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08-23-2018, 07:40 PM - 1 Like   #16
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IMO the Z6 is aim just to hold some Nikon users from jumping to Sony.. but not pros, pros will continue to move over to Sony.. their big failure: only having 1 slot.

08-23-2018, 07:48 PM - 1 Like   #17
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QuoteOriginally posted by photoptimist Quote
Spare batteries are pretty cheap and lightweight. But each photographer has to decide if the hassles of swapping exceed batteries whatever other benefits the camera might offer (if any).
On mirrorless , battery life is not quite the same as on DSLR. On a mirrorless camera, you can setup EVF such that is switches off when not using it but if you do so there is a lag to restart streaming to EVF when it switches on again. The other EVF setup alternative is to have the image streaming from the sensor running all the time and then alternate between EVF when you approach your eye or back LCD looking away from the EVF, so in that case there is not lag when looking at the EVF, but in that case the camera drains current from the battery. That is why, if you switch off / on a mirrorless camera after every shot, you may be able to get 1000 shots out of one battery but if you don't switch off because you want instant response of the mirrorless camera like it is for a DSLR, then, depending for how long you want to leave the camera switched on, you may get 100 shots or even less , or even not shot at all. I've use the A7 III quite a bit, if I wanted no lag in EVF, I needed to have it always on.

---------- Post added 24-08-18 at 05:17 ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by kooks Quote
but not pros, pros will continue to move over to Sony..
One pro moved from D5 to 1Dx II, he did not even consider mirrorless. There are pros and pros, the real ones aren't spending time in online discussions, they don't have time for that kind of thing.

---------- Post added 24-08-18 at 05:22 ----------

The real pros (not just the ones who do two paid shot sessions per year) represent a very small revenue overall. Sony and Nikon mirrorless camera are designed for consumers who have the money to spend.

Last edited by biz-engineer; 08-23-2018 at 08:18 PM.
08-23-2018, 08:23 PM - 1 Like   #18
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QuoteOriginally posted by kooks Quote
but not pros, pros will continue to move over to Sony.. their big failure: only having 1 slot.
I think the Nikon naming convention with these cameras suggests there is plenty of scope for a Z1 or even Z9 or Z10 (ZX?) ahead, with more 'pro' features added. Just like Sony did with the release of the A9, where suddenly pro features like dual card support, proper weather sealing, and direct Ethernet support were added.
08-23-2018, 08:42 PM   #19
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QuoteOriginally posted by rawr Quote
I think the Nikon naming convention with these cameras suggests there is plenty of scope for a Z1 or even Z9 or Z10 (ZX?) ahead, with more 'pro' features added. Just like Sony did with the release of the A9, where suddenly pro features like dual card support, proper weather sealing, and direct Ethernet support were added.
Well these do seem more prosumer.. somewhere between a consumer body and a professional. Enthusiast maybe...

Tokyo is hosting the 2020 Olympics, therefore we can expect new sports bodies out of both Canon and Nikon. So perhaps the D6 will be a mirrorless and these are the dress rehearsal?

That said Nikon is also launching F mount lenses now too.... so it seems they aren't completely abandoning F mount. Maybe we still see more DSLRs out of them in the short to mid term...

08-23-2018, 08:45 PM   #20
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QuoteOriginally posted by rawr Quote
I think the Nikon naming convention with these cameras suggests there is plenty of scope
Its been suggested that being a direct competitor of $$$ony A ,that Nikon chose Zeeeee(not Zed) as a direct and intentional "confrontational Challenge" to $$$onys dominance of FF M/L...others have suggested it was the only letter left???

---------- Post added 08-24-18 at 02:48 PM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by biz-engineer Quote
Sony and Nikon mirrorless camera are designed for consumers who have the money to spend.
Yes,just like all the other camera systems under say 10K U$.

---------- Post added 08-24-18 at 02:50 PM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by rawr Quote
proper weather sealing,
Which $$$ony body has that?
08-23-2018, 08:53 PM   #21
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QuoteOriginally posted by biz-engineer Quote
One pro moved from D5 to 1Dx II, he did not even consider mirrorless.
My mistake yes.. i mean pros that are considering mirrorless will continue to move over to Sony, and not to Nikon (at least not for now).. by pro i just mean people that actualy make their living out of photography.

QuoteOriginally posted by rawr Quote
I think the Nikon naming convention with these cameras suggests there is plenty of scope for a Z1 or even Z9 or Z10 (ZX?) ahead, with more 'pro' features added. Just like Sony did with the release of the A9, where suddenly pro features like dual card support, proper weather sealing, and direct Ethernet support were added.
I think so too.
08-23-2018, 09:02 PM   #22
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QuoteOriginally posted by rawr Quote
there is plenty of scope for a Z1 or even Z9 or Z10
But BMW have them reserved!

