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08-22-2016, 02:19 PM   #31
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@neostyles - you certainly don't seem to like Pentax design very much, judging by your posts in this thread and numerous others over the last few months. But a lot of people (me included) love the way Pentax cameras operate, and we find them very intuitive.

You're on a Pentax-oriented forum website, so members are bound to have some positive bias towards the brand and its products (what would you expect? ). I don't see what you can possibly gain from bashing Pentax here, of all places... I mean, what's the best that can happen??

If you manage to find the info on the a6000 lossless compression update, let us know. I'm sure it's only for later A7-series cameras, but would love to be proven wrong


Last edited by BigMackCam; 08-22-2016 at 03:52 PM.
08-22-2016, 02:21 PM   #32
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QuoteOriginally posted by [quote=neostyles Quote
This is a joke right?
No. And reading the rest of your reply makes me hope you are the one joking. But I won't turn this thread into a back and forth.
Sony is not really popular for a reason. The main reason people have Sony is because they put a good sensor into a small box at a low price, and you can put other brand lenses on it. Basically, Sony can afford to whip out a new camera every few months and take a bunch of losses for that couple of cameras that sell well. Its a completely different approach from Pentax
Oh, and feel free to write a letter to Newson about how great your design trade it, teach him a lesson about how "confusing" green and red buttons are. I'm sure he will appreciate your helpful opinions
08-22-2016, 02:26 PM   #33
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QuoteOriginally posted by neostyles Quote
This is a joke right? The green button is right next to the movie icon on the K3, which would lead people to think that it is somehow related to movie shooting. I figured out of basically how to use my nikon without even really opening the manual. Sure the more advanced things, required a little bit of looking into but I was able to pretty much pick up camera and start shooting from the getgo without having to spend time buried in the manual.

Now, granted we are talking about sony and I found it to not be quite as intuitive as my nikon, but calling pentax user friendly is a stretch. I am a designer by trade.

Compare the d3200 to any entry level dslr from pentax. The D3200 is, designed from the group up, to be for beginners, someone who is is still learning their way around the ins and outs of photography. The pentax is simply a lower speced out option.

Looking at the K3, everything seems to claustrophobic and clustered together. They squeezed everything into the right side of the camera, refusing to use the top part of the camera. Pretty much every brand out there has controls on the top of the camera and this is for a good reason. It lets you do more with the camera one handed.

Look at the pentax flu card and compare it to the built in wi fi on virtually any sony. Tell me flu card that has you opening a browser like something from the 90s is easier to use. Instead of plain english, the menus use numbers for options. This is just the K-30 but my first camera the Istds (whatever it was called did this.)
I mean to be fair, the K3 is designed to have all of the controls available without having to dive into a menu (which sony e-mounts really rely on) and isn't really for a beginner. The NEX cameras had terrible menu systems compared to pentax so it was difficult to change functions quickly. But then again, these are two very different styles of cameras for very different things. On the A6000, the mode dial and e-dial are both very close to each other and are backwards, meaning the e-dial should be where the mode dial is. On the A7 series and A6000 forward they fixed the menu system (which is now very very very similar to pentaxes). The KS-2, K70, and K1 all have built in WiFi now. Better late then never....lol
08-22-2016, 03:50 PM   #34
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QuoteOriginally posted by neostyles Quote
This is a joke right? The green button is right next to the movie icon on the K3, which would lead people to think that it is somehow related to movie shooting. I figured out of basically how to use my nikon without even really opening the manual. Sure the more advanced things, required a little bit of looking into but I was able to pretty much pick up camera and start shooting from the getgo without having to spend time buried in the manual.

Now, granted we are talking about sony and I found it to not be quite as intuitive as my nikon, but calling pentax user friendly is a stretch. I am a designer by trade.

Compare the d3200 to any entry level dslr from pentax. The D3200 is, designed from the group up, to be for beginners, someone who is is still learning their way around the ins and outs of photography. The pentax is simply a lower speced out option.

Looking at the K3, everything seems to claustrophobic and clustered together. They squeezed everything into the right side of the camera, refusing to use the top part of the camera. Pretty much every brand out there has controls on the top of the camera and this is for a good reason. It lets you do more with the camera one handed.

Look at the pentax flu card and compare it to the built in wi fi on virtually any sony. Tell me flu card that has you opening a browser like something from the 90s is easier to use. Instead of plain english, the menus use numbers for options. This is just the K-30 but my first camera the Istds (whatever it was called did this.)
You're welcome to your opinions. I find both my K-30 and my Q-7 to have natural, intuitive controls. I had taken a series of good pictures on each before I read the manual.

