Olympus OMD EM1X coming in January.

mee · 11-04-2018, 07:12 PM

Originally posted by wibbly

So a boosted 2 litre that moves the same amount of fuel and air and produces the same horsepower and torque as a naturally aspirated 4 litre has not found a replacement for displacement?

Really?

Really.

The 4 liter, after it's boosted, will step all over that boosted 2 liter. It didn't solve the issue of larger motor, more power potential. And, even without it, will theoretically be more reliable than the tiny boosted motor.

We can go round and around as long as you want wibbly... or you can just accept we don't agree. And we can move on to more valuable means of spending our time.

Does that sound like a fair idea?

wibbly · 11-04-2018, 07:38 PM

The application of a replacement for displacement doesn't depend on a starting point

You have added this to the statement.

I have been very clear in my assertion that displacement can be replaced with boost. All you have suggested is that boosting a larger engine (adding displacement) nets a greater outcome (no shit Sherlock), however the starting place has never been suggested and should have never been assumed.

Winder · 11-04-2018, 09:07 PM

Originally posted by mee

The 4 liter, after it's boosted, will step all over that boosted 2 liter. It didn't solve the issue of larger motor, more power potential. And, even without it, will theoretically be more reliable than the tiny boosted motor.

Originally posted by wibbly

I have been very clear in my assertion that displacement can be replaced with boost. All you have suggested is that boosting a larger engine (adding displacement) nets a greater outcome (no shit Sherlock), however the starting place has never been suggested and should have never been assumed.

Is the new Olympus going to have a V8?

wibbly · 11-04-2018, 09:36 PM

The conversation isn't about cameras. It's about the fallacy of a statement made previously.

But of course, with cameras bigger isn't always better. There is a horsepower ceiling so to speak. It's ridiculous to consider only one variable in the equation

But I digress, my initial post was merely to challenge the initial statement. That's all I've done.

mee · 11-04-2018, 10:09 PM

Originally posted by wibbly

The application of a replacement for displacement doesn't depend on a starting point

You have added this to the statement.

No, you added to the statement. I just used afterwards as it was the basis for the context of how you were applying original phrase.

Originally posted by wibbly

I have been very clear in my assertion that displacement can be replaced with boost. All you have suggested is that boosting a larger engine (adding displacement) nets a greater outcome (no shit Sherlock), however the starting place has never been suggested and should have never been assumed.

Well, no. Boosting a larger engine doesn't add displacement. It adds more power. The physical displacement of the motor remained the same despite pressurizing more air into the space. A 3.5 liter v6 with twin turbos is still a 3.5 liter v6. It may generate twice (or more) power at the crank after boosting, but it is still a 3.5 liter v6.

Despite your rudness, which is against the TOS of this site, there isn't a starting place to the meaning of the phrase. We agree. There is no replacement for displacement since boost increases for all size of motors and the larger the motor the more potential power generated.

And the context of using the phrase originally was to introduce another way of describing how technology is not entirely overcoming the physical properties of a larger sensor. Because, even if you somehow 'boost' a smaller sensor to output comparable IQ of a larger sensor, you can boost the larger sensor and do just the same. It scales too (in theory).

wibbly · 11-04-2018, 10:27 PM - **1 Like**

Again, you've missed the point.

You can write all the long diatribes you want about this, if you have failed to understand the point there can be no progress. I won't spell it out for you again.

Have a good one.

**BigMackCam** · 11-05-2018, 05:21 AM

Folks - let's leave the current argument there, please? Points have been raised, discussed, disagreed upon, and we're now just getting into back-and-forth "You're wrong / No, you're wrong". Best to draw a line under it, I think

Thank you

surfar · 11-05-2018, 02:42 PM

---------- Post added 11-06-18 at 08:43 AM ----------

[/COLOR]So latest news its a "1DX" style body and anticipated performance rival.

Announced January,not released then.

Winder · 11-05-2018, 06:17 PM

Everyone seems to think Olympus is going to release a high end M4/3. Let's remember that Olympus has patented 7 FF mirrorless lenses over the last 5 years and next year happens to be Olympus's 100th anniversary.

What kind of "big" announcement could Olympus be planning for their 100th? I wonder why they declined to join the Pana/Leica/Sigma FF group? I guess they have other plans.

surfar · 11-05-2018, 07:10 PM

[/COLOR]

Originally posted by Winder

Everyone seems to think Olympus is going to release a high end M4/3

Theres been plenty of indications its M43, I dont think they will enter the FF war yet.I think they could wait and see who survives the major battles till they go FF.

