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09-20-2018, 06:00 AM   #211
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QuoteOriginally posted by Rondec Quote
There are tons of rumors going around right now, among them a Samsung sensor capable of 15 fps and a new processing engine from Samsung as well. This sort of thing certainly could boost the K3 III up as far as specs considerably.
Ya, a 15 FPS frame rate would be a pentax game changer, for guys like me who take advantage of Pentax's fast AF.s and refocus when necessary, that might put me ahead of a D500 shooter. Less capture percentage, but over all, a higher number of keepers. But I'm not dreaming that's ever going to happen. I think when these rumours are put out people think "what would it take to make Pentax APS-c top of the class, and then project those specs. But If there is one weakness to the D500, it's it's 10 FPS frame rate, compared to the big boys.

As noted above, a 15 FPS second hand 1Dx is more appealing IMHO.

09-20-2018, 06:08 AM   #212
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QuoteOriginally posted by Rondec Quote
assuming Pentax keeps an SLR design
They have only said they will continue to develop K mount and they said 2 years ago that they didnt rate EVFs good enough to do a M/L body.

Well EVFs are good enough now and K mount M/L has been around since 2012,ha ha...but i think it'll be a mirrored body too.
QuoteOriginally posted by Rondec Quote
there is no way that faster than 10 or 12 fps frame rate will be available except in live view, where tracking will be abysmal
Do you doubt what Ricoh engineering can do?...Its a BSI remember.
09-20-2018, 06:13 AM   #213
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QuoteOriginally posted by surfar Quote
They have only said they will continue to develop K mount and they said 2 years ago that they didnt rate EVFs good enough to do a M/L body.

Well EVFs are good enough now and K mount M/L has been around since 2012,ha ha...but i think it'll be a mirrored body too.

Do you doubt what Ricoh engineering can do?...Its a BSI remember.
These sorts of frame rates usually aren't available with mechanical shutter and so typically you have the mirror locked up and use an electronic shutter. Anyway, this all way speculative. It just need to be said that just because Ricoh has been at a certain place till now, it doesn't mean that they will always stay there.
09-20-2018, 06:16 AM - 1 Like   #214
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QuoteOriginally posted by BigMackCam Quote
I guess it depends on your definition of "pro level". I've always considered the K-3 and K-3II to be "pro level" in terms of build quality, feature set and image quality, whilst accepting that they were never market leading for AF.C and video.

If the K-3II replacement offers equal to, or better than, KP performance at high ISO (with any raw NR switchable on/off), noticeably improved AF.C, an articulating screen and dual cards, whilst retaining or improving on the flagship build quality, weather resistance and functional feature set, that would - IMHO - be a worthy successor to the K-3II.

I don't think there will be anything to "wow" you if you're expecting or hoping for significantly more than this. But maybe there'll be a few pleasant surprises
A bump in the buffer and 10fps minimum would certainly wow me with the aforementioned items above.

High ISO performance and AF-c improvements is a must in my opinion.
Dual cards already exist, so removing that would be a massive failure, also in my opinion.
Articulating screen would be amazing! Don't even change what they've done with the K-1, I think that's a fantastic design and it wouldn't cost any more in R&D (marginal if any)...

Also, keeping the current battery and grip would be ideal so I don't have to fully upgrade my kit and replace all the accessories and batteries I already own... Those things add up!

09-20-2018, 06:41 AM   #215
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QuoteOriginally posted by Rondec Quote
Regardless, assuming Pentax keeps an SLR design (which they will), there is no way that faster than 10 or 12 fps frame rate will be available except in live view, where tracking will be abysmal.
How good is tracking on Sony cameras?
09-20-2018, 06:56 AM   #216
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Tamron has 6 year warranty,weighs 1kg less,and costs 600 less.

---------- Post added 09-21-18 at 12:59 AM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by UserAccessDenied Quote
He does a 500mm shoot-out and talks a lot about the Sigma 150-600 Sport version.
Yes, that blog was before the Tamron was released.

The G2 series are very good,theres a 15-30 coming soon as well....70-200 is highly rated.

---------- Post added 09-21-18 at 01:02 AM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by Rondec Quote
These sorts of frame rates usually aren't available with mechanical shutter
Yes, i think its around 11fps mechanical.Anyway its just wait and see.
09-20-2018, 08:53 AM   #217
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All Pentax has to do for 15 FPS is do what a 1Dx did 5 years ago. Surely that tech has to get cheaper over time and will eventually work it's way down to cheaper cameras.

