Now smartphones are in decline.

surfar · 02-23-2018, 01:30 AM - **1 Like**

...Does this mean cameras will pick up the slack?

The source is Gartner.

So for the first time since 2004 a quartely result has gone negative.
Despite 408 million phones being sold Q4 2017,it was 5.6% lower than same quarter in 2016.
Manufacturers are saying that the take up of the latest tech is slowing.

Cameras have felt that for a while,there were boom years as people embraced digital...but of course the standard is very high with most cameras for the last few years being good at most things.Technology will always evolve,the demand can vary.

**BigMackCam** · 02-23-2018, 02:32 AM

Interesting. I guess it had to happen, especially with the premium models. When you look at the prices of the latest iPhone or high-end Samsung phones, that's a serious investment. A lot of people simply can't - or won't want to - keep upgrading every year or two...

**Rondec** · 02-23-2018, 03:40 AM - **3 Likes**

Smart phones aren't in decline, although sales of new models might be. It's an entirely different thing. People are just making their phones last longer and not seeing a reason to upgrade as often.

**RobA_Oz** · 02-23-2018, 03:50 AM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by BigMackCam

... When you look at the prices of the latest iPhone or high-end Samsung phones, that's a serious investment.

Given the number of high-end phones I see hanging precariously out of the back pockets of stretch jeans, I can't believe those people are taking the investment all that seriously.

Back on topic, I think the decline in subsidies by carriers for people taking up monthly plans is possibly a major factor in new phone placements, now the mobile markets in Western countries have matured.

**UncleVanya** · 02-23-2018, 04:05 AM - **4 Likes**

Originally posted by Rondec

Smart phones aren't in decline, although sales of new models might be. It's an entirely different thing. People are just making their phones last longer and not seeing a reason to upgrade as often.

Can't we say the same for cameras? The treadmill of constant upgrades is not a path to happiness.

surfar · 02-23-2018, 06:40 AM

Originally posted by Rondec

Smart phones aren't in decline

Yes,neither are cameras then!

---------- Post added 02-24-18 at 12:44 AM ----------

Originally posted by RobA_Oz

Back on topic,

Have you guys got the 2 for 1 offer down there?...Perfect for both of you!

**savoche** · 02-23-2018, 06:49 AM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by surfar

Yes,neither are cameras then!

Not necessarily. The sale of new phones might be in decline, but the number of phones in use most probably isn't. Can the same be said for dedicated cameras? Maybe - or maybe not. I don't know.

**ffking** · 02-23-2018, 07:02 AM

Originally posted by Rondec

Smart phones aren't in decline, although sales of new models might be. It's an entirely different thing. People are just making their phones last longer and not seeing a reason to upgrade as often.

Absolutely - I've had a Samsung Galaxy S4 for about 4 years - it works fine, and I don't need anything it can't do

surfar · 02-23-2018, 07:25 AM

Originally posted by savoche

Can the same be said for dedicated cameras?

My Spotmatics work pretty good, same as 50 years ago....i'm wondering how many of todays cell phones will be in operation 2068?

**savoche** · 02-23-2018, 07:49 AM

Originally posted by surfar

My Spotmatics work pretty good, same as 50 years ago....i'm wondering how many of todays cell phones will be in operation 2068?

Well, I meant in actual use, not just that they work. While your Spotties might be in use, I suspect a lot of the old(er) digital cameras aren't - at least that they are so to a less degree by far than smartphones are.

Adam · 02-23-2018, 10:06 AM

I would expect the average consumer to eventually realize he or she does not need a new phone every 1-2 years

pentaxfall · 02-23-2018, 11:46 AM

Comparison of world population against number of smartphone sold indicates a case of saturation. Market does not like the fact that things do get saturated. According Gartener data, smartphones sold to end-user
2017 408million
2016 1.5billion
2015 1.4billion
2014 1.2billion
2013 968million

surfar · 02-23-2018, 03:46 PM

Originally posted by pentaxfall

2017 408million

Thats a Q4 figure only.