Its their 100yr celebration in 2019,maybe a complete surprise?

awscreo · 11-05-2018, 08:56 PM

Originally posted by Winder

Everyone seems to think Olympus is going to release a high end M4/3. Let's remember that Olympus has patented 7 FF mirrorless lenses over the last 5 years and next year happens to be Olympus's 100th anniversary.

What kind of "big" announcement could Olympus be planning for their 100th? I wonder why they declined to join the Pana/Leica/Sigma FF group? I guess they have other plans.

They'd probably change the naming of the ff line up though. Em1x suggests a super charged em1. I guess aimed at pro sports shooters and journalists.

surfar · 11-05-2018, 09:50 PM

Originally posted by awscreo

Em1x suggests a super charged em1. I guess aimed at pro sports shooters and journalists.

Yes,its being tested now but with non Disclosure Agreements in place the details are sketchy....New year will be Oly and hopefully Pentax's time to shine!

The Squirrel Mafia · 12-13-2018, 11:16 AM

Images of EM1x: Micro Four Thirds Talk Forum: Digital Photography Review

^ Some images of the camera. It looks like a slightly smaller Canon EOS-1D X Mark II or Nikon D5. I guess we'll find out the rest of the specs sometime next year.

wibbly · 12-13-2018, 11:44 AM

they're suggesting it can do handheld high res (pixel shift on steroids, olympus uses 8 frames for pixel shift) which would be interesting for sure.

**Rondec** · 12-13-2018, 12:53 PM

Originally posted by wibbly

they're suggesting it can do handheld high res (pixel shift on steroids, olympus uses 8 frames for pixel shift) which would be interesting for sure.

I guess. Pentax's handheld pixel shift isn't anything to write home about. In my experience it slows the camera down a bunch to use it (takes about a minute to process) and in the end doesn't really improve the image that much. Maybe Olympus's version will be better. My understanding from what Bruce Banner has done with experimenting with multiple images post processed in this fashion is that more than four images seldom adds much to the image quality.

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11-04-2018, 07:12 PM	#31
mee Veteran Member Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 7,403	Originally posted by wibbly So a boosted 2 litre that moves the same amount of fuel and air and produces the same horsepower and torque as a naturally aspirated 4 litre has not found a replacement for displacement? Really? Really. The 4 liter, after it's boosted, will step all over that boosted 2 liter. It didn't solve the issue of larger motor, more power potential. And, even without it, will theoretically be more reliable than the tiny boosted motor. We can go round and around as long as you want wibbly... or you can just accept we don't agree. And we can move on to more valuable means of spending our time. Does that sound like a fair idea?

11-04-2018, 07:38 PM	#32
wibbly Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2014 Location: Edmonton Posts: 600	The application of a replacement for displacement doesn't depend on a starting point You have added this to the statement. I have been very clear in my assertion that displacement can be replaced with boost. All you have suggested is that boosting a larger engine (adding displacement) nets a greater outcome (no shit Sherlock), however the starting place has never been suggested and should have never been assumed.

11-04-2018, 09:07 PM	#33
Winder Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2010 Location: Tennessee Posts: 6,617	Originally posted by mee The 4 liter, after it's boosted, will step all over that boosted 2 liter. It didn't solve the issue of larger motor, more power potential. And, even without it, will theoretically be more reliable than the tiny boosted motor. Originally posted by wibbly I have been very clear in my assertion that displacement can be replaced with boost. All you have suggested is that boosting a larger engine (adding displacement) nets a greater outcome (no shit Sherlock), however the starting place has never been suggested and should have never been assumed. Is the new Olympus going to have a V8?

11-04-2018, 09:36 PM	#34
wibbly Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2014 Location: Edmonton Posts: 600	The conversation isn't about cameras. It's about the fallacy of a statement made previously. But of course, with cameras bigger isn't always better. There is a horsepower ceiling so to speak. It's ridiculous to consider only one variable in the equation But I digress, my initial post was merely to challenge the initial statement. That's all I've done.

11-04-2018, 10:09 PM	#35
mee Veteran Member Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 7,403	Originally posted by wibbly The application of a replacement for displacement doesn't depend on a starting point You have added this to the statement. No, you added to the statement. I just used afterwards as it was the basis for the context of how you were applying original phrase. Originally posted by wibbly I have been very clear in my assertion that displacement can be replaced with boost. All you have suggested is that boosting a larger engine (adding displacement) nets a greater outcome (no shit Sherlock), however the starting place has never been suggested and should have never been assumed. Well, no. Boosting a larger engine doesn't add displacement. It adds more power. The physical displacement of the motor remained the same despite pressurizing more air into the space. A 3.5 liter v6 with twin turbos is still a 3.5 liter v6. It may generate twice (or more) power at the crank after boosting, but it is still a 3.5 liter v6. Despite your rudness, which is against the TOS of this site, there isn't a starting place to the meaning of the phrase. We agree. There is no replacement for displacement since boost increases for all size of motors and the larger the motor the more potential power generated. And the context of using the phrase originally was to introduce another way of describing how technology is not entirely overcoming the physical properties of a larger sensor. Because, even if you somehow 'boost' a smaller sensor to output comparable IQ of a larger sensor, you can boost the larger sensor and do just the same. It scales too (in theory).

