct" colour temperature - he almost goes out of the way to capture his impression of the colour of a scene, even to the point where it would appear unnatural to a casual observer.

07-17-2014, 02:33 PM - 1 Like   #692
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#1 Original in Color


DSC07773



#2 B&W conversion

DSC07773-2


#3 Warm Tone Edit

DSC07773-3


The original shot was made with A7 and Rikenon P 50mm f/1.4 @f/1.4, shot in raw, and the original temperature when converted in LR5.5 is 2800 and yet it looks warmer than what I remembered -- I might have remembered wrongly.

I personally like to get the color and tone closer to how I feel/vision/remember in the shooting. I do occasionally go to heavy editing to try to bring back the vision that I have. Out of the above three, I don't have a favorite, each has its own problems as well as merits. I usually like the B&W conversion but something that bugs me on the Cinematic color scene of the shot that I want to salvage in the original color version. I don't exactly like my own edit #3 and I think it is worse than the original. On #3, I tone down the temperature from 2800 to 2500 and work my luck on the Color/Hue/Saturation/Luminance on LR on yellow and orange channel.


PP is a skill that I don't have a good grasp, I wish I have all the technical know-how from Christine, Pinholecam, Michelle and many others. And I especially like the editing from Pinholecam, every picture he publishes in his flickr stream has a wow factor.

Thanks,
Hin

Last edited by hinman; 07-17-2014 at 02:42 PM.
07-17-2014, 03:51 PM - 1 Like   #693
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Some comments below by a dissatisfied A7R user - You guys share many of these concerns?

"Finally Giving Up on Sony A7r

Right, Ive had enough of this bloody camera and its going; Ive decided. Having shot around 800 photos this weekend and come home to find half of them blurry, Ive decided enough is enough and Im getting shot of it. There are so many problems with this camera that using it is so arduous that I simply cannot use it anymore without throwing the damn thing out of the window.

Sony, in their infinite wisdom, have decided to put the ISO dial on a little thumb wheel that is unbelievably loose that any slight wind will turn it and adjust your ISO. When working in low light, like I do for most of my shots, and working in aperture priority, the Auto-ISO setting is invaluable. Whats right next to auto? 50. So, I set my aperture to say f8, then my shutter and ISO adjust to get the right exposure. Sounds great, but there is no way of telling the stupid camera that you want your minimum shutter to be, say 1/60th. So, when you nudged the wheel one click to the right, it changes to ISO 50 with a shutter of around 1/10th. Problem is, with such a clunky shutter, 1/10th sounds no different to 1/100th. I don't have the time to use the c2 button to zoom all the way into the centre of the photo and then thumb scroll out in order to check its sharpness, so I just keep shooting - only to get home and find out yet another shoot was ruined by this awful camera. The last three or so shoots have been ruined, with barely 50% of the images usable from a sharpness perspective. But thats not the only problem with this camera, here is a list!!!

1. Auto ISO changing when thumb wheel is nudged (it sits where your cheek rests).
2. Lenses stop focusing and you need to take them off, take off the adapter, turn the camera off, turn it on, then it works for a few more shots.
3. To review an image, you have to zoom into the image to a pixel level, then spend a lifetime zooming out to the desired level.
4. The menu button is the size of an electron.
5. It confused shutter priority with aperture priority. Set it to A, it lets you adjust the shutter, not the aperture - sometimes.
6. The battery life is shit!
7. The firmware updates from Sony are useless. Lucky if they fix anything remotely problematic.
8. Bracketing is limited to 3.
9. Menu system is awful and stolen from point and shoot camera. Important stuff is buried deep within the menus, superfluous stuff is in the top level.
10. No battery charger, usb cable to camera (so can't use camera whilst spare is on charge.
11. The metering of this camera is a pure guess (one moment it guesses 1/20th, then 1/500th).
12. Only 1 SD slot (its already killed 2 SD cards).
13. Needs an adapter to use any lens of worth.
14. The adapter is huge!
15. Startup time from cold is 4 seconds (even with firmware update).
16. AF is bad!

it takes breathtaking images; but its unusable and those images are rare. Rare in the sense that you have no idea whether its going to be usable or not. This camera is a point and shoot with a professional sensor. Yes, it can work, but its a lottery.

