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03-19-2014, 06:32 PM   #16
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QuoteOriginally posted by normhead Quote
Maybe this subject has been talked to death and it's ready to be laid to rest.
Next, and third time my DA*50-135 SDM goes out at a cost of over $200 for repair, I will reach out to you for comfort Norm. I know you will be there for me!

Regards!

03-20-2014, 12:30 AM   #17
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QuoteOriginally posted by Rupert Quote
Next, and third time my DA*50-135 SDM goes out at a cost of over $200 for repair, I will reach out to you for comfort Norm. I know you will be there for me!

Regards!
If you have the K3 you could just use screw drive instead.

If you're having the third SDM failure now it will just fail again. Good money after bad.
03-20-2014, 02:49 AM   #18
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QuoteOriginally posted by Rupert Quote
Next, and third time my DA*50-135 SDM goes out at a cost of over $200 for repair, I will reach out to you for comfort Norm. I know you will be there for me!

Regards!
I would suggest converting to screw drive.
03-20-2014, 03:10 AM   #19
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QuoteOriginally posted by Rupert Quote
Where were they when all those Pentax SDM lenses were failing?

Regards!
Well... Mirrors are still flapping? Maybe they could act upon that? Only the Chinese government might say: "What's a Pentax?"

03-20-2014, 03:52 AM - 1 Like   #20
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Thom Hogan's Nikon-oriented "DSLR bodies" blogsite has had this issue and its repercussions dead-on nailed from the get-go. Interesting reading, from a number of perspectives. Also, Roger C. in his pntrs.com/t/TUJGRktHSkJHRkpISUVCRkpOSkVN?url=lensrentals.com blog section had the dirt [😉] on this one correct from the onset of the troubles. It helps when you buy D600's twenty at a time. Rockwell said it was all just typical nonsense from those crazy forum posters. No comment.

---------- Post added 03-20-14 at 06:59 AM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by pinholecam Quote
I would suggest converting to screw drive.
Nikon D600 customers got both AF-S and a "screw drive" from Nikon in the same package.

...So I bought a Pentax K-3 instead (34-year Nikon owner).
03-20-2014, 05:03 AM   #21
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kayaker-J Quote
Thom Hogan's Nikon-oriented "DSLR bodies" blogsite has had this issue and its repercussions dead-on nailed from the get-go. Interesting reading, from a number of perspectives. . . . . .
"What is causing some trouble is that I'm seeing evidence of a typical NikonUSA repair issue: a fair number of cameras end up having to go back a second or third time before Nikon actually repairs the camera. In those cases, Nikon appears to have just cleaned and adjusted the camera the first time it came in, but the user then experienced the same problem a few thousand shots down the line."

Wowsers!
03-20-2014, 05:47 AM   #22
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QuoteOriginally posted by Jonathan Mac Quote
"Next time a Nikon product is defective, you can bet they’ll be recalled or fixed IMMEDIATELY."

Don't count on it, not from Nikon or anyone else.
Maybe you will from Toyota which just got hit with a US$1.2 billion fine.

Toyota to Pay Record $1.2 Billion Fine for Hiding Safety Issues

03-20-2014, 05:51 AM   #23
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QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
"What is causing some trouble is that I'm seeing evidence of a typical NikonUSA repair issue: a fair number of cameras end up having to go back a second or third time before Nikon actually repairs the camera. In those cases, Nikon appears to have just cleaned and adjusted the camera the first time it came in, but the user then experienced the same problem a few thousand shots down the line."

Wowsers!
Re: Wowsers! Yep, how about that. Hence, I decided to cross the Rubicon, ditch the full frame interest for now... and buy a K-3. -- Fred
03-20-2014, 09:13 AM   #24
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Don't want to jinx anything, but my old K20D seems to have been one of the most trouble cameras of any brand ever made. I seldom heard of any problems of significance, and never experienced any myself. So far, from what I have read, the K3, although much more advanced, appears to be mostly trouble free too. However, after a rocky start, a couple of years ago, I bought the K5 and many thousands of shots later have yet to encounter a single glitch.

I am still struggling to make myself hit the Buy Now button on the Fuji X-T1. I've worn out several of them by loading them in and then taking them out of the cart at B&H, so if you get one and find it is slightly worn...you know why!

I think my problem is that I want the Fuji, but know the K3 is a better value and a more broadly functional and more dependable camera. If that damn Fuji just wasn't so great looking I would already own the K3. Every day is going to be the day I decide...and every day a new Fuji X-T1 gets a little more shop worn going in and out of the cart!