08-23-2018, 09:11 PM   #23
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QuoteOriginally posted by ShaunW Quote


What do you think Ricoh/Pentax can do to compete? What features etc. There may not be enough desire among current Pentax users to have a comparable mirrorless body but it would help bring in new people to the brand. What if Ricoh/Pentax has secretly been working on a mirrorless body to release during the 100th anniversary next year? I believe this type of event/release would be the only one large enough to gain a reasonable amount of attention from the press.
Throat Diameter: (from Nikon Z vs Nikon F - What's the Difference? - Photography Life)
Pentax K = 44 mm / Flange focal distance 45.46 mm
Sony E = 46.1mm / Flange focal distance 18 mm
Nikon Z = 52mm / Flange focal distance 16mm

See that it is only 2.1mm smaller than the Sony E mount. I am not a lens designer but 2.1mm seems like it is in a workable area for Pentax to design a mirrorless body and mirror-less lenses using existing K mount and get away with maybe 22-23 mm of flange focal distance?

But really, I don’t know what I am talking about at all
08-23-2018, 09:12 PM   #24
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QuoteOriginally posted by surfar Quote
Which $$$ony body has that?
Well, Sony did make a bit of an effort with sealing on the A9. More than any other A series. But then again, for the price of an A9 one would expect them to.

08-23-2018, 09:18 PM - 1 Like   #25
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QuoteOriginally posted by ShaunW Quote
Would you welcome a K-01 mk II? I certainly would.
I love my K-01, but the AF is horrific. Give it a hybrid AF system and it becomes workable. Put a FF sensor in the back and it gets even better. Put in an EVF and nobody would have anything to complain about.
08-23-2018, 09:41 PM   #26
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QuoteOriginally posted by pakinjapan Quote
Throat Diameter: (from Nikon Z vs Nikon F - What's the Difference? - Photography Life)
Pentax K = 44 mm / Flange focal distance 45.46 mm
Sony E = 46.1mm / Flange focal distance 18 mm
Nikon Z = 52mm / Flange focal distance 16mm

See that it is only 2.1mm smaller than the Sony E mount. I am not a lens designer but 2.1mm seems like it is in a workable area for Pentax to design a mirrorless body and mirror-less lenses using existing K mount and get away with maybe 22-23 mm of flange focal distance?

But really, I don’t know what I am talking about at all
It's not necessarily the throat diameter, that's just the diameter of the opening in the lens mount, that really determines the thickness of the body. It's the flange distance. Notice the flange focal distance differences of the Pentax K, Sony E and Nikon Z mounts. It's this distance, the distance from the sensor to the mount flange, that is a strong factor in determining the thickness of a camera body. Because of this, we can achieve infinity focus using Pentax lenses on Sony and Canon bodies but not the reverse.

Flange distance is the reason the K-01 is so thick for a mirrorless while Sony A7's are so thin.
08-23-2018, 09:50 PM - 1 Like   #27
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Pros:
Price, WR, IBIS, size, weight nice choice of lenses (I like the idea to have a 35/1.8 or 50/1.8 upon entry) and its roadmap.

Cons:
1. Obvious negatives for me would be, why 1 card slot only, at that price point, why Nikon didn't even consider 1 QXD/1SD combination? The QXD only option will drive away enthusiasts.

2. Paltry battery, DSLRs users (especially Nikonians) are used to big battery capacity, heck, even Nikon boasts that the grips Z6/7 are handfull and way better vs it's competitor (Sony). So why chose a smaller battery?
08-24-2018, 03:22 AM - 1 Like   #28
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Negatives? One card slot, price, size (it isn't that small for a mirrorless camera), lack of screw drive support on legacy lenses, short battery life, and lack of native lenses (no wide angles and no small primes). And it turns out that even with the awesome autofocus of mirrorless, a 58mm f.95 lens has to be manual focused.

I would like to see a K-02 with full frame sensor, EVF and PDAF points on the sensor. Other than being able to mount other brand lenses, I don't know that there is a huge benefit to re-doing the mount and I still shoot with my K-01 some. It's slow and clunky, but it is pretty old too. With regard to size, it isn't that much bigger than many of the mirrorless cameras on the market -- just a little bit thicker is all.
08-24-2018, 04:36 AM - 1 Like   #29
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Glad to see their F mount adapter has a mechanical auto diaphragm stop down mechanism. That allows focusing wide open with legacy lenses. If a 3rd-party would make a K mount adapter with this feature I'd consider the Z6 instead of the A7III. I use SMC-M lenses on the A7, which means focusing at the shooting aperture, which is not ideal. Leica made a Leica R-mount adapter for the digital SL so it could use R lenses (I have several), but it does not have a mechanical diaphragm lever.
The other issue with legacy manual lenses is mechanical aperture detection, so the camera knows the shooting aperture to allow wide-open metering as well as focusing. The Nikon F mount adapter doesn't seem to have this, so it may mean stop-down metering only. However, with all the old Nikon lenses out there, maybe a 3rd party will come up with an adapter that has this also.
Of course, camera manufacturers would rather sell new lenses than make using old lenses as easy as possible, so such adapters are not their best interest.
08-24-2018, 05:33 AM   #30
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QuoteOriginally posted by TomB_tx Quote
so such adapters are not their best interest.
I read somewhere [in the flood of news about the Z's] that Nikon was not going to be open to licensing usage of the Z mount, and will try to hold control over it for as long as they can. This policy might mean a long wait for any brand-name third-party Z mount lenses and accessories.
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