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05-09-2018, 03:12 PM   #1
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Difference between Pentax K1 Raw vs Sony Raw???

Hey guys.. i was wondering, in general terms what is your opinion the biggest difference in raw files between the Sony A series and the Pentax K1 .. any noticible difference in skin tones, magentas, greens?? for the ones that shoot with both systems.. how hard it is to match both raw files in post edditing??

Pentax K1 dynamic range is lovely, and low light handling is nice.. but in terms of color.. what is your experience??

05-09-2018, 05:02 PM   #2
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QuoteOriginally posted by kooks Quote
any noticible difference in skin tones, magentas, greens?? for the ones that shoot with both systems.. how hard it is to match both raw files in post edditing??
Given that RAW files don't have skin tones, magentas, or greens, it is hard to say. In theory development of either RAW file type in Lightroom or Adobe Camera Raw (ACR) using the Adobe Standard camera profile should result in very similar color rendering.


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05-09-2018, 05:24 PM   #3
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QuoteOriginally posted by stevebrot Quote
Given that RAW files don't have skin tones, magentas, or greens, it is hard to say. In theory development of either RAW file type in Lightroom or Adobe Camera Raw (ACR) using the Adobe Standard camera profile should result in very similar color rendering.
Don't color filter arrays still differ between cameras though? How strict or loose the band-passing is on the CFA could affect what's captured in the raw file and therefore what you can do with the colors. I know some cameras even in the CMOS era have legendary reputations for colors (Canon 5D, Sony A900), and I had always thought the CFA played a part.
05-09-2018, 06:21 PM   #4
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QuoteOriginally posted by Scintilla Quote
Don't color filter arrays still differ between cameras though? How strict or loose the band-passing is on the CFA could affect what's captured in the raw file and therefore what you can do with the colors. I know some cameras even in the CMOS era have legendary reputations for colors (Canon 5D, Sony A900), and I had always thought the CFA played a part.
Read my comment again. The purpose of the Adobe Standard camera profile is to provide equivalent base rendering across brands. A particular brand may provide a stronger or weaker starting point for some colors based on filters and low level processing tweaks and this will show in the studio setups used in some camera reviews. Below is a comparison snippet of Imaging Resource test images for Sony A7R (on left) from ARW and Pentax K-1 (on right) from DNG. Both were processed with default import values in LR 5.7 using the specific Adobe Standard camera profile for each body at the white balance set by the camera.



Yes, there are differences (yellows and orange in particular), but over all the colors are remarkably similar.


Steve


Last edited by stevebrot; 05-09-2018 at 06:31 PM.
05-09-2018, 07:00 PM   #5
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QuoteOriginally posted by stevebrot Quote
Yes, there are differences (yellows and orange in particular), but over all the colors are remarkably similar.
I should probably add that often characteristic renderings associated with a particular brand or camera are usually for OOC JPEGs. Imaging Resource has a convenient Comparometer that may be used to do side-by-side comparison between OOC images from the cameras they have tested.

Imaging Resource "Comparometer" ? Digital Camera Image Comparison Page


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05-09-2018, 07:34 PM   #6
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QuoteOriginally posted by stevebrot Quote
Read my comment again. The purpose of the Adobe Standard camera profile is to provide equivalent base rendering across brands. A particular brand may provide a stronger or weaker starting point for some colors based on filters and low level processing tweaks and this will show in the studio setups used in some camera reviews. Below is a comparison snippet of Imaging Resource test images for Sony A7R (on left) from ARW and Pentax K-1 (on right) from DNG. Both were processed with default import values in LR 5.7 using the specific Adobe Standard camera profile for each body at the white balance set by the camera.



Yes, there are differences (yellows and orange in particular), but over all the colors are remarkably similar.


Steve
hummm that's some nice Info Steve.. so in your opinion.. raw files will behave almost the same (no big difference) if both are treated with Adove standard profile?

Im asking this because I might eventually add a Sony camera to my setup, to use it along with my K1, but i dont want the editing to be a big mess of colors when applying a preset.
05-09-2018, 07:55 PM   #7
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QuoteOriginally posted by kooks Quote
hummm that's some nice Info Steve.. so in your opinion.. raw files will behave almost the same (no big difference) if both are treated with Adove standard profile?
That has been my experience, though with the caveat that I don't have any Sony cameras in the mix.


