[pathdoc]

Minolta still exists and won't sell its name. Sony won't sell the tech. Won't happen.

Ah, okay. I see. Never mind.

[The Squirrel Mafia]

Yeah Samsung has still not made an official statement about the end of the nx-mount. They are not at Photokina so I guess they never will.

Funny that they put sooooo much effort in trying to get people to trade their DSLRs for the NX1 only to dump their camera division in the end.

I really hope that Samsung proves us wrong, but that doesn't look like it's going to happen. It's pretty obvious that Samsung has abandoned the camera market. Samsung screwed all those DSLR owners that made the switch, plus other people that took a leap of faith on their mirrorless system. Yeap.

[D1N0]

unny that they put sooooo much effort in trying to get people to trade their DSLRs for the NX1 only to dump their camera division in the end.

That's how big companies operate. The camera division was doing it's thing unknowing corporate would pull the plug on them.

[Nicolas06]

That's how big companies operate. The camera division was doing it's thing unknowing corporate would pull the plug on them.

+1... Big boss decide for reason that no one except them understand to start a new product, stop it or do a reorganization of the whole company.

The problem for Samsung is that when they started to go into the business, more and more camera where sold each year.

MILC was the obvious future but when NX1 finally appeared, we where past the peak and now there less and less sales. Now it is obvious to everybody but it is always easier to explain the past than predict the future. Samsung could have continued on the NX1 line meaning make a REAL lineup of lense (because there nothing really now) and made camera for a few years and maybe in 2-3 years they could be good. In a market that would likely be half of it was last year... It appeated to them they were doomed and they are probably right. It was just not obvious a few years ago.

[Winder]

At this point I still think the A99II is coming. The E-mount was not originally designed for a FF sensor and the size of the mount and short flange distance combine to make it a less than perfect FF platform for professional use. A-mount is a better mount from a lens design standpoint. The larger lenses like the 70-200mm F/2.8 really need bigger bodies to balance well. The A7 line is great for casual photography with a lens like the FE 55mm F/1.8. By the time Sony improves the build quality of the A7 line, adds the much bigger battery needed to power a professional level camera for 800 shots and you add the grip you are right back to the size of an A99. To take the A7rII sensor and put it into a truly professional grade body with the responsiveness and fps that professionals want will take 4x as much processing power and battery. Its much easier to put that into an A99 body.

[BigMackCam]

At this point I still think the A99II is coming.

I do hope you're right. That would keep A-mount lenses in production (it may even encourage development of new ones, or at least make some existing 3rd party lenses available in A-mount), and it would give me a an upgrade path a few years from now

The larger lenses like the 70-200mm F/2.8 really need bigger bodies to balance well.

Yep, agreed... the outgoing A99 is pretty much perfect in terms of size and weight when coupled with a large and heavy 24-70 f/2.8 or 70-200 f/2.8. That kind of setup balances very well indeed...

[philbaum]

I do hope you're right. That would keep A-mount lenses in production (it may even encourage development of new ones, or at least make some existing 3rd party lenses available in A-mount), and it would give me a an upgrade path a few years from now



Yep, agreed... the outgoing A99 is pretty much perfect in terms of size and weight when coupled with a large and heavy 24-70 f/2.8 or 70-200 f/2.8. That kind of setup balances very well indeed...

One thing that might be undercutting A-mount more in the futue is the continued refinement of the Metabone EF to E adapter. The team behind that adapter is very responsive to improving it such that if you buy that adapter, one has access to lots of reasonably priced Canon lenses. While some of the recent A-mount lenses are still high priced. E.g. the 70-400 GII lens is over $2K i believe. With the $300 LAEA4 adapter - thats a fair amount of money.

[Winder]

One thing that might be undercutting A-mount more in the futue is the continued refinement of the Metabone EF to E adapter. The team behind that adapter is very responsive to improving it such that if you buy that adapter, one has access to lots of reasonably priced Canon lenses. While some of the recent A-mount lenses are still high priced. E.g. the 70-400 GII lens is over $2K i believe. With the $300 LAEA4 adapter - thats a fair amount of money.

Adapters have come a long way, but they never seem to preform quite as good as native glass. Sony needs to sell more glass since that is where the money is. The A99II needs to be a body that generates more demand for A-mount glass just as the A7 series did for FF mirrorless glass.

There are a lot of advantages to the A99 AF system and I would like to see it refined an improved. The lenses need to be optimized for the system which Sony has been slowly doing. Sony's mirrorless technology is great, but its still not as fast or as capable as the technology we have in DSLRs. The question is will DSLR manufacturers be able to implement the advantages that mirrorless cameras do have before mirrorless cameras can catch up to DSLRs in terms of speed and performance. The A99 is the closest we have to blending the two technologies, and with enough processing power and batter power it can be the best of both worlds. I don't have any issue with using a good EVF and sometime I like the added control and information I get from an EVF.

[philbaum]

Adapters have come a long way, but they never seem to preform quite as good as native glass. Sony needs to sell more glass since that is where the money is. The A99II needs to be a body that generates more demand for A-mount glass just as the A7 series did for FF mirrorless glass.

There are a lot of advantages to the A99 AF system and I would like to see it refined an improved. The lenses need to be optimized for the system which Sony has been slowly doing. Sony's mirrorless technology is great, but its still not as fast or as capable as the technology we have in DSLRs. The question is will DSLR manufacturers be able to implement the advantages that mirrorless cameras do have before mirrorless cameras can catch up to DSLRs in terms of speed and performance. The A99 is the closest we have to blending the two technologies, and with enough processing power and batter power it can be the best of both worlds. I don't have any issue with using a good EVF and sometime I like the added control and information I get from an EVF.

