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08-19-2018, 04:23 PM   #76
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QuoteOriginally posted by rawr Quote
Pentaxians have a notable anxiety about their favorite brand. The trials and tribulations Pentax has experienced as a company has caused lots of stress for Pentax users. This makes Pentaxians an unsettled and edgy crowd. This carries over into discussions about all other brands, and the camera market in general.

Or maybe the people here are simply more gear obsessed than the average Sony user?
I guess it would have nothing to do with comments like this. essentially explaining how bad we are and making sure we understand it's all our fault.

08-19-2018, 06:15 PM - 1 Like   #77
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QuoteOriginally posted by neokind Quote
Again, I wouldn't put them in the same category. Whether or not you like the opinions of the Northrups, they mostly offer substantive videos. I have found their content to be helpful, informative, and thoughtful. They do indeed have their opinions, but they are opinions that I respect far more than others due to the substance offered and breadth of their content. I don't know enough about the Angry Photographer to offer an opinion (I only saw one video, and was not positively impressed by it.) I've seen a handful of Jason Lanier videos, but the overall impression was negative. To be blunt, I found him to be a prick, and a shill for whomever was paying him (Sony.) But, I could hardly put the Northrups in the same category as the other two.

Neokind, we're now debating who is the less crappy of the vloggers … FWIW I find Chelsea more bearable than Tony.

My attitude is pay very little attention to any of them, the more wide ranging their subject matter the less they can tell you. They have no insight, they just read the same websites and company press releases we do. If there's a new product, their subscription model says they can't devote two weeks to learning it, they do an unboxing, some test shots, that's it, move on, they have more videos to make. They do 'superficial' with a capital 'S'.

If you think my attitude is that all of them to one extent or another dumb down this rich and rewarding hobby of ours, you'd be right.

Last edited by clackers; 08-20-2018 at 11:29 PM.
08-20-2018, 02:06 AM   #78
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NEW Nikon!
08-20-2018, 07:58 AM   #79
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I see it as $ony just cherrypicking the numbers. Yeah they're #1 in the US for mirrorless for the last 6 months, but in Japan Canon is #1, and for overall Digital FF sales that crown is going to either Canon or Nikon.

08-20-2018, 08:26 AM   #80
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Well, the problem with this news is that the source is Sony themselves at the same moment they launch a new marketing campaign... I don't put too much trust in anything coming from Sony marketing department...

Last edited by CarlJF; 08-20-2018 at 08:34 AM.
08-20-2018, 08:36 AM   #81
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So this boils down to Sony is #1 in Mirrorless? yawn.
Who is #1 in mirrorless is about the last thing I care about.

I don't care about who is #1 in 3 ton truck sales either, or which bread company is #1.
There are so many #1s I don't care about, at least Sony being #1 is in good company.

Last edited by normhead; 08-20-2018 at 12:54 PM.
08-20-2018, 12:05 PM   #82
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After Canon Nikon go mirrorless, Pentax is going to the world #1 of the OVF cameras. I'm still amazed that I can switch-on my K1 and dial in settings when I enter the hide and leave it switched-on for 6 hours in case something shows up the camera is immediately ready to shoot at any time. Try to keep a mirrorless camera always on, it's going to heat up and drain the battery in less than 2 hours.


Last edited by biz-engineer; 08-20-2018 at 12:13 PM.
08-20-2018, 12:45 PM   #83
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QuoteOriginally posted by biz-engineer Quote
After Canon Nikon go mirrorless, Pentax is going to the world #1 of the OVF cameras. I'm still amazed that I can switch-on my K1 and dial in settings when I enter the hide and leave it switched-on for 6 hours in case something shows up the camera is immediately ready to shoot at any time. Try to keep a mirrorless camera always on, it's going to heat up and drain the battery in less than 2 hours
I'm quite interested in RIs strategy with Pentax - in retrospect, looking at the K-1, what it doesn't do well are mostly things that mirrorless can do better than a DSLR. but there are still advantages to DSLRs in some areas (one of which you highlight). I'm interested to think about others - not just not causing headaches in some users. Iwonder if a return to a modular structure might suit DSLRs better, for instance - but I'm not sure why it would.
08-21-2018, 02:34 PM   #84
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FF market share in USA Jan-June 2018 in $$$ value

the figures come from NPD Group Inc

$$$ONY ...40%

Canon 33%

Nikon 26%

And the 1% ers are the outlaws.Or maybe outcasts!
08-21-2018, 02:49 PM   #85
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So essentially only 40% of the market is Sony.
That's not a majority of users.
08-21-2018, 02:54 PM   #86
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QuoteOriginally posted by surfar Quote
the figures come from NPD Group Inc

$$$ONY ...40%

Canon 33%

Nikon 26%

And the 1% ers are the outlaws.Or maybe outcasts!
To get a complete picture, you need to know how APS-C fits into this. I don't plan to ever have a FF camera, unless some one gives one to me. I'm guessing that APS-C is still a substantial part of the market, and the doorway by which most users enter the market
08-21-2018, 03:31 PM   #87
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QuoteOriginally posted by reh321 Quote
To get a complete picture,
The figures are for FF,thats the"picture".

QuoteOriginally posted by reh321 Quote
I'm guessing that APS-C is still a substantial part of the market, and the doorway by which most users enter the market
Well,Fujifilm are selling more and more Apsc,not sure about the other makers.The doorway to the market is with a smartphone!

---------- Post added 08-22-18 at 09:34 AM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by normhead Quote
That's not a majority of users.
You are correct, and the figures for $$$ony were single digit 5 years ago.
08-21-2018, 03:38 PM   #88
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QuoteOriginally posted by surfar Quote
The figures are for FF,thats the"picture".
No. That is like saying thirty years ago that if you knew color film sales, you knew all that you needed to know.

For the true camera industry, for a company like Pentax, or Nikon, or Canon, or even Sony, you have to know sales of all types of cameras. FF is FF, but that is not The Market.
08-21-2018, 03:41 PM - 1 Like   #89
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QuoteOriginally posted by surfar Quote
The doorway to the market is with a smartphone!
No, smart phones are a completely different thing.

A person using an iPhone has neither a greater or lesser chance of becoming a Canon user than a person using a Samsung phone does.

Most people will still purchase an APS-C camera before they purchase a FF camera, and that choice will significant affect what camera they get later.
08-21-2018, 03:53 PM   #90
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QuoteOriginally posted by surfar Quote
The figures are for FF,thats the"picture".



Well,Fujifilm are selling more and more Apsc,not sure about the other makers.The doorway to the market is with a smartphone!

---------- Post added 08-22-18 at 09:34 AM ----------



You are correct, and the figures for $$$ony were single digit 5 years ago.
I understand the figures, what I don't understand is why I have seen plenty of Canon and Nikon full frames "in the field," but never a Sony one. And I live in the United States where these numbers come from. I believe you live in Australia where every second camera is a Leica and every third camera is a Sony, but it is still a different market here.

My guess is that it is a sign more of a declining overall market than that Sony is generating loads of new sales. In point of fact, I see very few Sony ILCs when I am out and about, at National Parks, zoos, etc. Surprising as I should see A7 IIIs and A9s everywhere.
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