Im not keeping the Sony, its simply not up to the task of a photo shoot. Its a holiday camera, and should be aimed at the consumer level. It simply has cut too many corners to give you such great images in such a small body. I should have known this, but was taken in by the hype.

Seriously disappointed by this camera!

However, when it works, they images are beautiful and those Zeiss lenses...oh I will miss those!"
07-17-2014, 04:25 PM - 1 Like   #694
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2013 Camera of the Year: Sony a7R Sony takes home the gold with a total game changer

My 36mp A7r has the best quality stills of any camera I have used and is the most fun I have had shooting stills.

2013 Camera of the Year: Sony Alpha 7R | Popular Photography | Popular Photography

Why it Won: Brings full-frame quality into lighter, smaller bodies; Best imaging of any ILC camera; Introduces a whole new system for advanced users; Strong, weather-sealed body with great fit and finish; Connectivity includes Wi-Fi and NFC; Almost universal adaptability to other systems’ lenses



---------- Post added 07-17-14 at 07:37 PM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by chezpentax Quote
Some comments below by a dissatisfied A7R user - You guys share many of these concerns?

"Finally Giving Up on Sony A7r

Right, Ive had enough of this bloody camera and its going; Ive decided. Having shot around 800 photos this weekend and come home to find half of them blurry, Ive decided enough is enough and Im getting shot of it. There are so many problems with this camera that using it is so arduous that I simply cannot use it anymore without throwing the damn thing out of the window.

Sony, in their infinite wisdom, have decided to put the ISO dial on a little thumb wheel that is unbelievably loose that any slight wind will turn it and adjust your ISO. When working in low light, like I do for most of my shots, and working in aperture priority, the Auto-ISO setting is invaluable. Whats right next to auto? 50. So, I set my aperture to say f8, then my shutter and ISO adjust to get the right exposure. Sounds great, but there is no way of telling the stupid camera that you want your minimum shutter to be, say 1/60th. So, when you nudged the wheel one click to the right, it changes to ISO 50 with a shutter of around 1/10th. Problem is, with such a clunky shutter, 1/10th sounds no different to 1/100th. I don't have the time to use the c2 button to zoom all the way into the centre of the photo and then thumb scroll out in order to check its sharpness, so I just keep shooting - only to get home and find out yet another shoot was ruined by this awful camera. The last three or so shoots have been ruined, with barely 50% of the images usable from a sharpness perspective. But thats not the only problem with this camera, here is a list!!!

1. Auto ISO changing when thumb wheel is nudged (it sits where your cheek rests).
2. Lenses stop focusing and you need to take them off, take off the adapter, turn the camera off, turn it on, then it works for a few more shots.
3. To review an image, you have to zoom into the image to a pixel level, then spend a lifetime zooming out to the desired level.
4. The menu button is the size of an electron.
5. It confused shutter priority with aperture priority. Set it to A, it lets you adjust the shutter, not the aperture - sometimes.
6. The battery life is shit!
7. The firmware updates from Sony are useless. Lucky if they fix anything remotely problematic.
8. Bracketing is limited to 3.
9. Menu system is awful and stolen from point and shoot camera. Important stuff is buried deep within the menus, superfluous stuff is in the top level.
10. No battery charger, usb cable to camera (so can't use camera whilst spare is on charge.
11. The metering of this camera is a pure guess (one moment it guesses 1/20th, then 1/500th).
12. Only 1 SD slot (its already killed 2 SD cards).
13. Needs an adapter to use any lens of worth.
14. The adapter is huge!
15. Startup time from cold is 4 seconds (even with firmware update).
16. AF is bad!

it takes breathtaking images; but its unusable and those images are rare. Rare in the sense that you have no idea whether its going to be usable or not. This camera is a point and shoot with a professional sensor. Yes, it can work, but its a lottery.

Im not keeping the Sony, its simply not up to the task of a photo shoot. Its a holiday camera, and should be aimed at the consumer level. It simply has cut too many corners to give you such great images in such a small body. I should have known this, but was taken in by the hype.

