Panasonic to enter Full Frame mirrorless market...

**Rondec** · 09-08-2018, 02:38 AM

Originally posted by surfar

Could be,their prices for top of range M43 are high....with a FF thats capable of 8K(thats a distinct possibility)....This new Pano maybe 4K plus???

Also the rumour??(sketchy source) mill is saying the crop mode on the new Pano is 2x and an adapter will be provided from launch.With over 50AF m43 lenses,its an instant upgrade path for OLY and PANO users.

The end of the month should be very interesting.

That isn't an upgrade path at all. An upgrade path is the reverse where someone has purchased a bunch of full frame Oly and Panasonic lenses (that don't exist) and then move on to the full frame Panasonic camera. The idea that anyone will be pleased shooting a full frame camera in 2x crop mode using their lenses with an adapter and getting somewhere between 10 to 12 megapixel images is a bit silly.

I can mount my DA 15 on my K-1, but I never do because I would rather shoot it on my K-01 or K3. It's a crop lens and there isn't any benefit to shooting on a full frame camera over using a crop camera.

surfar · 09-08-2018, 03:02 AM

Originally posted by Rondec

That isn't an upgrade path at all.

So a M43 shooter can soon buy a FF camera,i'd say thats an upgrade path...

Just because theres a crop mode(assuming the rumour is correct) is a bonus...Another company did that too...they didnt need an adapter though.

Mind you,their crop mode wasnt quite as big.

**Rondec** · 09-08-2018, 03:16 AM

Originally posted by surfar

So a M43 shooter can soon buy a FF camera,i'd say thats an upgrade path...

Just because theres a crop mode(assuming the rumour is correct) is a bonus...Another company did that too...they didnt need an adapter though.

Mind you,their crop mode wasnt quite as big.

I guess you and I have a different concept of upgrade path. Yes, you can shoot 12 megapixel images with this large full frame camera and your micro four thirds lenses by using an adapter. But the implication that you wouldn't need to buy additional lenses is not true at all. Your lenses are usable but this "upgrade" actually gives less resolution than any other micro four thirds camera on the market. A lot of cameras give the option of cropping in camera. This can be done for a lot of different reasons, including using your current lenses, but very few would be satisfied shooting much while using only a small part of the sensor.

By the way, I don't really believe that there will be an adapter that allows for the use of these lenses without additional glass. Micro four thirds has a registration distance of 19.25mm. They would probably need to cut that back by 3mm in order to make an adapter. It could be done, but that would make the shortest registration distance for any full frame on the market.

surfar · 09-08-2018, 03:19 AM

Originally posted by Rondec

a registration distance of 19.25mm. They would probably need to cut that back by 3mm in order to make an adapter. It could be done

Yes 16mm has been mentioned,still the crop mode may be fake news...

---------- Post added 09-08-18 at 09:21 PM ----------

Originally posted by surfar

Also the rumour??(sketchy source) mill is saying the crop mode on the new Pano is 2x and an adapter will be provided from launch

............................................................

---------- Post added 09-08-18 at 09:27 PM ----------

the MAIN PURPOSE of FF Panasonic!

Its not to shoot stills,but could be OK?

This is the Camera they promised for the 2020 Tokyo Olympics to shoot 8K video.

Release is rumoured first quarter 2019, no idea about any lenses yet.

Last edited by surfar; 09-08-2018 at 03:28 AM.

**UncleVanya** · 09-08-2018, 03:47 PM

Originally posted by Rondec

I guess you and I have a different concept of upgrade path. Yes, you can shoot 12 megapixel images with this large full frame camera and your micro four thirds lenses by using an adapter. But the implication that you wouldn't need to buy additional lenses is not true at all. Your lenses are usable but this "upgrade" actually gives less resolution than any other micro four thirds camera on the market. A lot of cameras give the option of cropping in camera. This can be done for a lot of different reasons, including using your current lenses, but very few would be satisfied shooting much while using only a small part of the sensor.

By the way, I don't really believe that there will be an adapter that allows for the use of these lenses without additional glass. Micro four thirds has a registration distance of 19.25mm. They would probably need to cut that back by 3mm in order to make an adapter. It could be done, but that would make the shortest registration distance for any full frame on the market.

If the mount in larger in diameter it could fit inside rather than in front of the ff mount and maintain the same registration distance for both formats. Essentially like the m42 adapter does but with electronic contacts. Crop mode would yield big fat pixels that would work in low light.

