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02-03-2021, 11:13 AM - 1 Like   #31
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I don't have any issue with people moving to other brands. Canon, whether with their DSLR gear or their newer mirrorless offerings, provides equipment that works very well in event photographer and has been the choice of professionals for decades now. If you're primarily doing event photography, it might make sense to move from Pentax to Canon. Perhaps if I somehow (per implausble) got drawn event photography, I would have to make the switch as well. But if so I would select a DSLR system, not one of these new mirrorless systems --- and not just because of a preference for optical viewfinders, but because I would know what to expect from those systems. I believe the ultimate judge of any system is not the numerical specs of the technology, nor what the images it produces look like on a computer screen, but rather what kind of prints the gear in question can produce. What are the colors like, the gradations of tone, the rendering of detail, the sense of depth and projection in the image, etc. etc? I'm impressed with large prints I've seen from DSLR lenses such as the Canon 300/2.8 and the Canon 70-200/2.8. Images from the 24-105/4, however, are not so impressive. That lens, while sharp and contrasty with nice color rendering, nonetheless to my eye renders on the flat side, and I don't find that pleasing.


I have not had the opportunity to see any large prints from either the new Canon or Nikon mirrorless systems, so I'll remain in agnostic as to what these systems, despite all their impressive technology, can do.

02-03-2021, 11:39 AM   #32
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QuoteOriginally posted by Sidney Porter Quote
I am not following the sub argument if the op is a photographer or videographer and the importance of video in pentax. The youtube links appear to be a slide show of highschool sports stills.
If the person values high ISO performance, s/he would never have started this thread.
After my experience with my KP + 77-420 PLM {55-300mm PLM + 1.4X TC}, I really don't believe someone with modern Pentax experience would move to other equipment.
Yes, I do know about lighting in a small school gym.
Catching action shots is partly equipment and partly experience/skill; it partially depends on what his/her style is - having just the player in focus is different from using a 'more comfortable DOF'.

Her/his interest is irrelevant to Pentax in any case.

Last edited by reh321; 02-03-2021 at 11:51 AM.
02-03-2021, 12:05 PM - 1 Like   #33
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QuoteOriginally posted by normhead Quote
Seriously

"The slow 4 FPS (and even 7 fps) really made it difficult to anticipate what exact moment you were going to capture the shot, and the extreme shallow buffer made shooting RAW practically impossible (the K-3 was a little different). The only real way to control things was to switch to single-point, which due to shooting at 2.8 (only while in-doors) made cropping blurry when AF was not quite where you wanted it. I don't do a lot of it at events, but sometimes its nice to innersperce video clips into highlights. Pentax is easily the most clunky."

Why do we need someone telling us the K-1 Pentax isn't an action camera? Duh
Since it's in the Non-Pentax camera section, why is he talking about Pentax at all?
Is the non-Pentax section the place to go to trash Pentax behind our backs?
Actually I f found this part helpful. It clearly lays out what his limitations were shooting the Pentax gear. Which helps clarify that none of his problems are mine. It also clearly shows that the new k3iii might have removed these issues but this user has an itch to scratch and couldnít hold out any longer. I canít conceive of a less effective way to market than to come to a forum like this and tell this story.

I see eye to eye with you often, but the tone of this thread and the details make me feel like it is paranoid to suspect Iíll intention. Additionally I donít think we are the market force that Canon would spend money on.
02-03-2021, 12:13 PM - 1 Like   #34
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QuoteOriginally posted by reh321 Quote
If the person values high ISO performance, s/he would never have started this thread.
After my experience with my KP + 77-420 PLM {55-300mm PLM + 1.4X TC}, I really don't believe someone with modern Pentax experience would move to other equipment.
Yes, I do know about lighting in a small school gym.
Catching action shots is partly equipment and partly experience/skill; it partially depends on what his/her style is - having just the player in focus is different from using a 'more comfortable DOF'.

Her/his interest is irrelevant to Pentax in any case.
Come on... you can't be for real. Low light performance is one reason why people shoot with K1 instead of KP or any other crop camera.