Seriously disappointed by this camera!

However, when it works, they images are beautiful and those Zeiss lenses...oh I will miss those!"
That person has to be the most clueless person to ever use a camera. Does he live in a group home ?

07-17-2014, 08:16 PM - 2 Likes   #695
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Photototo IMO, sums up the problems of the A7/r very well in his review :
Photototo: Sony Alpha A7 (ILCE-7) and Sony Alpha A7r (ILCE-7r) Part 9 - Final Showdown

No camera is perfect.
Its just getting the info and weighting if it affects you as the user.

To me, the A7 is the best camera for MF lenses at this point in time (warts and all)


1. Auto ISO changing when thumb wheel is nudged (it sits where your cheek rests).
>> Yes its like this, but it can be customized to another button

2. Lenses stop focusing and you need to take them off, take off the adapter, turn the camera off, turn it on, then it works for a few more shots.
>> No comment; not using AF adapters and seldom use the only AF lens I have for A7.

3. To review an image, you have to zoom into the image to a pixel level, then spend a lifetime zooming out to the desired level.
>> A bit silly, yes and there are lots of such little silliness in the A7/r that give me the impression that Sony knows how to make good tech, but not well thought out cameras.

4. The menu button is the size of an electron.
>> Ok to me; But my hands are small


5. It confused shutter priority with aperture priority. Set it to A, it lets you adjust the shutter, not the aperture - sometimes.
>> Perhaps his camera had issues


6. The battery life is shit!
>> Indeed so if using AF lenses with Wifi and pre-AF turned on. (close to 3hrs if not less); and poor battery discipline
I use purely MF lenses at batt lasts 5-6hrs.

7. The firmware updates from Sony are useless. Lucky if they fix anything remotely problematic.
>> Agree.

8. Bracketing is limited to 3.
>> And it its sillier than that. Its in rigid options of 3 frames of 1ev or 2ev (no in-betweens) . 5 frames of 1ev (which ends up to be the same as 3 frames 2ev... duh... )
As I said, good tech, not well thought out photographically


9. Menu system is awful and stolen from point and shoot camera. Important stuff is buried deep within the menus, superfluous stuff is in the top level.
>> Works ok to me (every brand camera menu is a clunk of stuff )

10. No battery charger, usb cable to camera (so can't use camera whilst spare is on charge.
>> Yes; Have to get a 3rd party one on ebay


11. The metering of this camera is a pure guess (one moment it guesses 1/20th, then 1/500th).
>> Metering is good in fact.
Its again the lack of attention to detail photographically speaking that Sony decides that the camera should prefer 1/60 as a default shutter speed if the camera can afford to do it .

12. Only 1 SD slot (its already killed 2 SD cards).
>> Er... just get more cards? Never had and issue.
I hate putting all my eggs in one basket (or SD card) anyway, in case it got corrupted, lost, damaged on a tour.


13. Needs an adapter to use any lens of worth.
>> FE lenses are fine, though limited in range

14. The adapter is huge!
>> So was any DSLR with that adapter built in.


15. Startup time from cold is 4 seconds (even with firmware update).
>> Yes, not too good here.


16. AF is bad!
>> Its ok in good light.
Can go for the wrong thing if its contrast is higher though.





QuoteOriginally posted by chezpentax Quote
Some comments below by a dissatisfied A7R user - You guys share many of these concerns?

"Finally Giving Up on Sony A7r

Right, Ive had enough of this bloody camera and its going; Ive decided. Having shot around 800 photos this weekend and come home to find half of them blurry, Ive decided enough is enough and Im getting shot of it. There are so many problems with this camera that using it is so arduous that I simply cannot use it anymore without throwing the damn thing out of the window.