---------- Post added 09-08-18 at 06:49 PM ----------

Granted most wouldn't be happy with the low pixel count.

**Pål Jensen** · 09-08-2018, 04:22 PM

Mirrorless technology is about as meaningful phrase as sunroofless technology about a car without a sunroof.

surfar · 09-08-2018, 06:10 PM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by Pål Jensen

Mirrorless technology is

Gaining momentum.........................]Mirror technology is gradually saying goodbye.

reh321 · 09-08-2018, 07:38 PM

Originally posted by Pål Jensen

Mirrorless technology is about as meaningful phrase as sunroofless technology about a car without a sunroof.

"Mirrorless" is incomplete - it could refer to a P&S - but "MILC" - interchangeable lenses without mirror - is completely meaningful in current context

surfar · 09-09-2018, 02:31 AM

Thats what i'm hearing.

They read the declining market for cameras and exited,seeing the Smartphone business was expanding.

They didnt not stop making and developing sensors.

surfar · 09-10-2018, 04:32 AM

As expected its very high end Video specs.

They are tossing up U$ 3K, 30mp, possibly 2 cards but not sure which format.

Stabilisation in lenses not in the body.

WR

Adapters made for rival glass ???...specifically EF...Hmm...that would be a first i suppose?

No mention of the crop adapter for M43,so perhaps that was Fake News.

rawr · 09-10-2018, 12:39 PM

Originally posted by surfar

No mention of the crop adapter for M43,so perhaps that was Fake News.

There seems an awful lot of marketing fog about Panasonic at the moment. Not much point reporting on rumours on top of rumours until something concrete comes out about Panasonic (or Samsung ... or Olympus ... or some Chinese company's plans). Not long until Photokina.

surfar · 09-10-2018, 01:56 PM

Originally posted by rawr

Not much point reporting on rumours

Funny thing is,plenty of the rumours are accurate.

I like to formulate an idea of anything new as the information becomes available.

I purposely didnt list the high end video specs which come from the accurate sources according to the site administrator(he rates the accuracy numerically).

Originally posted by rawr

There seems an awful lot of marketing fog about Panasonic

Where,i look for fog every morning mostly its clear!

disconnekt · 09-10-2018, 05:09 PM

Originally posted by surfar

Funny thing is,plenty of the rumours are accurate.

I like to formulate an idea of anything new as the information becomes available.

I purposely didnt list the high end video specs which come from the accurate sources according to the site administrator(he rates the accuracy numerically).

Yeah, plus the rumor sites are usually ~95% accurate at least a month before a camera is even announced its being delevoped at times.

surfar · 09-11-2018, 05:20 AM

CaNik glass will be adaptable to the Panasonic....Thats unusual.The adapters will be made by Panasonic.

So thats really a play for CaNik users.

Come buy our body and use your existing lenses.

I'm wondering if this is the Nuke in the war?...$$$ony have something up their sleeve I'm sure.

mtgmansf · 09-11-2018, 08:39 AM

Originally posted by surfar

CaNik glass will be adaptable to the Panasonic....Thats unusual.The adapters will be made by Panasonic.

So thats really a play for CaNik users.

Come buy our body and use your existing lenses.

I'm wondering if this is the Nuke in the war?...$$$ony have something up their sleeve I'm sure.

If it is primarily for high-end video - as many of us suspect - it is going to be an expensive 8K and FF machine. If SL mount, Leica sl lenses will not be too far out of the expense equation for native glass, as well as PL and Arri mount lenses -since those adapters already exist, and if the SL is the primary mounting system. Of course, you can mount Pentax, Nikon, and Canon lenses too (Novoflex adapters). In this way, the SL mount is very clever move and Panasonic can take their time coming up with their own native lenses - expensive or not - to satisfy still and video photographers. Another plus is, Pentax owners will have the option to use their glass on this camera, if only with manual focus...

09-09-2018, 02:31 AM	#129
surfar Pentaxian Join Date: Jan 2015 Location: mid nth coast,nsw Photos: Gallery Posts: 6,141	SAMSUNG FF sensor? Thats what i'm hearing. They read the declining market for cameras and exited,seeing the Smartphone business was expanding. They didnt not stop making and developing sensors.

09-10-2018, 04:32 AM	#130
surfar Pentaxian Join Date: Jan 2015 Location: mid nth coast,nsw Photos: Gallery Posts: 6,141	From the Rumour site. As expected its very high end Video specs. They are tossing up U$ 3K, 30mp, possibly 2 cards but not sure which format. Stabilisation in lenses not in the body. WR Adapters made for rival glass ???...specifically EF...Hmm...that would be a first i suppose? No mention of the crop adapter for M43,so perhaps that was Fake News.

