[MarkJerling]

I have some eyes trouble and also headaches from EVFs in general. But since I've got the chance to play with lots of mirrorless cameras and EVFs are starting to get better and better, things are a little better. I also switch shooting from time to time from EVF to live view so that my eyes can rest a little.

As I said above, the RP EVF is a tad better than the one from Sony A7 III but not as good as the one from EOS R which in my opinion is clearly better than EOS RP and A7 III.

Aha. Good feedback, thanks. Like you; I thought the EOS R is (marginally) better than the A7 III, but I've not used the RP.

[Dan Rentea]

OK,I'll await your decision.

I ordered the EOS R. It's more balanced, with a better grip and EVF than EOS RP...

Now I'm waiting for the firmware update for EOS R (min. 4:30 in the below video) and for that beautiful 15-35mm f2.8L IS lens to become available in stores. The RF 15-35mm f2.8 with EF 85mm f1.4L IS + adaptor will be enough for me. I will probably buy also the RF 35mm f1.8 for vacations...

You Tube

You Tube

[biz-engineer]

Three new lenses, this is exciting

[Dan Rentea]

Three new lenses, this is exciting

With these releases there are 6 pro lenses for Canon mirrorless:
1. Canon RF 15-35mm f2.8L IS
2. Canon RF 24-70mm f2.8L IS
3. Canon RF 70-200mm f2.8L IS which looks amazingly compact (Canon said this lens will be on stores in the middle of November)
4. Canon RF 28-70mm f2L
5. Canon RF 50mm f1.2L
6. Canon RF 85mm f1.2L

and another 3 consumer lenses:
1. Canon RF 24-105mm f4L IS
2. Canon RF 24-240mm f/4-6.3 IS
3. Canon RF 35mm f1.8 IS macro

And the rumors let us believe that another 10 lenses are scheduled for 2020, some of them being some crazy lenses like 28-70mm f2L. So yes, I'm excited because I'm more interested in lenses and these new lenses seems to be excelent.

[dstar]

With probably around 12-15000 total price for all
Amazing

[Dan Rentea]

With probably around 12-15000 total price for all
Amazing

The pro lenses are not for everybody. But once you get them the bodies become less important.

[biz-engineer]

The pro lenses are not for everybody.

"PRO" is a big word. By today's image quality standards, full frame IQ became consumer. While the Canon glass is certainly excellent, I think all camera makers miss the mark by still making full frame format for professional use. There is a huge lack of investment in the medium format. BTW, I wouldn't buy full frame photos for big prints anymore, it's just that the quality that used to be standing out in the 5D days, relative to apsc images, doesn't stand out anymore. Canon should lead the way by making a good MF system, and let a single product line of FF mirrorless for the consumer segment.

[Dan Rentea]

"PRO" is a big word.

No it's not. It's just a word like any other.

By today's image quality standards, full frame IQ became consumer.

It will always be a difference between micro 4/3, APS-C, full frame and medium format if we talk about image quality in certain circumstances, like large prints or high ISO.

While the Canon glass is certainly excellent, I think all camera makers miss the mark by still making full frame format for professional use.

Why they missed the mark?

There is a huge lack of investment in the medium format. BTW, I wouldn't buy full frame photos for big prints anymore, it's just that the quality that used to be standing out in the 5D days, relative to apsc images, doesn't stand out anymore.

I'm sure that the ones who need big quality prints for commercial use have medium format cameras. Those photographers are in small numbers because they don't work with quantity in terms of clients like the others, but they work with clients with big budgets and they charge 5000$ - 10.000$ for a shooting session. There are few such clients...

Canon should lead the way by making a good MF system, and let a single product line of FF mirrorless for the consumer segment.

Why? By going to medium format you go to a niche market where there is already competition: Hasselblad and Phase One. I haven't seen photographers selling their big Hasselblad or Phase One cameras and jump to Fuji medium format cameras... And there is a bigger Pro market for full frame: sports photographers, wildlife photographers, wedding photographers, etc. Pro doesn't necessary translate into huge prints. But pro gear like Canon L lenses means:
- solid construction
- no chromatic abberations
- fast and reliable focus
- excelent micro-contrast
- etc.

Same with cameras... why a sport photographer will go next year to Japan's Olimpic games with a medium format camera? By going with a medium format camera that photographer will be a pro among the ones shooting with 1Dx/D5 cameras? I don't think so. Even if he manage to get some wide angle shots with a medium format camera that will look better printed large than the ones taken with 24mp sport cameras, he will miss a lot of shots because medium format cameras aren't suited for action.

So, to me the 6 RF lenses are pro lenses for what they deliver compared to consumer lenses. I see this every day when I'm shooting. I use 85mm f1.8 lens when I go out to have fun because it's light and small, but when I have some paid portrait shootings the 85mm f1.8 stays at home and I use 85mm f1.4L and it's a completely different experience with different results.

[biz-engineer]

Why they missed the mark?

They miss the mark because Fuji and Hassy can sell MF lenses at the price of Canon RF glass. Given that MF prices are constrained by low volumes, there is a huge opportunity to increase both volumes and profit margin if Canon are promoting a medium format line instead of making large glass for full frame at the same prime as Fuji MF glass. If Canon deployed in the MF market segment, the selection of camera systems would be much more interesting: 1/3rd apsc for occasional shooters, 1/3rd of the market FF for enthusiasts, and 1/3rd of the market for professionals and highly demanding enthusiasts. The FF tech is stretched to the max., we don't see much improvement from DSLR FF, while mirrorless tech makes MF system sizes as convenient as FF DSLR is. What I want to say, is that today the camera offering is unbalanced, too much redundant investment in full frame and clearly not enough development in medium format. When I see Canon selling FF glass at more than $2000, I think they could sell to the same customers and more customer medium format glass at the same price.