Sony, in their infinite wisdom, have decided to put the ISO dial on a little thumb wheel that is unbelievably loose that any slight wind will turn it and adjust your ISO. When working in low light, like I do for most of my shots, and working in aperture priority, the Auto-ISO setting is invaluable. Whats right next to auto? 50. So, I set my aperture to say f8, then my shutter and ISO adjust to get the right exposure. Sounds great, but there is no way of telling the stupid camera that you want your minimum shutter to be, say 1/60th. So, when you nudged the wheel one click to the right, it changes to ISO 50 with a shutter of around 1/10th. Problem is, with such a clunky shutter, 1/10th sounds no different to 1/100th. I don't have the time to use the c2 button to zoom all the way into the centre of the photo and then thumb scroll out in order to check its sharpness, so I just keep shooting - only to get home and find out yet another shoot was ruined by this awful camera. The last three or so shoots have been ruined, with barely 50% of the images usable from a sharpness perspective. But thats not the only problem with this camera, here is a list!!!

1. Auto ISO changing when thumb wheel is nudged (it sits where your cheek rests).
2. Lenses stop focusing and you need to take them off, take off the adapter, turn the camera off, turn it on, then it works for a few more shots.
3. To review an image, you have to zoom into the image to a pixel level, then spend a lifetime zooming out to the desired level.
4. The menu button is the size of an electron.
5. It confused shutter priority with aperture priority. Set it to A, it lets you adjust the shutter, not the aperture - sometimes.
6. The battery life is shit!
7. The firmware updates from Sony are useless. Lucky if they fix anything remotely problematic.
8. Bracketing is limited to 3.
9. Menu system is awful and stolen from point and shoot camera. Important stuff is buried deep within the menus, superfluous stuff is in the top level.
10. No battery charger, usb cable to camera (so can't use camera whilst spare is on charge.
11. The metering of this camera is a pure guess (one moment it guesses 1/20th, then 1/500th).
12. Only 1 SD slot (its already killed 2 SD cards).
13. Needs an adapter to use any lens of worth.
14. The adapter is huge!
15. Startup time from cold is 4 seconds (even with firmware update).
16. AF is bad!

it takes breathtaking images; but its unusable and those images are rare. Rare in the sense that you have no idea whether its going to be usable or not. This camera is a point and shoot with a professional sensor. Yes, it can work, but its a lottery.

Im not keeping the Sony, its simply not up to the task of a photo shoot. Its a holiday camera, and should be aimed at the consumer level. It simply has cut too many corners to give you such great images in such a small body. I should have known this, but was taken in by the hype.

Seriously disappointed by this camera!

However, when it works, they images are beautiful and those Zeiss lenses...oh I will miss those!"
07-19-2014, 03:55 PM - 2 Likes   #696
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Point to shoot with a professional sensor eh

yeah just like my other cams , but i don't quite enjoy carrying a heavy DSLR about anymore ,
i don't even use one in the studio now , my a7 is a pleasure to use and does for everything i need it for

it has even giving my love of vintage glass a boost ....not sure if thats a good thing or not

new old lens
Sigmatel 135mm F1.8



One using
Carl Zeiss 35mm F2.4 Flektogon


and
olympus zuiko 85mm f2
07-19-2014, 04:15 PM   #697
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QuoteOriginally posted by Malfunction Quote
Point to shoot with a professional sensor eh

yeah just like my other cams , but i don't quite enjoy carrying a heavy DSLR about anymore ,
i don't even use one in the studio now , my a7 is a pleasure to use and does for everything i need it for

it has even giving my love of vintage glass a boost ....not sure if thats a good thing or not


Nice shots, Mal.
Do you do model shoots every weekend?

Do you use AF lenses in the studio, and how do you cope with the dim lighting AF if you do?

07-19-2014, 04:56 PM   #698
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QuoteOriginally posted by pinholecam Quote
Nice shots, Mal.
Do you do model shoots every weekend?

Do you use AF lenses in the studio, and how do you cope with the dim lighting AF if you do?
Thanks , not every weekend at the moment , but i'm still often in the studio , i only have
two AF lenses ,the 35mm f2.8 and the kit lens , no problems at all using the 35mm , but i find i have to
take my time when i start shooting with kit lens , it can hunt a bit , but i find after a few minutes i get used
to it and its fine ........ my go to lenses in the studio are the 35mm f2.8 and the OM zuiko 85mm f2
07-20-2014, 01:25 AM   #699
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QuoteOriginally posted by pinholecam Quote
6. The battery life is shit!
>> Indeed so if using AF lenses with Wifi and pre-AF turned on. (close to 3hrs if not less); and poor battery discipline
I use purely MF lenses at batt lasts 5-6hrs.

