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11-23-2014, 05:28 AM - 2 Likes   #91
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For lenses non equipped with an identification chip, Alpha 7 II's in-body stabilisation requires the user to manually enter the lens's focal length, between 8mm and 1,000mm.





11-23-2014, 10:50 AM   #92
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QuoteOriginally posted by Winder Quote
If they were working together I would expect to see the SR based AA filter feature in the Sony line. Sony says the 5-axis IBIS is their own design, but Nikon claims that they make all their own sensors too.

I would be willing to bet the IBIS is an Olympus design that Sony has modified to work with a larger sensor and with the FE-mount. I would also bet that Olympus is designing glass for the FE mount. Sony didn't just give Olympus $400 million out of the kindness. Sony was bleeding financially at the time of the investment, so they were expecting a quick return. For comparison Ricoh bought Pentax for less than half of the money Sony invested into Olympus.
Makes sense. Its been repeated many times how happily surprised Sony was with respect to the enthusiast reaction to their original Nex line. Well, they just expanded that capability to use FF manual lenses with low light via 5 axis IBIS. For landscapers, macro users, what else does one need for manual fousing legacy lenses. Not to mention their own native lenses. I imagine its just a matter of time before they expand this capability to the aps e mount cameras.

The 5-axis technology is not something that other companies like Pentax will have access to unless they license it from Olympus.
11-23-2014, 11:21 AM   #93
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QuoteOriginally posted by philbaum Quote
The 5-axis technology is not something that other companies like Pentax will have access to unless they license it from Olympus.
The 5-axis technology is not something that I believe that Olympus own, It would mostly just be about adding extra accelerometer sensor input to the 3-axis system Pentax use.

But these 2 extra axis do not add much performance to the stabilization unless you shoot macro (and it might add a bit extra stability to video). Translational movement of the camera are usually way to small to affect shots on longer distances.
11-23-2014, 11:27 AM - 1 Like   #94
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Here is a picture of the A7 next to the A7II. My biggest 2 issues with the A7/A7r have been that the grip was too small and it lacked IBIS (that and lenses). The slightly deeper grip, moving the shutter release down, and added IBIS are big changes for me. I will probably pre-order with a Zeiss Loxia.

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Last edited by Winder; 11-23-2014 at 11:46 AM.
11-23-2014, 12:28 PM   #95
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QuoteOriginally posted by Fogel70 Quote
The 5-axis technology is not something that I believe that Olympus own, It would mostly just be about adding extra accelerometer sensor input to the 3-axis system Pentax use.

But these 2 extra axis do not add much performance to the stabilization unless you shoot macro (and it might add a bit extra stability to video). Translational movement of the camera are usually way to small to affect shots on longer distances.

The 3 additional axis are yaw, pitch, and roll via the above Sony ad. One of our Audubon members, long time Canon shooter, recently bought an Olympus OMD model with the 5 axis for a trip to Cuba, and he was very impressed with it. sony claims a 4.5 stop improvement (which is more exaggeration than usual :-))

As you say, its just adding more sensors, but its Sony again jumping ahead of the traditional camera makers - not sure how long before the others catch-up. I wouldn't be surprised if it garners a few more sales for them. Lots of glitz in the Sony offering, they still don't offer f2.8 zooms in FE native mode, and is their WR as good as some other makers - don't know. I've handled 2 of the A7 series, and they are attractive, well ok, dXXn attractive. Seems like Sony has finally found the wedge to open up their market share.
11-23-2014, 12:48 PM   #96
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QuoteOriginally posted by Mistral75 Quote
For lenses non equipped with an identification chip, Alpha 7 II's in-body stabilisation requires the user to manually enter the lens's focal length, between 8mm and 1,000mm.
Just like Pentax.