02-03-2021, 01:08 PM   #35
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QuoteOriginally posted by Dan Rentea Quote
Come on... you can't be for real. Low light performance is one reason why people shoot with K1 instead of KP or any other crop camera.
I see no advantage in noise between the K-P and K-1 and the new K-3iii should blow them both away. Go to Imaging Resources and check the images. See for yourself. The advantage to the K-1 is slightly higher DR, something Canon shooters profess not to care about, and more resolution.

Where do these ideas about Pentax come from?
02-03-2021, 01:28 PM - 1 Like   #36
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QuoteOriginally posted by normhead Quote
I see no advantage in noise between the K-P and K-1 and the new K-3iii should blow them both away. Go to Imaging Resources and check the images. See for yourself.
Yeah, right. If that's the case, no one would shoot full frame at sports events. I guess they don't look at studio images when they buy cameras. Shame on them!

QuoteOriginally posted by normhead Quote
The advantage to the K-1 is slightly higher DR, something Canon shooters profess not to care about, and more resolution.

Where do these ideas about Pentax come from?
It seems that you are a little behind in terms of news because R5 has 14.6Ev in terms of dynamic range, same as K1 and with more resolution and R6 has 14.3Ev, but lower resolution because it is optimised for higher ISO capability than K1. So, the dynamic range advantage you talk about it's just for older Canon cameras, not for the mirrorless new ones.
02-03-2021, 01:31 PM   #37
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QuoteOriginally posted by UncleVanya Quote
It clearly lays out what his limitations were shooting the Pentax gear.
Regrettably, from this thread, it's difficult to know the OP's skill and whether the problems were due to the camera/lens or the user's level of proficiency.

A couple of statements in the member's post are confusing to me, for example: "The only real way to control things was to switch to single-point, which due to shooting at 2.8 (only while in-doors) made cropping blurry when AF was not quite where you wanted it." I can understand general out-of-focus blurriness, but it seems that the OP might be confounding the single-point focus mode and aperture/depth of field. Or, it might be a question of misfocusing with the focus-and-recompose technique. I'm probably misunderstanding the issue here.

I don't mean to offend the OP nor pile on with criticism -- the new camera sounds like a good fit with their interests. However, in this type of post in which a user adopts another brand for specified reasons, it's often not clear what caused the problems or whether the new system solved them. It might not be a 'Pentax' problem after all. I just don't know.

QuoteOriginally posted by UncleVanya Quote
this user has an itch to scratch and couldn’t hold out any longer.
Possibly.

In general, credible comparisons of systems under typical shooting conditions would help to underscore their advantages and disadvantages. Gushing about features and specs is fine -- and it's okay to be excited about new gear for no particular reason -- but the real measure is in the actual user experience and the final outcomes.

- Craig

Last edited by c.a.m; 02-03-2021 at 04:44 PM. Reason: clarification
02-03-2021, 01:37 PM   #38
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QuoteOriginally posted by Dan Rentea Quote
Yeah, right. If that's the case, no one would shoot full frame at sports events. I guess they don't look at studio images when they buy cameras. Shame on them!
Did you even do a comparison? Or did you just repeat the mantra after drinking the cool aid?

02-03-2021, 02:02 PM   #39
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QuoteOriginally posted by normhead Quote
Did you even do a comparison? Or did you just repeat the mantra after drinking the cool aid?
Normhead, I work with files taken in real conditions. I don't buy cameras based on lab tests which have nothing to do with the challenges found on locations (quality of light, color/colors of the background, etc.). I've shot with too many cameras to know that there is between 1 and 2 stops advantage in terms of ISO performance between crop cameras and full frames, regardless of the brand. From users who posted reviews here and from the official review done for this forum (by the admin I guess), it seems that the advantage of K1 is about 1 stop compared to KP.

So, I can understand why someone went from APS-C to full frame, especially when we talk about indoor sport or action in general.

You can see here how A9 II and 1Dx III track a player. R6 has this tracking capabilities which with high ISO capabilities and fast fps makes a very solid camera for action ( https://youtu.be/VaYQ5yphhsE ).

Last edited by Dan Rentea; 02-03-2021 at 02:09 PM.
02-03-2021, 02:06 PM - 4 Likes   #40
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Wow, look at that. I think this Person has all the right to choose his gear how ever. And come to this section to talk about it.

