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06-14-2016, 09:14 AM   #16
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QuoteOriginally posted by reh321 Quote
Apparently the K-70 has an added processor which is supposed to help in Noise Reduction - but we don't know whether this is applied to RAW or to {processed} JPEG only. Once the camera is out and people have shot actual pictures with it, we'll have a much better understanding of what these ISO numbers actually mean.
I saw and read through part of that thread yesterday. At best the new "accelerator unit" will provide Adobe-level NR, a far cry from the results one can obtain with DXO's PRIME or top-tier, dedicated programs and plugins... and thus a far cry from modern FF cameras.

In fact, if it is impactful at all, I expect it to be a "consumerish" technology that sacrifices much detail for reduced noise. Hopefully users will have the option to disable it.

06-14-2016, 10:24 AM   #17
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QuoteOriginally posted by luftfluss Quote
I saw and read through part of that thread yesterday. At best the new "accelerator unit" will provide Adobe-level NR, a far cry from the results one can obtain with DXO's PRIME or top-tier, dedicated programs and plugins... and thus a far cry from modern FF cameras.

In fact, if it is impactful at all, I expect it to be a "consumerish" technology that sacrifices much detail for reduced noise. Hopefully users will have the option to disable it.
Yes, K-n0 cameras are not top-level cameras; "consumerish" is probably as accurate as any other word. Those of us who regularly carry a camera like that are more likely to have Raw Therapee than to have DXO's PRIME on our computers and are likely to have decided that buying a K-1 would not be appropriate for whatever reasons. None of this detracts from my earlier statement.
QuoteOriginally posted by reh321 Quote
.... Once the camera is out and people have shot actual pictures with it, we'll have a much better understanding of what these ISO numbers actually mean.

Last edited by reh321; 06-14-2016 at 10:38 AM.
06-14-2016, 10:52 AM   #18
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QuoteOriginally posted by luftfluss Quote
I saw and read through part of that thread yesterday. At best the new "accelerator unit" will provide Adobe-level NR, a far cry from the results one can obtain with DXO's PRIME or top-tier, dedicated programs and plugins... and thus a far cry from modern FF cameras.

In fact, if it is impactful at all, I expect it to be a "consumerish" technology that sacrifices much detail for reduced noise. Hopefully users will have the option to disable it.
Why the rush to presume there will be image quality issues, or that the "accelerator unit" will be near worthless, or other assumptions of anticipated problems? Can't we all wait until there's actually K70's to buy and real user pics to post before rushing to judgement?
06-14-2016, 11:21 AM   #19
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QuoteOriginally posted by reh321 Quote
Yes, K-n0 cameras are not top-level cameras; "consumerish" is probably as accurate as any other word. Those of us who regularly carry a camera like that are more likely to have Raw Therapee than to have DXO's PRIME on our computers and are likely to have decided that buying a K-1 would not be appropriate for whatever reasons. None of this detracts from my earlier statement.
K-1 is not "appropriate" for me because it's $1800! And even so, I'm very pleased with my 16MP Pentaxes and don't feel like I'm missing out on much, at least based on my needs and abilites.

QuoteOriginally posted by gatorguy Quote
Why the rush to presume there will be image quality issues, or that the "accelerator unit" will be near worthless, or other assumptions of anticipated problems? Can't we all wait until there's actually K70's to buy and real user pics to post before rushing to judgement?
When it comes to any kind of NR, there are "image quality issues" because a compromise must be reached between noise reduction and detail retention. My "guess" is that if this new unit is more than slightly impactful in adjusting the noise properties of the image, it will remove detail that discriminating users - like many here on PF - would prefer retained.

I'm merely setting my expectation level. If I had been more optimistic, would you chastise me for "rushing to judgement"? Not that I mind, of course - this is all just friendly conversation.

Anyway, in my experience, marketing verbiage just about always exceeds results. And, seeing how much CPU power is required for advanced NR, one can intelligently predict this little wunderchip is not going to be "all that".

06-15-2016, 06:29 AM   #20
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I think when people hear "first dslr" it can infer an amateur photography skill set. I was a little late in the DSLR game, but when I finally purchased one, I was able to take perfect pictures with it in all of about 10 minutes.