09-11-2018, 05:20 AM	#134
surfar Pentaxian Join Date: Jan 2015 Location: mid nth coast,nsw Photos: Gallery Posts: 6,141	NO native glass?....Panasonic make adapters for other companies glass(not Pentax) CaNik glass will be adaptable to the Panasonic....Thats unusual.The adapters will be made by Panasonic. So thats really a play for CaNik users. Come buy our body and use your existing lenses. I'm wondering if this is the Nuke in the war?...$$$ony have something up their sleeve I'm sure.

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09-08-2018, 02:38 AM	#121
Rondec Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Gladys, Virginia Photos: Gallery Posts: 27,652	Originally posted by surfar Could be,their prices for top of range M43 are high....with a FF thats capable of 8K(thats a distinct possibility)....This new Pano maybe 4K plus??? Also the rumour??(sketchy source) mill is saying the crop mode on the new Pano is 2x and an adapter will be provided from launch.With over 50AF m43 lenses,its an instant upgrade path for OLY and PANO users. The end of the month should be very interesting. That isn't an upgrade path at all. An upgrade path is the reverse where someone has purchased a bunch of full frame Oly and Panasonic lenses (that don't exist) and then move on to the full frame Panasonic camera. The idea that anyone will be pleased shooting a full frame camera in 2x crop mode using their lenses with an adapter and getting somewhere between 10 to 12 megapixel images is a bit silly. I can mount my DA 15 on my K-1, but I never do because I would rather shoot it on my K-01 or K3. It's a crop lens and there isn't any benefit to shooting on a full frame camera over using a crop camera.

09-08-2018, 03:02 AM	#122
surfar Pentaxian Join Date: Jan 2015 Location: mid nth coast,nsw Photos: Gallery Posts: 6,141	Originally posted by Rondec That isn't an upgrade path at all. So a M43 shooter can soon buy a FF camera,i'd say thats an upgrade path... Just because theres a crop mode(assuming the rumour is correct) is a bonus...Another company did that too...they didnt need an adapter though. Mind you,their crop mode wasnt quite as big.

09-08-2018, 03:16 AM	#123
Rondec Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Gladys, Virginia Photos: Gallery Posts: 27,652	Originally posted by surfar So a M43 shooter can soon buy a FF camera,i'd say thats an upgrade path... Just because theres a crop mode(assuming the rumour is correct) is a bonus...Another company did that too...they didnt need an adapter though. Mind you,their crop mode wasnt quite as big. I guess you and I have a different concept of upgrade path. Yes, you can shoot 12 megapixel images with this large full frame camera and your micro four thirds lenses by using an adapter. But the implication that you wouldn't need to buy additional lenses is not true at all. Your lenses are usable but this "upgrade" actually gives less resolution than any other micro four thirds camera on the market. A lot of cameras give the option of cropping in camera. This can be done for a lot of different reasons, including using your current lenses, but very few would be satisfied shooting much while using only a small part of the sensor. By the way, I don't really believe that there will be an adapter that allows for the use of these lenses without additional glass. Micro four thirds has a registration distance of 19.25mm. They would probably need to cut that back by 3mm in order to make an adapter. It could be done, but that would make the shortest registration distance for any full frame on the market.

09-08-2018, 03:19 AM	#124
surfar Pentaxian Join Date: Jan 2015 Location: mid nth coast,nsw Photos: Gallery Posts: 6,141	Originally posted by Rondec a registration distance of 19.25mm. They would probably need to cut that back by 3mm in order to make an adapter. It could be done Yes 16mm has been mentioned,still the crop mode may be fake news... ---------- Post added 09-08-18 at 09:21 PM ---------- Originally posted by surfar Also the rumour??(sketchy source) mill is saying the crop mode on the new Pano is 2x and an adapter will be provided from launch ............................................................ ---------- Post added 09-08-18 at 09:27 PM ---------- the MAIN PURPOSE of FF Panasonic! Its not to shoot stills,but could be OK? This is the Camera they promised for the 2020 Tokyo Olympics to shoot 8K video. Release is rumoured first quarter 2019, no idea about any lenses yet. Last edited by surfar; 09-08-2018 at 03:28 AM.