Regards!
03-20-2014, 03:55 PM   #25
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QuoteOriginally posted by Rupert Quote
Don't want to jinx anything, but my old K20D seems to have been one of the most trouble cameras of any brand ever made.
Regards!
I assume you meant trouble free, Rupert!
03-20-2014, 04:46 PM   #26
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Give Jim a break. He's old and crippled.
03-20-2014, 09:02 PM   #27
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QuoteOriginally posted by Parallax Quote
Give Jim a break. He's old and crippled.
Yeah, give me another break, there is already the broken ankle and broken foot...what's one more break for an old guy!


Yes.....trouble free! Nothing like proof reading is there!

Regards!...I'll try to do better, but will probably forget about it by morning?
03-22-2014, 01:48 AM   #28
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QuoteOriginally posted by jogiba Quote
Nikon to Fix Camera Flaws Cited by China TV Consumer Show - Bloomberg

But hey DPR gave the D600 an 87% Gold rating !
DPR is passionately kissing Nikon's behind as of some time ago.
But unlike their recent D4s' unboxing feature, they did not do D600's "re-boxing and sending back" feature ...
04-08-2014, 05:10 AM   #29
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It might be worth looking at the kind of issues Nikon might have faced.


Manufacturers have to make predictions on future sales early on and decide carefully whether to redesign a failing product or accept higher warranty repair costs.


The wrong decision can cost them dear.


I have made some assumptions based on a hypothetical product manufactured in Japan and selling in the USA for $650, the true manufacturing cost turns out to be $200


Product manufacturing cost $200
add profit at 30% $260
add exporter profit $338
add export costs $358
add importer costs $465
add warehousing costs $480
add distribution costs $500
add retailer profit $650


expected sales over the lifetime of the product 50,000
expected profit over the lifetime 50,000 x 60 = $3,000,000
expected warranty repair costs over the lifetime of the product 10,000 x 200 = $2,000,000
cost of designing and tooling the product $100,000
expected gross profit from the product $900,000


operating costs -heating lighting wages R+D $500,000
expected net profit from the product $400,000


$400,000 net profit on the line is reasonable, but what happens if the line develops a major issue and just 4% extra warranty fails happen?


Possible cost of extra warranty repairs following unexpected failures 2,000 x 200 = $400,000


The profit on this line is now zero, and the return on investment is $0


The costs of a redesign of a major component and retooling to fix this fault is $50,000 which is now unjustifiable.


Potential losses due to not fixing the fault if significant failures happen 10,000 x 200 = $2,000,000


Do you redesign prematurely and it turns out there wasn't a major issue, do you redesign when its clear theres a problem but the profits have already been eaten up by early failures, or do you gamble that the worst is over and risk the loss of $2 million dollars downsteam if your wrong.


Its not easy being a manufacturer
04-08-2014, 04:14 PM   #30
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Do you really think that a projected ROI of 4% (for what, let's face it, is a D600 surrogate here) makes for a reasonable basis of argument in this thread... considering that in Nikon's case:

1. The D600 and D800 have to be considered THE bread and butter, foundation (profit generating) cameras made for ICL camera enthusiasts, since a) only about 1 buyer in 5 of their low end and mid-line DX DSLRs EVER buys one single lens in addition to the kit lens that came with their cameras? ONE lens, as in ONE purchase, over and out... those 5 people are DONE buying lenses. ...and b) Nikon still, after so many years, shows next to zero interest in supporting DX with lenses, apart from kit zoom options... which might show us something about what they think the ROI potential of crop sensor DSLRs is. That is, in terms of the kind of gear and the personal camera kits of interest to readers here.

By mitigation, maybe those price-y Nikon 1 bits are more profitable than I expect... or maybe not, given the seemingly inevitable appearance of fire sale discounts. 😉

2. Nikon's net ROI from cameras must, of course, come from the full line they manufacture -- including all the dogs in the dying point-and-shoot small sensor category; which in Nikon's case, remains extensive... including an odd proliferation of, and marketing enthusiasm for, new models.

I'd also point out, as a point of reference, that the per unit warranty cost liability in laptop computers (as of about 5 years ago, or so) for a company like Toshiba, making what are considered mainstream, quality examples of the breed, was said by industry insiders to average about $20.

But yes, I do agree with you that it must not be easy being a manufacturer/marketer of DSLRs in these changing times -- since the majors seem to be doing such a darn poor job of the task! But thanks for the interesting fictional example.

Last edited by Kayaker-J; 04-08-2014 at 04:37 PM.
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