---------- Post added 11-23-14 at 12:49 PM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by Winder Quote
Here is a picture of the A7 next to the A7II. My biggest 2 issues with the A7/A7r have been that the grip was too small and it lacked IBIS (that and lenses). The slightly deeper grip, moving the shutter release down, and added IBIS are big changes for me. I will probably pre-order with a Zeiss Loxia.
The A7II looks pretty bulky. The deeper grip is nice but I hope the camera is still as easy to carry as the original A7.
11-23-2014, 01:03 PM   #97
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QuoteOriginally posted by philbaum Quote
?7 ? 5-axis SteadyShot INSIDE from Sony: Official Video Release - YouTube

The 3 additional axis are yaw, pitch, and roll via the above Sony ad. One of our Audubon members, long time Canon shooter, recently bought an Olympus OMD model with the 5 axis for a trip to Cuba, and he was very impressed with it. sony claims a 4.5 stop improvement (which is more exaggeration than usual :-))

As you say, its just adding more sensors, but its Sony again jumping ahead of the traditional camera makers - not sure how long before the others catch-up. I wouldn't be surprised if it garners a few more sales for them. Lots of glitz in the Sony offering, they still don't offer f2.8 zooms in FE native mode, and is their WR as good as some other makers - don't know. I've handled 2 of the A7 series, and they are attractive, well ok, dXXn attractive. Seems like Sony has finally found the wedge to open up their market share.
Yaw & Pitch is what all image stabilization system controls (it's what add most image blur in most shots). Shift shake (X and Y) movement are the extra controls that 5-axis image stabilisation add compared to Pentax 3-axis system. As you see in the video it's mainly for macro, as the effect of shift shake grows the higher the magnification of the shot is.

In most shots the difference in performance between a 3-axis and 5-axis stabilization will mostly be in the efficiency of pitch & yaw correction, not the number of axis in the system have. But the 2-3 extra axis (roll, x and y) does not cost much to implement in a "free floating sensor shift" that Pentax was first in using, and that most other manufacturers has later gone over to.

11-23-2014, 01:15 PM   #98
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Does anyone know who produces the SR system that Pentax uses? I mean, Pentax uses third party sensor and shutter system, if I remember right, so what about the SR system? Can we expect another improvement in that regard?
11-23-2014, 02:14 PM   #99
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I believe Pentax SR is an in-house design. Some of the parts in the SR system is of course standard parts (or manufactured by other companies according to Pentax specification).

One thing that improves all the time is the motion sensors, and now when motion sensors are used in about every mobile device, this tech is advancing faster than ever. FI resolution and response time on the motion sensors have improved quite a lot since Pentax started using SR 8 years ago.
And with faster processor in the camera the response time on the SR system can be improved, and more advanced algorithm can be used for higher precision on the SR motion control.
11-23-2014, 04:36 PM   #100
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QuoteQuote:
Originally posted by Winder Quote
Here is a picture of the A7 next to the A7II. My biggest 2 issues with the A7/A7r have been that the grip was too small and it lacked IBIS (that and lenses). The slightly deeper grip, moving the shutter release down, and added IBIS are big changes for me. I will probably pre-order with a Zeiss Loxia.

Mikesul:
The A7II looks pretty bulky. The deeper grip is nice but I hope the camera is still as easy to carry as the original A7.
The A7 II is 599gms vice the A7 which is 474gms. Which is probably a good thing. The FE mount was sort of flexible and loosened up after use. fotodiox was even selling a metal ring to stiffen it up after market. So if they used that weight to strengthen the mount, thats a good thing, and their advertising said something about enhancing the mount or some such vague reference.

Its a half inch thicker but i don't think thats meaningful, seems some folks asked for a beefier grip - probably a good thing.

I believe the K3 weighs in at 800 gms, yep it does - just checked.
11-23-2014, 04:52 PM   #101
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QuoteOriginally posted by Mikesul Quote

The A7II looks pretty bulky. The deeper grip is nice but I hope the camera is still as easy to carry as the original A7.
Based on the photos and specs it's significantly heavier and thicker.

Went out shooting yesterday with my partner - we carried the A7r and FE16-35mm, plus A6000 and SEL10-18mm, so two comparable cameras with comparable focal lengths, but 1 full frame and 1 APS-C.

The A6000/10-18 combo was so much smaller and lighter than the A7r/16-35 combo - with the latter being at the absolute limit of what I would be comfortable carrying around as a walkabout.