09-08-2018, 03:47 PM	#125
UncleVanya Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Jul 2014 Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 28,400	Originally posted by Rondec I guess you and I have a different concept of upgrade path. Yes, you can shoot 12 megapixel images with this large full frame camera and your micro four thirds lenses by using an adapter. But the implication that you wouldn't need to buy additional lenses is not true at all. Your lenses are usable but this "upgrade" actually gives less resolution than any other micro four thirds camera on the market. A lot of cameras give the option of cropping in camera. This can be done for a lot of different reasons, including using your current lenses, but very few would be satisfied shooting much while using only a small part of the sensor. By the way, I don't really believe that there will be an adapter that allows for the use of these lenses without additional glass. Micro four thirds has a registration distance of 19.25mm. They would probably need to cut that back by 3mm in order to make an adapter. It could be done, but that would make the shortest registration distance for any full frame on the market. If the mount in larger in diameter it could fit inside rather than in front of the ff mount and maintain the same registration distance for both formats. Essentially like the m42 adapter does but with electronic contacts. Crop mode would yield big fat pixels that would work in low light. ---------- Post added 09-08-18 at 06:49 PM ---------- Granted most wouldn't be happy with the low pixel count.

09-08-2018, 04:22 PM	#126
Pål Jensen Site Supporter Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Norway Photos: Albums Posts: 4,371	Mirrorless technology is about as meaningful phrase as sunroofless technology about a car without a sunroof.

09-08-2018, 06:10 PM - 1 Like	#127
surfar Pentaxian Join Date: Jan 2015 Location: mid nth coast,nsw Photos: Gallery Posts: 6,141	Originally posted by Pål Jensen Mirrorless technology is Gaining momentum.........................]Mirror technology is gradually saying goodbye.

09-08-2018, 07:38 PM	#128
reh321 Pentaxian Join Date: Nov 2014 Location: South Bend, IN, USA Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 23,177	Originally posted by Pål Jensen Mirrorless technology is about as meaningful phrase as sunroofless technology about a car without a sunroof. "Mirrorless" is incomplete - it could refer to a P&S - but "MILC" - interchangeable lenses without mirror - is completely meaningful in current context

09-10-2018, 12:39 PM	#131
rawr Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 11,913	Originally posted by surfar No mention of the crop adapter for M43,so perhaps that was Fake News. There seems an awful lot of marketing fog about Panasonic at the moment. Not much point reporting on rumours on top of rumours until something concrete comes out about Panasonic (or Samsung ... or Olympus ... or some Chinese company's plans). Not long until Photokina.

09-10-2018, 01:56 PM	#132
surfar Pentaxian Join Date: Jan 2015 Location: mid nth coast,nsw Photos: Gallery Posts: 6,141	Originally posted by rawr Not much point reporting on rumours Funny thing is,plenty of the rumours are accurate. I like to formulate an idea of anything new as the information becomes available. I purposely didnt list the high end video specs which come from the accurate sources according to the site administrator(he rates the accuracy numerically). Originally posted by rawr There seems an awful lot of marketing fog about Panasonic Where,i look for fog every morning mostly its clear!

09-10-2018, 05:09 PM	#133
disconnekt Pentaxian Join Date: Oct 2011 Location: SoCal/I.E. Photos: Albums Posts: 1,699	Originally posted by surfar Funny thing is,plenty of the rumours are accurate. I like to formulate an idea of anything new as the information becomes available. I purposely didnt list the high end video specs which come from the accurate sources according to the site administrator(he rates the accuracy numerically). Yeah, plus the rumor sites are usually ~95% accurate at least a month before a camera is even announced its being delevoped at times.

09-11-2018, 08:39 AM	#135
mtgmansf Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2013 Posts: 321	Originally posted by surfar CaNik glass will be adaptable to the Panasonic....Thats unusual.The adapters will be made by Panasonic. So thats really a play for CaNik users. Come buy our body and use your existing lenses. I'm wondering if this is the Nuke in the war?...$$$ony have something up their sleeve I'm sure. If it is primarily for high-end video - as many of us suspect - it is going to be an expensive 8K and FF machine. If SL mount, Leica sl lenses will not be too far out of the expense equation for native glass, as well as PL and Arri mount lenses -since those adapters already exist, and if the SL is the primary mounting system. Of course, you can mount Pentax, Nikon, and Canon lenses too (Novoflex adapters). In this way, the SL mount is very clever move and Panasonic can take their time coming up with their own native lenses - expensive or not - to satisfy still and video photographers. Another plus is, Pentax owners will have the option to use their glass on this camera, if only with manual focus...