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12-21-2020, 02:27 PM   #31
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QuoteOriginally posted by KiloHotelphoto Quote
Landscapes or architecture shooters will not benefit from it.
I'm intending to use the R5 for both but not in fast mode!

---------- Post added 12-22-20 at 08:47 AM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by Rondec Quote
I think it has been good for Canon, bad for Nikon, and bad for Sony.
Sony had the mo$t to lo$e obviou$ly having 100% market share,whatever CaNik have sold is a bonus because both started at 0% of the market.

Sony changed FF,they forced the 2 FF market leaders to follow their lead.

Canon bought top end glass to the genre,Nikon was content to put out good glass(or silly with the Noct).

Canon caught up to the Sony AF levels,Nikon wins the Bronze.

Nikon are cutting cost$ by stopping manufacturing in Japan.Probably will become the trend.

12-21-2020, 02:49 PM   #32
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QuoteOriginally posted by KiloHotelphoto Quote
When it comes to autofocus tracking it's huge. I shot a 1DX2 for a couple years and that is one of the best DSLR bodies for autofocus and the R5 is much better. I was blown away by it that's why I sold my DSLR bodies and picked up a R6. They also put out another firmware update that corrected a problem I was having with going from near too far or far too near with my 600 F4. I can't image what someone who has only shot a K3 or K1 would think if they shot the R5 for a month.

You get 100% frame coverage not just the 61 points in the middle of the frame and that helps with tracking fast moving animals. The animal eye af works great, it's not perfect but does a great job. I've never tried the people eye af but it looks like it works better than the animal mode. I can imagine for a portrait or wedding type photographer it would speed up your workflow with being able to get the shot quicker.

But if you don't shoot fast moving animals or lots of people you really don't need it. Landscapes or architecture shooters will not benefit from it.
This and the lenses for mirrorless have much quieter motors than many of the older DSLR lines. So less noise in general getting into your video.

---------- Post added 12-21-2020 at 03:53 PM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by surfar Quote
I'm intending to use the R5 for both but not in fast mode!

---------- Post added 12-22-20 at 08:47 AM ----------



Sony had the mo$t to lo$e obviou$ly having 100% market share,whatever CaNik have sold is a bonus because both started at 0% of the market.

Sony changed FF,they forced the 2 FF market leaders to follow their lead.

Canon bought top end glass to the genre,Nikon was content to put out good glass(or silly with the Noct).

Canon caught up to the Sony AF levels,Nikon wins the Bronze.

Nikon are cutting cost$ by stopping manufacturing in Japan.Probably will become the trend.
I think Nikons in the race with the latest firmware updates for AF or in the 2 models. I bought a Z5 and I can't complain at all for autofocus. It's better than my D-750 and lightyears beyond my Pentax K-3.

Nikons S line seems to be going for a balance of cost/performance. Plus they're all weather sealed. Canon you have to buy L glass for that and it's $$$$. Also the S line is super sharp so far from the few I have. I can't complain there.

Sony's going to suffer in the coming years as all the Canon and Nikon users start to transition into the new mirrorless lines. I know the Z6ii has been sold out all month because I initially went for that. Then bought the Z5 as it's 1199 and I can live with 4.5fps for that price. The RP is no competition for the Z5. The R6 is nice but it's 500 dollars more than the Z6ii. Money's no object the Canon's with L glass are a nice setup, but expensive.
12-21-2020, 03:28 PM   #33
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QuoteOriginally posted by LeeRunge Quote
The RP is no competition for the Z5.
Not in my mind but YM does differ due to you owning F mount glass.

I own EF and it;ll adapt to R bodies and Z bodies.Fuji Olympus Panasonic too
12-21-2020, 03:35 PM   #34
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QuoteOriginally posted by surfar Quote
Not in my mind but YM does differ due to you owning F mount glass.

I own EF and it;ll adapt to R bodies and Z bodies.Fuji Olympus Panasonic too
I'd bet that whatever RP 2 is will be pretty nice though. I priced out Canon (I've owned Canon in the past) and what really stopped me was the lack of weather sealing outside L glass. The R6/5 are pretty sweet camera's. Hopefully they add IBIS to the RP in the next version.

And it would be amazing if we see adapter's back and forth across brands that work with autofocus. I know the Z mount can fit anything. And the RF mount should be big enough to adapt F glass I though think. Nikon went last and went biggest on the mount which enables that potential, whether it happens or not we'll see.

I like how the Canons protect the sensor for lens changes as well from dust. That's a good feature.

12-21-2020, 03:37 PM   #35
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I've got one RF lens, 24-105 F4 L that came with my R6. I've taken a few shots with it and it seems to be an improvement over the EF 24-70 F4 L that I had but I don't really shoot those short focal lengths much so I really can't give a great comparison of the two.

I will probably trade my EF 100-400 F5.6 IS II in on the RF 100-500 in the spring just to get the extra reach and native mount, but who knows.

I would love to get the 28-70 F2 but it's hard to justify the price for something I won't use much. Would rather save the money for maybe a RF 200-400 with built in 1.4TC if they release one.
12-21-2020, 03:48 PM   #36
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QuoteOriginally posted by KiloHotelphoto Quote
I've got one RF lens, 24-105 F4 L that came with my R6. I've taken a few shots with it and it seems to be an improvement over the EF 24-70 F4 L that I had but I don't really shoot those short focal lengths much so I really can't give a great comparison of the two.

I will probably trade my EF 100-400 F5.6 IS II in on the RF 100-500 in the spring just to get the extra reach and native mount, but who knows.