I am starting to think maybe I need to go back to APS-C - except the image quality difference always make me go back to the A7r. It's not just the sensor size - FE16-35mm is obviously a significantly better lens compared to SEL1018.
11-23-2014, 04:54 PM   #102
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QuoteOriginally posted by philbaum Quote
The A7 II is 599gms vice the A7 which is 474gms. Which is probably a good thing. The FE mount was sort of flexible and loosened up after use. fotodiox was even selling a metal ring to stiffen it up after market. So if they used that weight to strengthen the mount, thats a good thing, and their advertising said something about enhancing the mount or some such vague reference.

Its a half inch thicker but i don't think thats meaningful, seems some folks asked for a beefier grip - probably a good thing.

I believe the K3 weighs in at 800 gms, yep it does - just checked.
I think the bigger grip is a definite positive. The grip needs to fill the hand, and unless it sticks out farther than the lens its not a problem. My biggest problem with the A7 line was that my hands started to cramp up after an hour of use. It was just not comfortable to use for an extended period of time.

Last edited by Winder; 11-23-2014 at 05:06 PM.
11-23-2014, 06:20 PM   #103
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QuoteOriginally posted by Christine Tham Quote
I don't need it.

It adds weight and size.

Plus there is the possibility of blurring due to over-corrective action. Pentax recommends turning off IBIS when camera mounted on tripod.
Are you a tripod? Wait until you get to your seventies, you will love it. The A7II is about the smallest FF camera out there and it has IBIS. It is lighter then any Canikon too.

---------- Post added 11-23-14 at 07:41 PM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by Christine Tham Quote
Based on the photos and specs it's significantly heavier and thicker.

Went out shooting yesterday with my partner - we carried the A7r and FE16-35mm, plus A6000 and SEL10-18mm, so two comparable cameras with comparable focal lengths, but 1 full frame and 1 APS-C.

The A6000/10-18 combo was so much smaller and lighter than the A7r/16-35 combo - with the latter being at the absolute limit of what I would be comfortable carrying around as a walkabout.

I am starting to think maybe I need to go back to APS-C - except the image quality difference always make me go back to the A7r. It's not just the sensor size - FE16-35mm is obviously a significantly better lens compared to SEL1018.
The A7II is only about 100 grams heavier the the A7R. When I don't use the grip, I add the 100 gram L bracket to my A7R. I agree that the A7R output is better and I use it more then my K5II. I never had IS for the first thirty five of my photography and I still know to hold a camera still. A little extra weight does help me.

Last edited by Big Dave; 11-23-2014 at 06:33 PM.
11-23-2014, 06:52 PM   #104
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Some early views on the camera from various people:

The camera is noticeably heavier.

AF has some elements of A6000 incorporated, but feels like a halfway house.

Will post more as I hear more. I am interested to know how effective the IBIS is, particularly for video.

---------- Post added 11-24-2014 at 01:02 PM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by Big Dave Quote
I never had IS for the first thirty five of my photography and I still know to hold a camera still.
Same here.

At a fast enough shutter speed, I am effectively a tripod. For slow shutter speeds, I like to rely on external aids - leaning on a lamp post etc.

BTW, I have shaky hands and in the last few years is slightly arthritic on both hands so I can't hold anything too heavy. 100g is pretty significant to me - ideally I would like the A7r to shave off 100-200 g in weight, not put it on.
11-23-2014, 09:04 PM   #105
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I feel like a lot of people are missing the niche that this camera is filling for a lot of shooters out there.

1. FF camera that is small and light for travel, hiking etc.

2. Great complementary camera to an existing system for times when you want to go smaller and lighter. The dslr system can be used if you have more demanding conditions (better focus tracking, more fps native f/2.8 zooms)

3. The a7 series makes a great "alt" camera. You can shoot virtually any older prime from any manufacturer and shoot it at it's native focal length. Many of these lenses are inexpensive as well.

4. An easy way to shoot landscapes with your native wide angle lenses, using an adapter, with the excellent Sony 36mp sensor (this is mostly a benefit for canon shooters).

As the line matures it may be more of a stand alone product, but I feel that the current line is a niche that doesn't appeal to everyone and probably isn't the best option for most by itself.
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