[Dan Rentea]

They miss the mark because Fuji and Hassy can sell MF lenses at the price of Canon RF glass. Given that MF prices are constrained by low volumes, there is a huge opportunity to increase both volumes and profit margin if Canon are promoting a medium format line instead of making large glass for full frame at the same prime as Fuji MF glass.

Maybe... But I want just the glass from Canon because I'm already more than ok with what Canon bodies deliver. I wouldn't buy medium format cameras as long as I don't have clients who want bigger prints than 20-30". And I assume there are more people like me than the ones who need medium format in their work. It's pretty much a waste of time and money to shoot with medium format as long as you don't have a market for it. That's why there are tons of international commercial photographers who don't need medium format for their work, even if they shoot for fashion magazines and they afford to buy any gear they want...

This guy for example (Felix Rachor - https://felix-rachor.com/) is a professional photographer and he is using EOS R for his beauty, fashion and celebrity shootings. Why would he buy a 6000$ camera as long as the 2000$ camera does what he wants?

Or why this girl ( Lara Jade - https://www.larajade.com/ ) should use a medium format camera as long as she is happy with her full frame and she makes tons of money?

I don't think it's a money problem for photographers like the ones from above examples and yet, they shoot by their choice with a 30mp EOS R or with 50mp 5DsR camera...

Or take Peter Hurley for example as he is using both 5DsR and Phase One. On his website ( https://peterhurley.com/ ) he has 3 or 4 headshots taken with 5DsR (this is what Peter Hurley said in an interview). The rest were taken with Phase One. See if you can manage to spot those taken with 5DsR because no one managed to find them.

[biz-engineer]

there are tons of international commercial photographers who don't need medium format for their work

Why would they need the new Canon RF lenses then? My reasoning is simple, if there is a big market for such expensive FF lenses, then by system equivalence there is a market for medium format. The achilles' heel of current MF mirroress systems is the poor AF, If a high performance AF would be added to a medium format mirrorless camera system , such system would offer more value to customers, the market would be huge. Why would someone need faster and sharper lenses and not a larger sensor? Strange.

[Dan Rentea]

Why would they need the new Canon RF lenses then?

I need/want RF lenses in particular because they make my life easier in some difficult shooting situations. They are super fast to focus, sharp wide open (I've tested RF 50mm f1.2 despite the fact that I don't like this focal range and it's impressive), have no chromatic aberations, they have also that customizable ring control which is very handy and they have a certain look compared to consumer lenses.

My reasoning is simple, if there is a big market for such expensive FF lenses, then by system equivalence there is a market for medium format.

Yes, it is. But that market isn't growing fast as full frame mirrorless market developed and we have an example with Fuji. 95% of Fuji owners shoot with APS-C cameras despite the fact that Fuji is trying to push the market to medium format with their "afordable" prices and internet marketing.

The achilles' heel of current MF mirroress systems is the poor AF, If a high performance AF would be added to a medium format mirrorless camera system , such system would offer more value to customers, the market would be huge.

Yes, the poor af of medium format cameras can be one of the biggest problem to some photographers.

Why would someone need faster and sharper lenses and not a larger sensor? Strange.

The same reason why many shoot with APS-C cameras and fast full frame lenses. The same reason why people are willing to spend 3500$ on a micro 4/3 Olympus camera. The same way why some pro photographers shoot with 5D Mark IV/EOS R and not with 5DsR or they shoot with A7 III and not with A7R IV. The same reason why medium format owners shoot also with full frame if they don't need for a certain task the medium format camera.

[Winder]

Canon is doing an awesome job with glass right now. They should be able to fix most of the issues with the EOS-R with firmware updates. Hopefully we see a higher end camera announced by the end of the year and they can put more pressure on Sony. Its going to be fun to watch them fight it out. Hopefully Nikon and Panasonic can carve out decent market share as well. The more options we have the better off we are.

[repaap]

Canon is sertainly showing the advantages of that mirrorless thing more than other brands, when it comes to making lenses. Not sure how much is corrected also with digital processing with these. But for example that 70-200 looks small, or then those 15-35 and 24-70 are huge(they are not that small either, looking them in that video)!

If sony will be going head to head against these, it will not be good news to A7/9 line because their OEM lenses will not work with that new body with out adapter

[Dan Rentea]

...or then those 15-35 and 24-70 are huge(they are not that small either, looking them in that video)!

Canon RF 15-35mm f2.8 weights 840g and the size of it is 88.5 x 126.8 mm (3.48 x 4.99"). Pentax D-FA 15-30mm f2.8 weights 1040g and the size of it is 90.86 x 140.35 cm (3.88 x 5.65"). So, the Canon lens it's smaller, lighter than Pentax lens and it has extra 5mm on the long end. But Canon lens it's more expensive.

Canon RF 24-70mm f2.8 weights 900g and the size of it is 88.5 x 125.7 mm (3.48 x 4.95"). Pentax D-FA 24-70mm f2.8 weights 787g and the size of it is 88.5 x 109.5 mm (3.48 x 4.31"). Pentax lens is also less expensive.