MarkJerling · 02-23-2018, 06:36 PM

"Two main factors led to the fall in the fourth quarter of 2017," said Anshul Gupta, research director at Gartner. "First, upgrades from feature phones to smartphones have slowed down due to a lack of quality "ultra-low-cost" smartphones and users preferring to buy quality feature phones. Second, replacement smartphone users are choosing quality models and keeping them longer, lengthening the replacement cycle of smartphones. Moreover, while demand for high quality, 4G connectivity and better camera features remained strong, high expectations and few incremental benefits during replacement weakened smartphone sales."

It would also be good to note that, while 4th quarter figures may be 5% down, year on year figures are probably still going up, as year on year growth in the market was between 7 and 23% for the preceding 4 years.

SpecialK · 02-23-2018, 07:05 PM

I have what I think is the bottom-end Samsung - sort of a prepaid Galaxy Prime thing. The other odd-brand phone I originally was going to get was sold out, so the salesman said "he shouldn't do it, but..." and I got it for $99.99 plus $30 setup. And, it was light-years ahead of the iPhone 5GS it replaced. Drag and drop photos and music - no iTunes that I had to figure out every year when I wanted to transfer something, and a proximity sensor that prevents cheek-dialing. I have no plans to replace it unless it dies.

02-23-2018, 01:30 AM - 1 Like	#1
surfar Pentaxian Join Date: Jan 2015 Location: mid nth coast,nsw Photos: Gallery Posts: 6,138	Now smartphones are in decline. ...Does this mean cameras will pick up the slack? The source is Gartner. So for the first time since 2004 a quartely result has gone negative. Despite 408 million phones being sold Q4 2017,it was 5.6% lower than same quarter in 2016. Manufacturers are saying that the take up of the latest tech is slowing. Cameras have felt that for a while,there were boom years as people embraced digital...but of course the standard is very high with most cameras for the last few years being good at most things.Technology will always evolve,the demand can vary.

02-23-2018, 10:06 AM	#11
Adam Administrator Site Webmaster Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Arizona Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 51,594	I would expect the average consumer to eventually realize he or she does not need a new phone every 1-2 years Adam PentaxForums.com Webmaster (Site Usage Guide \| Site Help \| My Photography) PentaxForums.com server and development costs are user-supported. You can help cover these costs by donating or purchasing one of our Pentax eBooks. Or, buy your photo gear from our affiliates, Adorama, B&H Photo, KEH, or Topaz Labs, and get FREE Marketplace access - click here to see how! Trusted Pentax retailers:

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02-23-2018, 02:32 AM	#2
BigMackCam Digitiser of Film Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: North East of England Posts: 20,665	Interesting. I guess it had to happen, especially with the premium models. When you look at the prices of the latest iPhone or high-end Samsung phones, that's a serious investment. A lot of people simply can't - or won't want to - keep upgrading every year or two...

02-23-2018, 03:40 AM - 3 Likes	#3
Rondec Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Gladys, Virginia Photos: Gallery Posts: 27,652	Smart phones aren't in decline, although sales of new models might be. It's an entirely different thing. People are just making their phones last longer and not seeing a reason to upgrade as often.

02-23-2018, 03:50 AM - 1 Like	#4
RobA_Oz Site Supporter Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Tasmania, Australia Photos: Gallery Posts: 8,196	Originally posted by BigMackCam ... When you look at the prices of the latest iPhone or high-end Samsung phones, that's a serious investment. Given the number of high-end phones I see hanging precariously out of the back pockets of stretch jeans, I can't believe those people are taking the investment all that seriously. Back on topic, I think the decline in subsidies by carriers for people taking up monthly plans is possibly a major factor in new phone placements, now the mobile markets in Western countries have matured.

02-23-2018, 04:05 AM - 4 Likes	#5
UncleVanya Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Jul 2014 Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 28,398	Originally posted by Rondec Smart phones aren't in decline, although sales of new models might be. It's an entirely different thing. People are just making their phones last longer and not seeing a reason to upgrade as often. Can't we say the same for cameras? The treadmill of constant upgrades is not a path to happiness.