11-04-2018, 10:27 PM - 1 Like	#36
wibbly Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2014 Location: Edmonton Posts: 600	Again, you've missed the point. You can write all the long diatribes you want about this, if you have failed to understand the point there can be no progress. I won't spell it out for you again. Have a good one.

11-05-2018, 05:21 AM	#37
BigMackCam Digitiser of Film Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: North East of England Posts: 20,674	Folks - let's leave the current argument there, please? Points have been raised, discussed, disagreed upon, and we're now just getting into back-and-forth "You're wrong / No, you're wrong". Best to draw a line under it, I think Thank you

11-05-2018, 02:42 PM	#38
surfar Pentaxian Join Date: Jan 2015 Location: mid nth coast,nsw Photos: Gallery Posts: 6,141 Original Poster	---------- Post added 11-06-18 at 08:43 AM ---------- [/COLOR]So latest news its a "1DX" style body and anticipated performance rival. Announced January,not released then.

11-05-2018, 06:17 PM	#39
Winder Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2010 Location: Tennessee Posts: 6,617	Everyone seems to think Olympus is going to release a high end M4/3. Let's remember that Olympus has patented 7 FF mirrorless lenses over the last 5 years and next year happens to be Olympus's 100th anniversary. What kind of "big" announcement could Olympus be planning for their 100th? I wonder why they declined to join the Pana/Leica/Sigma FF group? I guess they have other plans.

11-05-2018, 07:10 PM	#40
surfar Pentaxian Join Date: Jan 2015 Location: mid nth coast,nsw Photos: Gallery Posts: 6,141 Original Poster	[/COLOR] Originally posted by Winder Everyone seems to think Olympus is going to release a high end M4/3 Theres been plenty of indications its M43, I dont think they will enter the FF war yet.I think they could wait and see who survives the major battles till they go FF. Its their 100yr celebration in 2019,maybe a complete surprise?

11-05-2018, 08:56 PM	#41
awscreo Veteran Member Join Date: May 2016 Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 2,722	Originally posted by Winder Everyone seems to think Olympus is going to release a high end M4/3. Let's remember that Olympus has patented 7 FF mirrorless lenses over the last 5 years and next year happens to be Olympus's 100th anniversary. What kind of "big" announcement could Olympus be planning for their 100th? I wonder why they declined to join the Pana/Leica/Sigma FF group? I guess they have other plans. They'd probably change the naming of the ff line up though. Em1x suggests a super charged em1. I guess aimed at pro sports shooters and journalists.

11-05-2018, 09:50 PM	#42
surfar Pentaxian Join Date: Jan 2015 Location: mid nth coast,nsw Photos: Gallery Posts: 6,141 Original Poster	Originally posted by awscreo Em1x suggests a super charged em1. I guess aimed at pro sports shooters and journalists. Yes,its being tested now but with non Disclosure Agreements in place the details are sketchy....New year will be Oly and hopefully Pentax's time to shine!

12-13-2018, 11:16 AM	#43
The Squirrel Mafia Pentaxian Join Date: Jan 2015 Posts: 3,054	Images of EM1x: Micro Four Thirds Talk Forum: Digital Photography Review ^ Some images of the camera. It looks like a slightly smaller Canon EOS-1D X Mark II or Nikon D5. I guess we'll find out the rest of the specs sometime next year.

12-13-2018, 11:44 AM	#44
wibbly Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2014 Location: Edmonton Posts: 600	they're suggesting it can do handheld high res (pixel shift on steroids, olympus uses 8 frames for pixel shift) which would be interesting for sure.

12-13-2018, 12:53 PM	#45
Rondec Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Gladys, Virginia Photos: Gallery Posts: 27,653	Originally posted by wibbly they're suggesting it can do handheld high res (pixel shift on steroids, olympus uses 8 frames for pixel shift) which would be interesting for sure. I guess. Pentax's handheld pixel shift isn't anything to write home about. In my experience it slows the camera down a bunch to use it (takes about a minute to process) and in the end doesn't really improve the image that much. Maybe Olympus's version will be better. My understanding from what Bruce Banner has done with experimenting with multiple images post processed in this fashion is that more than four images seldom adds much to the image quality.