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05-11-2018, 09:34 AM   #8
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Hey kooks,

pm me your email if you want and I'll send over two raw files (RX1 and K-1) and you can see how it feels for yourself?

05-11-2018, 01:16 PM   #9
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QuoteOriginally posted by Fabian Quote
Hey kooks,

pm me your email if you want and I'll send over two raw files (RX1 and K-1) and you can see how it feels for yourself?
Thanks Fabian.. quick question.. Will the RX1 have kind of the same "toning" as for example the new A7iii or A7Riii ??
05-11-2018, 03:43 PM   #10
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Oh, I can't say.. Haven't used the A7/R III.
05-12-2018, 09:38 AM   #11
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QuoteOriginally posted by kooks Quote
Hey guys.. i was wondering, in general terms what is your opinion the biggest difference in raw files between the Sony A series and the Pentax K1 .. any noticible difference in skin tones, magentas, greens?? for the ones that shoot with both systems.. how hard it is to match both raw files in post edditing??

Pentax K1 dynamic range is lovely, and low light handling is nice.. but in terms of color.. what is your experience??
The K-1 is excellent. With Sony it depends on which body you have. You really need to get an x-rite passport color checker and create a custom profile for each camera and lens combination. My A7II RAW files had an orange cast to the skin tones that was troublesome, but the new A7III, A7rIII, & A9 have much better color profiles. I think the K-1 has the better out of the box color profile, but my A9 is very close. K-1 looks more neutral. A9 has a little more saturation. With custom color profiles though the look is the same.

I would like to add that the lens plays a big roll in this. This is why you need to create a custom profile for each lens... for each lighting setup. Its a pain in the butt and sometimes its just not possible, but when you can do it, you will get near perfect results.

Last edited by Winder; 05-12-2018 at 03:56 PM.
05-13-2018, 12:09 AM   #12
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QuoteOriginally posted by Winder Quote
The K-1 is excellent. With Sony it depends on which body you have. You really need to get an x-rite passport color checker and create a custom profile for each camera and lens combination. My A7II RAW files had an orange cast to the skin tones that was troublesome, but the new A7III, A7rIII, & A9 have much better color profiles. I think the K-1 has the better out of the box color profile, but my A9 is very close. K-1 looks more neutral. A9 has a little more saturation. With custom color profiles though the look is the same.

I would like to add that the lens plays a big roll in this. This is why you need to create a custom profile for each lens... for each lighting setup. Its a pain in the butt and sometimes its just not possible, but when you can do it, you will get near perfect results.
I was thinking about A7iii or A7riii ... im kind of more into the A7iii because K1 is already really good IQ.. but im looking for something faster.
05-13-2018, 06:26 AM   #13
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QuoteOriginally posted by kooks Quote
I was thinking about A7iii or A7riii ... im kind of more into the A7iii because K1 is already really good IQ.. but im looking for something faster.
The A7III has excellent color and Sony's new color profiles are very good. Sony appears to be trying to mimic Canon colors and skin tones which is probably a good thing. The K-1 is more neutral to my eyes. That said, I use Capture One Pro for my Sony files and I have been migrating everything over from Lightroom. Capture One is free for Sony users. Colors are a little different between Capture One and LR right out of the box.

A7III is definitely faster in just about every way. The Sony glass is pretty nice.
05-13-2018, 09:01 PM   #14
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QuoteOriginally posted by Winder Quote
The A7III has excellent color and Sony's new color profiles are very good. Sony appears to be trying to mimic Canon colors and skin tones which is probably a good thing. The K-1 is more neutral to my eyes. That said, I use Capture One Pro for my Sony files and I have been migrating everything over from Lightroom. Capture One is free for Sony users. Colors are a little different between Capture One and LR right out of the box.

A7III is definitely faster in just about every way. The Sony glass is pretty nice.
That's great.. thanks for the info i really really appreciate it.
05-17-2018, 08:12 PM   #15
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QuoteOriginally posted by Winder Quote
The A7III has excellent color and Sony's new color profiles are very good. Sony appears to be trying to mimic Canon colors and skin tones which is probably a good thing. The K-1 is more neutral to my eyes. That said, I use Capture One Pro for my Sony files and I have been migrating everything over from Lightroom. Capture One is free for Sony users. Colors are a little different between Capture One and LR right out of the box.

A7III is definitely faster in just about every way. The Sony glass is pretty nice.
Only A7iii or A7Riii too.
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