This is the kind of discussion i always like to have with folks who can objectively and dispassionately see both sides of an issue. One thing i've read about the A99 some time back, was that owners could dial in a focus range limiter from the camera body - how clever.

Back to Sony's e-mirrorless, i've come to the conclusion that there are limitations to mirrorless designs, and i don't know whether they can be circumvented in the future or not. The focus shift that happens when you focus with the lens wide open, then stop down to take the shot is a real issue. Mirrorless really need the light to the sensor for best focusing, yet too much focus shift can adversely affect the image. Right now i have my A7x mirrorless set up to have "setting effects off" for best focus in low light conditions. Then i have customized a button to show what the scene is like at the planned aperture. If one is not in a hurry, it works great. So i still enjoy my A7x camera, but wish Sony would open up the app designs to user groups for customization.

I see occasional references to implementing hybrid view finders in DSLRs so one has the best of both design types. Fuji was only able to accomplish this with one camera, so i have doubts that this can effectively be done in a general application. But niche cameras are OK in my mind.

I hope Sony takes the time to hone and appreciate what they h7ave accomplished - a nicely designed camera is a thing of beauty like any fine tool. Thats what great about companies like Canon, NIkon , Pentax, Ricoh and Fuji, they have some sense of the photography culture.

[GateCityRadio]

A-Mount is dead, just like the Q is dead and the NX is dead. The Sony E-mount and Fuji X mount are the way of the [Mirrorless] future!

[reh321]

Back to Sony's e-mirrorless, i've come to the conclusion that there are limitations to mirrorless designs, and i don't know whether they can be circumvented in the future or not. The focus shift that happens when you focus with the lens wide open, then stop down to take the shot is a real issue. Mirrorless really need the light to the sensor for best focusing, yet too much focus shift can adversely affect the image.

I normally MF my Q-7 stopped down, and their system gives me a good look and good focus peaking under every situation I've tried; I'm kind of surprised that the Sony systems would be focused wide open.

[philbaum]

I normally MF my Q-7 stopped down, and their system gives me a good look and good focus peaking under every situation I've tried; I'm kind of surprised that the Sony systems would be focused wide open.

I'm talking about AF. All mirrorless, i think, need to go to the widest aperture to maximize the light on the sensor, where the focus sensors are located, in low light situations that is. I often chase fog in the evening or early morning when it develops. Focus peaking often doesn't work if there's no light reflections to trigger the peaking effect. Flashlights or the cameras own focus assist light can often be the only thing that works.

---------- Post added 08-24-16 at 09:33 AM ----------

I'm afraid the A-mount to E-mount adaptor is the culprit in the death of the A-mount.

Thats an interesting observation. I wonder if Sony couldn't have done a better job with building those adapters. They are machined and fit well enough, by all accounts i've read and by my own use of the LAEA-3. But to give one example, the focus assist light from the camera will not work if an a-mount adapter is used. There's no way to even manually turn it on. Many of the A-mount lenses are still very pricy and with the LAEA4 running at about $350 new. Combine that cost with sometimes pricey a-mount lenses and one asks why. Especially with the metabones and MC-11 adapters out there. Sony has had their adapters on a month long sale before, and they need to do it again, IMO.

Just checking the price of the LAEA4 adapters and found one used at BH for $199. Just scooped it up. Good price.

[reh321]

I'm talking about AF. All mirrorless, i think, need to go to the widest aperture to maximize the light on the sensor, where the focus sensors are located, in low light situations that is. ...

My comments were based on comments made by osv before his timeout {and subsequent non-return}. He seems to always focus manually, and I didn't take into account the fact that MF methods might differ from AF methods, but one of the great advantages of Sony MILC, according to him, is that it gives him a WYSIWYG view during focusing/framing, and it gives that to him because the lens is stopped down during focusing/framing.

[BigMackCam]

My comments were based on comments made by osv before his timeout {and subsequent non-return}. He seems to always focus manually, and I didn't take into account the fact that MF methods might differ from AF methods, but one of the great advantages of Sony MILC, according to him, is that it gives him a WYSIWYG view during focusing/framing, and it gives that to him because the lens is stopped down during focusing/framing.

I can't recall which Sony camera he uses, but on my Hassy HV / A99, using regular Minolta / Sony A-mount lenses, the aperture is open during focusing - but when you use DOF preview, it simultaneously stops down and adjusts the brightness of the EVF or main LCD so that get an accurate representation of the coming shot. With manual adapted lenses (M42, T-mount preset etc.), you can just leave those in their stopped down state while manually focusing if you wish, as the brightness of view automatically adjusts to compensate.

[philbaum]

I can't recall which Sony camera he uses, but on my Hassy HV / A99, using regular Minolta / Sony A-mount lenses, the aperture is open during focusing - but when you use DOF preview, it simultaneously stops down and adjusts the brightness of the EVF or main LCD so that get an accurate representation of the coming shot. With manual adapted lenses (M42, T-mount preset etc.), you can just leave those in their stopped down state while manually focusing if you wish, as the brightness of view automatically adjusts to compensate.

The Hassy sounds a bit more sophisticated than the Sony at this point. I think (may vary between exposure modes) Sony has two configurations - Setting Effects Off (maximum visibility, wide open) and Shutting Effects On (truest reflection of what will become the actual picture with DOF, etc. - but details in shadows are often hard to see for framing purposes). I mostly have Setting Effects Off for framing reasons, then i push a customized button which gives me "setting effects on" to see what the actual shot will look like.

Really sounds like DSLRs and mirrorless both try to solve the focus shift phenomena, but in different ways depending on when they were designed and the goals of the designing team.

I get the feeling that we haven't seen anything yet as far as radical changes of photography equipment. Companies seem to have trouble bringing new ideas to market - but the "dam" will break at some point