And I'l call you Shirley if I feel like it.

---------- Post added 09-20-18 at 12:00 PM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by reh321 Quote
How good is tracking on Sony cameras?
As good as a 1Dx on an A9 as far as I can tell from various reviews etc. The A9 was definitely designed to be a 1Dx killer. How it is on cheaper Sony cameras I have no idea. You assume having a top rated tracking system, means they have trickle down to their other models. Unfortunately for Pentax users, not having top tracking cameras in any model means there's nothing to trickle down. Hence this whole discussion.

Pentax will have better tracking when it's available at a good price off the shelf. Sooner or later, some non-camera brand parts manufacturer is going to come up with something.

Some people make and design components, some people watch the market to see what's coming for more focussed manufacturers to try and spread development costs among other purchasers.

Pentax builds original lenses, and bare bones cameras to go with them, with an emphasis on IQ. It's no coincidence they built the custom accelerator chip to improve IQ before they built a dedicated AF module,

Since the days of Hoya, Pentax bodies seem to have been built to sell Pentax glass. You have to have something, right?

That's why I like them. Looking at the D500, that module is pretty expensive, A K-3 with slightly better FPS but much better AF. But as for what Pentax cares about, probably not as good a a K-P.


Last edited by normhead; 09-20-2018 at 09:28 AM.
09-20-2018, 09:57 AM   #218
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QuoteOriginally posted by surfar Quote
I'm wondering why you think that?



Only people with inside info know whats in the works Kev,What i think they have in the works might leave the D500 in the dust.





Yes, only the engineer knows...i hope he tells the marketing guy,who doubles as the YouTube producer,who also is the cleaner!

Theres also the new $$$ony thats been pimped as a Mini A9,stacked sensor and all.Rumoured to be U$1300 but that could be way off?

Patience is the key word here,this year has seen plenty of new stuff,all of which is outstanding.The D500 is very capable but its OLD,new will come along.
As I stated, opinions are not facts, so who knows? I do know Pentax really needs to produce in the auto-focus area, and so far they haven't done so. So, that alone makes me think it won't happen anytime soon. In my opinion, there is no reason to wait and see. There are camera's available now that are suited for the OP's needs such as the D500.

I've been hearing rumor on top of rumor for years. I much prefer action and production. I'm from the school of "Put it on the shelf, then we discuss it's value".


Just my 2 pennies worth.

Last edited by kevinWE; 09-20-2018 at 10:49 AM.
09-20-2018, 10:29 AM   #219
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No one seems to have mentioned that the d500 has slightly lower mp than the k3. The d500 is a lower resolution camera at 20.9 mp vs 24.35mp (roughly 16.5% more than the d500) so the cropping you can do will be slightly lower -
I personally think this is a fairly low difference but it does impact buffer sizes and frame rates ...
09-20-2018, 10:47 AM - 1 Like   #220
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QuoteOriginally posted by UncleVanya Quote
No one seems to have mentioned that the d500 has slightly lower mp than the k3. The d500 is a lower resolution camera at 20.9 mp vs 24.35mp (roughly 16.5% more than the d500) so the cropping you can do will be slightly lower -
I personally think this is a fairly low difference but it does impact buffer sizes and frame rates ...
I've pointed out to the high FPS fast tracking guys many times that if I get the image with a K-1, my image will be measurably better than others. The standard response is ,I don't need more than 12 MP or, 16 MP or 20 MP or 24 MP or whatever their favourite camera has. The thing is, if you want fast tracking and a high frame rate, I think a lot of these guys would be happy with 8 MP. Just based on the responses. This is an argument that might not impress us all purpose shooters, because I definitely want what my K-1 has to offer over a D500, but my wife is happy with 16 MP. A D500 for her would be like heaven. High res, despite what you might think, can be overlooked in favour of other features by some shooters.

Knowing a guy who shoots with a D810 when his wife shoots with a D500, there clearly isn't a preference uniting even families. She wants a better chance to get the image. He wants the image that if he does get it, is a clearly a superior image. There's this whole discussion in a nutshell. They haven't resolved it. Noether will we.

Personal differences rear their ugly heads.

I've even heard people say they just take frames out of 4k video, that's good enough for them.
There's no limit to how much some people value action images.

If you're willing to put up with reduced IQ, the sky is the limit.

On the sliding scale of IQ over tracking and action capability, the D500 is a pretty good compromise.