08-22-2016, 07:32 PM   #35
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Yeah I don't think the pentax controls are bad at all, not really much different than any other brand SLR (except canon, which I think their e-dial layout is just weird). The sony A7 series has a good button layout and it didn't take me long to figure it out switching from my K5/K7 combo I had at the time. The NEX-5T and A6000 on the other hand were very difficult to learn coming from bodies that had most of the functions available from just a button press. The menus on the NEX-5T are just plain awful, the button layout isn't intuitive at all. Its basically just a point and shoot with a aps-c sensor and interchangeable lenses....and that's pretty much all I use it for these days. I kept having problems on the A6000 with the e-dial placement, I kept turning the mode dial instead and that gets old pretty quick. The menus were a lot better and seemed almost like a copy of the pentax menu system, but that wasn't enough to convince me to keep it. Then the price of the lenses for the A7 combined with Sony skipping the original A7, A7S, A7R for the lossless RAW update really tipped me back to Pentax. I sold the A7, 35/2.8, and 55/1.8 and was able to buy a K3 w/ pentax grip, 16-50*, 50-135*, DA35/2.4, DA50, DA70 for what I got out of the A7 and lenses....and image quality is just as good and I have a complete kit now instead of just two primes.
08-22-2016, 08:15 PM - 1 Like   #36
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QuoteOriginally posted by neostyles Quote
I figured out of basically how to use my nikon without even really opening the manual.
LOL Nikon. They start off with a basic ergonomics fail: if you are right handed, the lens release button is on the wrong side of the camera body, and the turn direction for mounting the lens goes the wrong way too. At least Pentax and Sony both get that right.

And Nikon camera menus and external controls are far from perfect, IMHO. Inconsistent, multi-layered and disorienting.

However lots of credit to Nikon for their manuals. Much better than Sony and Pentax, for certain.
QuoteOriginally posted by neostyles Quote
I am a designer by trade.
Hair design?
08-22-2016, 08:32 PM   #37
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QuoteOriginally posted by Na Horuk Quote

No. And reading the rest of your reply makes me hope you are the one joking. But I won't turn this thread into a back and forth.
Sony is not really popular for a reason. The main reason people have Sony is because they put a good sensor into a small box at a low price, and you can put other brand lenses on it. Basically, Sony can afford to whip out a new camera every few months and take a bunch of losses for that couple of cameras that sell well. Its a completely different approach from Pentax
Oh, and feel free to write a letter to Newson about how great your design trade it, teach him a lesson about how "confusing" green and red buttons are. I'm sure he will appreciate your helpful opinions
Didn't expect this here. Haven't used a Pentax body yet, but having used Canon (EOS 450D & PowerShot G15), Olympus (E-PM1), and Sony (a5000) I have to say that Oly has probably the most confusing menu and UI, and Sony and Canon is probably on par except the logic is a bit different. However I am confident that even without RTFM I can adapt to a new brand (i.e. Pentax or Fuji) in an hour or two.

08-23-2016, 03:15 AM   #38
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QuoteOriginally posted by butangmucat Quote
However I am confident that even without RTFM I can adapt to a new brand (i.e. Pentax or Fuji) in an hour or two.
Yes, it will not be a problem. With Pentax you only need the manual for the first time you want to use special functions like Catch in Focus or maybe multi exposure, interval shooting. But even those are fairly easy to figure out, especially if you have some experience with digital cameras
08-23-2016, 03:39 AM   #39
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QuoteOriginally posted by BigMackCam Quote
If you captured 30 shots in a burst it would take 5 seconds at 6fps, or 5.36 seconds at 5.6fps.

Looking at it a slightly different way, a 5 second burst at 6fps would capture 30 shots. At 5.6fps, you'd get 28 shots.

Is that really a material difference? I'd say not. If we were comparing 10fps vs 5fps, I'd see an obvious advantage - but 6fps vs 5.6fps is barely noticeable. Do you have a specific application that would benefit from such a marginal difference in burst rate?
OK so I went out again and found what really made me unhappy with the burst ability is that after a burst or a normal continuous shooting of 5 images, the machine gets locked up to clear its buffer. This can take up to 2 seconds even with good SD cards from SanDisk etc. Will K-S1 or K-S2 perform better on this?

Sincerely

Sent from my Android phone, please forgive any possible typos.
08-23-2016, 04:35 AM   #40
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K-S1 shoots 5, K-S2 5.4 fps. The K-3 II does 8.3 fps. However, I have both K-S1 and K-3 II and I don't find that to be a problem as I use these different cameras for different type of shooting. Most of the time, that piece of specification doesn't matter to me that much.
08-23-2016, 05:13 AM   #41
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QuoteOriginally posted by butangmucat Quote
OK so I went out again and found what really made me unhappy with the burst ability is that after a burst or a normal continuous shooting of 5 images, the machine gets locked up to clear its buffer. This can take up to 2 seconds even with good SD cards from SanDisk etc. Will K-S1 or K-S2 perform better on this?
I have no direct experience of the K-01 or K-S1, however I just ran a quick test with my old K-5, using a PNY Class 10 50mb/s card (not the best performing card I own, but that's what was in the camera ).

Shooting RAW only in "Hi" continuous drive mode, it managed an uninterrupted burst of 24 shots before the buffer was full. Almost immediately after that I was able to take another couple of shots while the camera was still clearing the buffer, and I could keep doing this without any problems (ie. short delay once the buffer is full, then top up the buffer with a few more shots).

(EDIT: this was with a manual focus lens attached, so no AF activity to slow things down - however, I believe this matches your particular /use case)

I've no reason to suspect that the K-01 and K-S1 will be any worse than this - in fact, they may perform better - but best to check with someone who actually owns those cameras.

Hope this helps

Last edited by BigMackCam; 08-23-2016 at 05:26 AM.
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