02-23-2018, 06:40 AM	#6
surfar Pentaxian Join Date: Jan 2015 Location: mid nth coast,nsw Photos: Gallery Posts: 6,138 Original Poster	Originally posted by Rondec Smart phones aren't in decline Yes,neither are cameras then! ---------- Post added 02-24-18 at 12:44 AM ---------- Originally posted by RobA_Oz Back on topic, Have you guys got the 2 for 1 offer down there?...Perfect for both of you!

02-23-2018, 06:49 AM - 1 Like	#7
savoche Master of the obvious Join Date: Jun 2011 Location: Lowlands of Norway Posts: 18,311	Originally posted by surfar Yes,neither are cameras then! Not necessarily. The sale of new phones might be in decline, but the number of phones in use most probably isn't. Can the same be said for dedicated cameras? Maybe - or maybe not. I don't know.

02-23-2018, 07:02 AM	#8
ffking Site Supporter Join Date: Nov 2015 Location: Old South Wales Posts: 6,038	Originally posted by Rondec Smart phones aren't in decline, although sales of new models might be. It's an entirely different thing. People are just making their phones last longer and not seeing a reason to upgrade as often. Absolutely - I've had a Samsung Galaxy S4 for about 4 years - it works fine, and I don't need anything it can't do

02-23-2018, 07:25 AM	#9
surfar Pentaxian Join Date: Jan 2015 Location: mid nth coast,nsw Photos: Gallery Posts: 6,138 Original Poster	Originally posted by savoche Can the same be said for dedicated cameras? My Spotmatics work pretty good, same as 50 years ago....i'm wondering how many of todays cell phones will be in operation 2068?

02-23-2018, 07:49 AM	#10
savoche Master of the obvious Join Date: Jun 2011 Location: Lowlands of Norway Posts: 18,311	Originally posted by surfar My Spotmatics work pretty good, same as 50 years ago....i'm wondering how many of todays cell phones will be in operation 2068? Well, I meant in actual use, not just that they work. While your Spotties might be in use, I suspect a lot of the old(er) digital cameras aren't - at least that they are so to a less degree by far than smartphones are.

02-23-2018, 11:46 AM	#12
pentaxfall Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2017 Location: Bangalore, India Posts: 581	Comparison of world population against number of smartphone sold indicates a case of saturation. Market does not like the fact that things do get saturated. According Gartener data, smartphones sold to end-user 2017 408million 2016 1.5billion 2015 1.4billion 2014 1.2billion 2013 968million

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02-23-2018, 03:46 PM	#13
surfar Pentaxian Join Date: Jan 2015 Location: mid nth coast,nsw Photos: Gallery Posts: 6,138 Original Poster	Originally posted by pentaxfall 2017 408million Thats a Q4 figure only.

02-23-2018, 06:36 PM	#14
MarkJerling Moderator Site Supporter Join Date: May 2012 Location: Wairarapa, New Zealand Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 20,404	"Two main factors led to the fall in the fourth quarter of 2017," said Anshul Gupta, research director at Gartner. "First, upgrades from feature phones to smartphones have slowed down due to a lack of quality "ultra-low-cost" smartphones and users preferring to buy quality feature phones. Second, replacement smartphone users are choosing quality models and keeping them longer, lengthening the replacement cycle of smartphones. Moreover, while demand for high quality, 4G connectivity and better camera features remained strong, high expectations and few incremental benefits during replacement weakened smartphone sales." It would also be good to note that, while 4th quarter figures may be 5% down, year on year figures are probably still going up, as year on year growth in the market was between 7 and 23% for the preceding 4 years.

02-23-2018, 07:05 PM	#15
SpecialK Pentaxian Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: So California Photos: Gallery Posts: 16,480	I have what I think is the bottom-end Samsung - sort of a prepaid Galaxy Prime thing. The other odd-brand phone I originally was going to get was sold out, so the salesman said "he shouldn't do it, but..." and I got it for $99.99 plus $30 setup. And, it was light-years ahead of the iPhone 5GS it replaced. Drag and drop photos and music - no iTunes that I had to figure out every year when I wanted to transfer something, and a proximity sensor that prevents cheek-dialing. I have no plans to replace it unless it dies.