Last edited by normhead; 09-20-2018 at 03:42 PM.
09-20-2018, 11:10 AM   #221
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QuoteOriginally posted by normhead Quote
As good as a 1Dx on an A9 as far as I can tell from various reviews etc. The A9 was definitely designed to be a 1Dx killer. How it is on cheaper Sony cameras I have no idea. You assume having a top rated tracking system, means they have trickle down to their other models. Unfortunately for Pentax users, not having top tracking cameras in any model means there's nothing to trickle down. Hence this whole discussion.
Tracking is excellent on the A7iii, even as their 'basic' MILC. Excellent, fast tracking AF-C combined with 10fps, a relatively large buffer, and UHS-II card compatibility helps me get a lot more options for keepers when I'm shooting action. It also allows you to shoot even while the buffer is writing to the card, so there's no down time.
09-20-2018, 11:14 AM - 1 Like   #222
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QuoteOriginally posted by UserAccessDenied Quote
I've put an offer on a 150-450 on the marketplace, waiting to hear back from the seller.
It's probably the best move right now. If you can find a used one at a fair price, it means you could try it as much as you want and resell it without losing much money, if any, if it doesn't work for you. At worst, you will have lost a few weeks but at least will have the certitude that this setup doesn't work for you. At best, it works good enough for you and will have save a lot on money!
09-20-2018, 11:18 AM - 2 Likes   #223
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QuoteOriginally posted by neokind Quote
It also allows you to shoot even while the buffer is writing to the card, so there's no down time.
One of the most irritating things about shooting action with Pentax tis just that. It turned Kenspo away from Pentax. Yesterday it was a major source of irritation for me. But all that is the benefit of a dedicated AF and a separate exit pipeline. not dependant on the central processor, which I suspect Pentax deems too expensive to implement, That's why they call it a field camera.

You get the impression if you have small kids and you just want better pictures of them running around, Pentax is not for you. For guys like me who take picture, mostly of fields, Pentax is alright, most of the time, and irritating the rest of the time.

There's a how much irritation can you stand, factor. I know some will say I don't fit the profile, I can be very patient with equipment, it's people that bother me.

For me, figuring out how to do it with aPentax is half the fun. If it takes longer that's OK, because I'll probably just be bored soon as my files are processed, so I may as well enjoy more time out in the fields with my camera.

I've also started watching baseball.

I never watched while I could play, and I played until i was 63, but now, somehow it's interesting. My wife says I should be managing because I'm always explaining what the managers did wrong, and what idiots the commentators are .

You get to be old enough, you just want to slow the good times down and make them last.

One thing I haven't seen mentioned is how easy it is to shoot int he larger full frame viewfinder. It's easier to follow the bird, you can still crop to higher than 20 MP, and the bird can be a lot foruther away, making tracking unnecessary. The shot with AF.s and heavily cropped.







And I find the K-1 crops are much cleaner pixel peeping than any APS-c images I've seen.

This image is is good as a pixel peeper as any APS-c image I'seen oversampled.


These images are from this week's micro observations, the kind you get when you shoot lots. There is nothing theoretical about them. I'm not searching my files here trying to prove a point.

Last edited by normhead; 09-20-2018 at 12:08 PM.
09-20-2018, 11:58 AM   #224
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QuoteOriginally posted by reh321 Quote
How good is tracking on Sony cameras?
It depends on the body, not? Pretty amazing on the A9 and poor on the A7 and varies on the bodies in between.
09-20-2018, 11:59 AM   #225
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QuoteOriginally posted by Rondec Quote
There are tons of rumors going around right now, among them a Samsung sensor capable of 15 fps and a new processing engine from Samsung as well. This sort of thing certainly could boost the K3 III up as far as specs considerably.
We're both conjecturing, but that rumored sensor isn't needed for a spec upgrade. Sony has been selling a 24mp 19fps sensor for 2 years.

Couple that sesnor with improved AF tracking, fast buffer able to handle newer card speeds, large buffer, and an upgraded mirror/shutter assembly. 19fps from a reasonably priced (sub $1500) DSLR is unrealistic because of the physical mirror. Aim for 10fps, maybe add a gimmick to take 2 images via electronic shutter for each flap of the mirror to use the full 19fps.


8fps from the K-3ii is already pretty good, but since that camera is discontinued they have to make some type of improvement to justify a new body. AF and speed seem like the natural places to go with APS-C. I suppose they could stick with 8 fps but make a big improvement in noise handling.
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