This hardly is the last time. And obviously Canon did check the boxes OP has been feeling the lack of. And R6 happens to be latest also. So why not.

I’m absolutely sure that video and AF will be head above what Pentax new aps-c is capable. And this is also ff if that is what matters. It will remain to be seen what are the actual result. When things settle down a bit .

Good luck, and happy shooting!
02-03-2021, 02:25 PM   #41
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QuoteOriginally posted by Dan Rentea Quote
Come on... you can't be for real. Low light performance is one reason why people shoot with K1 instead of KP or any other crop camera.
I am very real - and so is the real-life performance of the KP - which gives a better view of the action as well as excellent low-light performance.

What you "know" may not matter - it is not significant when you consider other aspects of the cameras,


Last edited by reh321; 02-03-2021 at 02:45 PM.
02-03-2021, 02:50 PM - 1 Like   #42
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QuoteOriginally posted by reh321 Quote
I am very real - and so is the real performance of the KP, which gives a better view of the action.

What you "know" may not matter - it is not significant when you consider other aspects of the cameras,
What there is to know? Again, the ones who have both K1 and KP say that K1 has a better dynamic range and better ISO. It's user experience. The admin found the same in his review posted in this forum.

Now, the OP wanted better af performance, better ISO performance and better video capabilities. He found a camera suited for what he wants. He could have waited for K-3 Mark III, but he realized that 3 out of 3 features are covered better by a full frame which already proven what it's capable of, while for K-3 Mark III he will have to wait another 3 months until the camera would be released and tested properly. Again, I have no doubt that K-3 Mark III will be based on specs by far the best Pentax camera in terms of tracking, but the ones expecting D500 or R6 af tracking performance will be a little dissapointed, at least the ones who don't have experience when comes to tracking and what makes an af system capable. There are hints in this regard for both categories.

So, the OP said which were his problems without bashing the brand, everybody knows Pentax is lagging in video and af tracking because Ricoh offer field cameras, not sport cameras, but somehow he is the one to blame for something everybody agree with. Not to mention that he said he will also keep K1 for everything that doesn't imply video or sport.

Again, even if K-3 Mark III will be on par with R6 in terms of tracking and high ISO, it still doesn't cover the video part because not even Sony can match Canon in video af and overall video performance. So, why so much hate and conspiracy?!

Last edited by Dan Rentea; 02-03-2021 at 03:19 PM.
02-03-2021, 02:59 PM - 1 Like   #43
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QuoteOriginally posted by Dan Rentea Quote
So, why so much hate and conspiracy?!
No hate, no conspiracy - and I certainly haven't mentioned politics, where you would hear such things in my country.
02-03-2021, 03:06 PM   #44
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QuoteOriginally posted by reh321 Quote
No hate, no conspiracy - and I certainly haven't mentioned politics, where you would hear such things in our country.
Not you, in general. But there were comments regarding the coincidence between the launch of K-3 Mark III and his decision to buy another camera... Remember, he used the camera he bought before buying it so he shared the reason for why he bought R6 for action and why he also kept K1. User experience for which he was questioned for his photographic skills... He even posted some videos with sport images taken with Pentax gear... Again, not from you was the doubt of skills.

Last edited by Dan Rentea; 02-03-2021 at 03:21 PM.
02-03-2021, 03:31 PM - 4 Likes   #45
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QuoteOriginally posted by Dan Rentea Quote
Not you, in general. But there were comments regarding the coincidence between the launch of K-3 Mark III and his decision to buy another camera... Remember, he used the camera he bought before buying it so he shared the reason for why he bought R6 for action and why he also kept K1. User experience for which he was questioned for his photographic skills... He even posted some videos with sport images taken with Pentax gear... Again, not from you was the doubt of skills.
I wish people would just leave.

When I went from Pentax to Canon I didnít write a letter to the editor {pre-web days} explaining screw-drive lenses were too noisy - I just made the move.

Five years ago, when I came back to Pentax, I didnít post a comment about the reliability about Rebel processors - I just made the move.
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