7. The firmware updates from Sony are useless. Lucky if they fix anything remotely problematic.
>> Agree.

8. Bracketing is limited to 3.
>> And it its sillier than that. Its in rigid options of 3 frames of 1ev or 2ev (no in-betweens) . 5 frames of 1ev (which ends up to be the same as 3 frames 2ev... duh... )
As I said, good tech, not well thought out photographically

15. Startup time from cold is 4 seconds (even with firmware update).
>> Yes, not too good here.
Reviewing images: press C2 to zoom to pixel level, Play to zoom out to full size. One button either way.

Bracketing: there's a more flexible bracketing app available for purchase. IMHO this is fair - people seldom use bracketing and advanced interval shooting, so it's okay for Sony to charge (fairly nominal prices I thought) for those options. Of course, some will take the option to have a meltdown ranting about it. Buying an app allows one to use it on up to 10 Sony cameras.

Startup time: a few seconds after replacing the battery, but otherwise instantaneous for me.

Battery life: easily lasts the whole day for me (over 500 shots) with Wi Fi, remote, Pre AF, everything turned on. Have taken well over 1000 shots on one battery.

USB charging: IMHO this is a good idea by Sony. Allows the camera to be charged as long as there is a spare USB port somewhere (even airports are now starting to have USB charging terminals). Anyone who wants faster charging can buy a dedicated battery charger (cost is not really that high) - I bought the BC-QM1 quick charger which can charge up to two batteries simultaneously and it works across all my Sony cameras.

---------- Post added 07-20-2014 at 06:41 PM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by Malfunction Quote
Point to shoot with a professional sensor eh

yeah just like my other cams , but i don't quite enjoy carrying a heavy DSLR about anymore ,
i don't even use one in the studio now , my a7 is a pleasure to use and does for everything i need it for

it has even giving my love of vintage glass a boost ....not sure if thats a good thing or not

new old lens
Sigmatel 135mm F1.8



One using
Carl Zeiss 35mm F2.4 Flektogon


and
olympus zuiko 85mm f2
Wow - all three photos are amazing!
07-20-2014, 03:10 AM   #700
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Hi Christine,

Good to finally meet you on WPD.

Where is the garden where that first series of images was taken? It looks like an interesting place.
07-20-2014, 03:27 AM   #701
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QuoteOriginally posted by rayallen Quote
Hi Christine,

Good to finally meet you on WPD.

Where is the garden where that first series of images was taken? It looks like an interesting place.
Hi Ray - nice to meet you too.

Depending on which picture you were looking at, either Eryldene House in Gordon or Swains Garden in Lindfield.

Swains Garden is an interesting spot for photos. Here is a photo taken of me using the A6000:
07-20-2014, 03:49 PM   #702
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QuoteOriginally posted by Christine Tham Quote
Hi Ray - nice to meet you too.

Depending on which picture you were looking at, either Eryldene House in Gordon or Swains Garden in Lindfield.

Swains Garden is an interesting spot for photos. Here is a photo taken of me using the A6000:
Thank you, Christine. I will check out both of those gardens.
07-21-2014, 07:44 AM - 6 Likes   #703
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CZJ Biotar 75/1.5


A monthly project that I just keep failing to keep up with.
The idea being that rather than spend so much money on gears, I might as well spend a little on a costume and prop for my children.
Weather was never agreeable these past few months or schedule just did not permit.
Finally, packed the bag on Sat, and got my girl out the house to the nearby park.

I had brought a bag of lighting with me, but sometimes, the best light is the god given one.
Opened up a silver umbrella on a lightstand as a reflector and that was it.
07-22-2014, 11:32 AM - 2 Likes   #704
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my first A7r test shot with 70-200mm F4 FE

My UPS guy just delivered my 70-200mm F4 FE so I did a quick test shot of my grandaughter who was up in a tree.


https://www.flickr.com/photos/21376375@N04/14532305039/

07-22-2014, 02:58 PM   #705
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Rowing towards Emerald City
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