I would love to get the 28-70 F2 but it's hard to justify the price for something I won't use much. Would rather save the money for maybe a RF 200-400 with built in 1.4TC if they release one.
I'm sure it's the same for RF as Z. No rush to upgrade with the adapters. I bought the 24-200 (I really like the 24-240 Canon, but no weather sealing! They would have sold an R6 had that been the case). I also bought the 35 and 85 S lenses with the Z5. So far they're all excellent, the primes are really sharp. The 24-200 is the sharpest of that type of lens I've owned. But I doubt I'll move fast to replace F mount glass as the adapter works fine and so do all those lenses. Plus I still have the D-750 which is attached to the 150-600 in my larger bag. I mainly bought the Z5 and 24-200 as a light option with enough range to just carry that around without any bag. I've been using my Iphone 12 with proraw in the wider angles and it's not bad. So unless I plan on using a tripod for ultra-wide shots I think I'll just use the iPhone and I've got a pretty good run around kit that isn't a pain to bring along, plus it's all sealed up. I just used the Z5 and that lens in light rain/drizzle yesterday and it seems to be sealed as well as a Pentax.
12-25-2020, 12:29 PM   #37
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QuoteOriginally posted by lesmore49 Quote
Also was it a good idea in terms of Canon and Nikon to focus efforts ....R + D, Engineering, marketing, etc...on mirrorless cameras ?

Has it proven to be a good idea in terms of making money, or would Canon and Nikon been wiser to just continue with their DSLR lines and not of gone into mirrorless ?
Canon and Nikon decision to go mirrorless was dictated by a shrinking ILC market (where the shrinking was mainly due to the huge decline of DSLR sales) when the only growing part of the market was the MILC one. It was a necessary choice, with no real alternative (going MILC and keeping the DSLR lines would have been suicidal in a declining market, doubling R&D and production costs).
I don't know the figures but I doubt that they have made money in 2020, a bad year for the economy worldwide cannot be a good one for an industry which was already shrinking I guess. Crisis tend to accelerate changes, so I guess that at the end of the covid19 tunnel MILC's will be the winners (a pyrrhic victory I guess).
12-31-2020, 04:43 AM   #38
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A poll on Canon forum reveals that less than 25% (last time I checked) of the ones who voted would like to see a successor of 5D Mark IV, most of them out of curiosity, because R5 simply crushes 5D Mark IV on every single aspect. As a former Canon 5D Mark IV shooter, spending an hour with R5 for the first time was a very nice experience. It also seems that people are more interested when an R5 successor will be released (given that Sony until now updated their cameras after 2 years from release) so that the prices of R5 can drop enough to become affordable for the ones with a budget around 2200$-2400$.

Once the Canon sport flagship full frame and APS-C cameras will be released, I think that DSLRs for Canon will become history. The Canon mirrorless APS-C that will replace the 90D and 7D Mark II seems to be already in the hands of some fortunate photographers for tests, so 2021 might be the year that will "kill" the DSLR line of cameras and lenses for Canon.

As much as I loved all my DSLRs, with mirrorless I get the job done much faster and with much keeper rates (wildlife, events and people lifestyle being the things I shoot). Therefore, I think that Canon made the right choice (thanks to Sony and it's users who bought Sony cameras in the last 5 years) by moving to mirrorless and it seems to lead the way in terms of stabilization up to 7-8 stops, in the eye af for animals department which seems better than the one from Sony A9 II and in lenses also. Not to mention that R5 cought up in dynamic range with Nikon, Pentax and Sony if we take into consideration DXO who rated R5 to 14.6Evs.


Last edited by Dan Rentea; 12-31-2020 at 05:32 AM.
12-31-2020, 06:25 AM   #39
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In addition to the points made by various people here, digital convergence means that Canon and Nikon pretty well had to move on from the traditional DSLR. The majority of aspiring young image-makers today are going to spend as much and probably far more time shooting videos over their career as they are making stills, and DSRs simply aren't the best for video. One could argue that current MILCs mostly aren't video beasts either and are only borderline serious kit at the commercial end - for example only a couple are on Netflix's current approved camera list - but they are a stage on the road to something else. While almost any quality DSLR of recent years can make a beautiful still image, market demands have simply moved on.
12-31-2020, 08:13 AM   #40
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QuoteOriginally posted by mecrox Quote
for example only a couple are on Netflix's current approved camera list
Interesting fact is that out of the endless parade of high to super high price mirrorless bodies (nicknamed "hybrid cameras") Netflix only deems the Panasonic S1H a professional tool for movie level videography.

No Sony. No Canon. No Nikon. Toys.

This is not the low end photo/video business for uncle Joe, the "pro" wedding shooter, obviously.
12-31-2020, 08:25 AM   #41
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QuoteOriginally posted by beholder3 Quote
No Sony. No Canon. No Nikon. Toys.
Sony and Canon have their cinema cameras that do the odd NetFliker,those so-called toys are nice to play with!
12-31-2020, 08:38 AM - 1 Like   #42
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QuoteOriginally posted by beholder3 Quote
Interesting fact is that out of the endless parade of high to super high price mirrorless bodies (nicknamed "hybrid cameras") Netflix only deems the Panasonic S1H a professional tool for movie level videography.

No Sony. No Canon. No Nikon. Toys.

This is not the low end photo/video business for uncle Joe, the "pro" wedding shooter, obviously.
Black swan, The avengers II, Iron Man III were filmed also with 7D Mark II, 5D Mark II, 5D Mark III. If those were good for Oscar movies, the new mirrorless cameras can deal with some filming as B cameras. A Hollywood film was shot etirely with a Sony A7s II. Canon just launched R5 and R6, Sony just launched Sony A7s III so they need some time to become addopted by filmmakers. Nikon wasn't and probably isnn't going to be used for pro filming not because Z6 or Z7 aren't good, but mostly because Nikon doesn't have a cinema line like Sony, Panasonic or Canon to be used as main cameras.
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