I would just keep in mind that some people who say "first dslr" aren't always upgrading from taking phone snapshots only. If someone's coming from a large or medium format film world, it can make sense to start with a full frame DSLR or advanced crop sensor one as your first body.

A couple of posts also inferred he/she was shooting their first wedding. First with a DSLR, but could be their 1,000th overall. I could have shot a wedding the same day I got my first DSLR and I'm sure I would have hit some snags in finding certain controls I needed, but I'm also sure I could have pulled it off.
06-15-2016, 06:35 AM - 1 Like   #21
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QuoteOriginally posted by K-9 Quote
I think when people hear "first dslr" it can infer an amateur photography skill set. I was a little late in the DSLR game, but when I finally purchased one, I was able to take perfect pictures with it in all of about 10 minutes.

I would just keep in mind that some people who say "first dslr" aren't always upgrading from taking phone snapshots only. If someone's coming from a large or medium format film world, it can make sense to start with a full frame DSLR or advanced crop sensor one as your first body.

A couple of posts also inferred he/she was shooting their first wedding. First with a DSLR, but could be their 1,000th overall. I could have shot a wedding the same day I got my first DSLR and I'm sure I would have hit some snags in finding certain controls I needed, but I'm also sure I could have pulled it off.
Then just say that you are experienced, you just haven't used these particular SLRs. No reason to take offense over people's comments. Just the question, K70 versus D610 feels like the sort of question that needs a little more background to sort out anyway -- the two cameras are super different, as far as I am concerned.
06-15-2016, 06:41 AM   #22
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QuoteOriginally posted by Rondec Quote
Then just say that you are experienced, you just haven't used these particular SLRs. No reason to take offense over people's comments. Just the question, K70 versus D610 feels like the sort of question that needs a little more background to sort out anyway -- the two cameras are super different, as far as I am concerned.
They are very different and someone new to digital bodies may not know this if they haven't done a lot of research on their own. We can still point out the differences, even not knowing user's experience, intentions, knowledge, etc.
06-15-2016, 06:50 AM   #23
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QuoteOriginally posted by reh321 Quote
Yes, K-n0 cameras are not top-level cameras; "consumerish" is probably as accurate as any other word. Those of us who regularly carry a camera like that are more likely to have Raw Therapee than to have DXO's PRIME on our computers and are likely to have decided that buying a K-1 would not be appropriate for whatever reasons. None of this detracts from my earlier statement.
Then there out folks like me who shoot RAW and install stuff like DxO OpticsPro11 Elite because I really do care about capturing the best images I can even tho I have what others might call an amateur's camera, and admittedly amateurish skills.

06-15-2016, 08:40 AM   #24
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QuoteOriginally posted by gatorguy Quote
Then there out folks like me who shoot RAW and install stuff like DxO OpticsPro11 Elite because I really do care about capturing the best images I can even tho I have what others might call an amateur's camera, and admittedly amateurish skills.
And, yet, we agree about what I consider to be my major point:

QuoteOriginally posted by reh321 Quote
... Once the camera is out and people have shot actual pictures with it, we'll have a much better understanding of what these ISO numbers actually mean.
QuoteOriginally posted by gatorguy Quote
Why the rush to presume there will be image quality issues, or that the "accelerator unit" will be near worthless, or other assumptions of anticipated problems? Can't we all wait until there's actually K70's to buy and real user pics to post before rushing to judgement?
06-15-2016, 09:12 AM   #25
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QuoteOriginally posted by gatorguy Quote
Then there out folks like me who shoot RAW and install stuff like DxO OpticsPro11 Elite because I really do care about capturing the best images I can even tho I have what others might call an amateur's camera, and admittedly amateurish skills.
I think many of us are in the same boat as you. All of my cameras have been entry-level or midrange, and often they are nearly a match for yesteryear's "professional" cameras. I'm still the weakest link in my photographic process.
06-15-2016, 10:13 AM   #26
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QuoteOriginally posted by reh321 Quote
And, yet, we agree about what I consider to be my major point:
Yes we do.
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