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06-30-2021, 01:56 AM   #16
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QuoteOriginally posted by tokyoscape Quote
Nice looking design. I can see a lot of younger people might be interested in something like that.
Since I don't have an interest in Nikon, I have no interest in reading their spec sheet and just hope they make it easy to communicate with other handheld devices too.
well, just have a look at the spec and the first thing I see, "Z FC doesn't support in-body image stabilization"... OK! It is a nice looking retro camera design, and that's all.
How would they bring down the price ..? Nikon has a long history of trust in their VR lenses... Now they make a mirror-less without stabilisation. Idk.. It's a nice little camera for a trip..
Yes, the KP is superior , not only in specs but also in aesthetics.

06-30-2021, 08:57 AM   #17
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QuoteOriginally posted by filmamigo Quote
The Zfc is right in the sweet spot for me. I should love it. But I am totally perplexed.

* Why APS-C? Fuji owns the “classic analogue controls on an APS-C” market. I always said if Fuji made a full-frame XT, I would buy it just to shoot adapted Pentax lenses. Nikon could have owned the full-frame classic controls niche - but instead they join Fuji for a slice of *their* pie and ignore the obvious opportunity in the market.

* 20 megapixel? I get that Nikon recycled the innards of the Z50, but this is last-generation.

* Why all the love for the Zfc when the Pentax KP was ignored? The KP (which I now own) is a great retro-ish DSLR that’s basically the same size, offers a comparable experience, and actually beats the Zfc in a number of ways (lens selection, resolution, battery life, and for those who care, reflex viewing.)
- I think it's APS-C because Nikon hasn't landed on a good strategy for APS-C mirrorless and they want to see if this is a potential way forward.
- 20MP is kind of weird because it puts it in the same resolution field as M4/3, which has been being outgunned by 24/26MP sensors for a while now. But it is a very clean sensor, so what's the problem really?
- The KP is a DSLR (one), the KP is retro style but doesn't have direct controls (two), and, really, we haven't seen yet whether people will buy the Z fc. This is first-week buzz. The KP got decent buzz when it was announced too.
06-30-2021, 11:18 PM - 1 Like   #18
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I find this zfc toy camera very strange.

Who came up with the idea to invest into something that has to survive in Fujis homeland while being inferior in pretty any aspect?
If you want to attack the gorilla in the room as a smaller entrant then you have to outrun the competitor massively.

Who in drowning Nikon management thinks it is going to be commercially smart to sell a camera type which is sold for body cosmetics mainly and thus has users who do not want to change lenses or buy tons of them? The typical clientele will buy such a toy for a year and then dump it after a year or two to then buy the next fad item, regardless of brand or mount. They will certainly not buy your lenses (as if Nikon had any). And lenses is where companies can make money.

The good news for consumers is that within a year you can grab the kit bundle for under $500 as a present for your kids.
Maybe less.
07-01-2021, 02:42 AM - 2 Likes   #19
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I don't think there is anything confusing about it. The Z mount cameras have not sold as well as Nikon had hoped. The reasons for that have been litigated elsewhere, but Nikon is simply trying to hit a slightly different niche. The investment necessary to bring this camera to market is probably fairly small since it has basically the same internals as the Z50.

If it sells even moderately well, it is probably a win for Nikon.

(Its biggest negative is the fact that it is APS-C and Nikon has not released many APS-C lenses for their MILCs. Personally, I also find the modern two control wheel cameras easier to use as well, but probably there is a strong nostalgia factor for many).

07-01-2021, 05:45 AM   #20
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QuoteOriginally posted by Rondec Quote
The reasons for that have been litigated elsewhere, but Nikon is simply trying to hit a slightly different niche.
QuoteOriginally posted by Rondec Quote
If it sells even moderately well, it is probably a win for Nikon.
That's typically the kind of product development approach that I don't like. As a customer buying into an "opportunistic" camera might end-up like a frustrating experience if the system remains [incomplete] without the lens lineup required to go with it.

---------- Post added 01-07-21 at 14:49 ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by beholder3 Quote
Who came up with the idea to invest into something that has to survive in Fujis homeland while being inferior in pretty any aspect?
It's not only Nikon making such decisions (like for the Nikon 1). Pentax also suffered from releasing such odd products (see Pentax K-S1 with blinking LED, and Pentax K-01 without EVF). Canon also with the M series.


The big winners are camera companies that are able to develop a consistent lineup of cameras and lenses, that's where the most value is, at least for customers.
07-01-2021, 10:40 AM   #21
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Down to some of the button placements, it's a copy of the Fujfilm X-T20. No VR/IBIS, no WR (to be fair the X-T20 is not) and limited lens selection (unlike the full line from Fuji).

It is getting a lot of love, IMO due to looking like the FM1 and 2, and because everyone is shocked that there is a follow up to the Z50 (which is a good camera but crippled with limited WR and no IBIS).
07-01-2021, 05:40 PM   #22
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Beautiful camera. Pentax, give us a Retro K-02.

07-01-2021, 06:33 PM   #23
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QuoteOriginally posted by wed7 Quote
Beautiful camera. Pentax, give us a Retro K-02.
No , dont spend the few $$ they have for R&D.
07-01-2021, 08:52 PM   #24
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QuoteOriginally posted by bobmaxja Quote
No , dont spend the few $$ they have for R&D.
Sony and Fuji were distant nowhere when then they started NEX and XPRO1.
Lots of issues, and everyone laughed.
See where they are now in market position.

I think some R&D money must be there to dream. (and hopefully make money )
If not its the same stagnation we have seen now, just upping the megapix every other year.


Pentax has had something going a few times, but always failed to think beyond the initial product and let others eat their cake eventually.

GXR m-module - pure genius and well before the NEX, but they just dropped the ball after that
IBIS and its unique features like pixel shift - Now Sony has it and ppl even think they were the innovators who started it
Exposure composite - later Oly (and now I think Sony) has done better with real time review of the stacking (really useful for light trails shooting )
Theta - stagnated by refusing to also do better video and Gopro / Insta360 has taken the 360 video pie now.
07-01-2021, 09:29 PM   #25
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You’d be tempted to think that Nikon has given up trying to beat Canon in the FF mirrorless market, and are looking to compete in Fujifilm’s segment, if it wasn’t for the lack of Z-mount APS-C lenses.

The alternative is that they’re going to rely on the existing Z-mount FF35 lenses until they see how well their APS-C bodies sell. They have the 3rd-biggest range of APS-C lenses (after Fujifilm and Pentax) for their DSLR cameras, which could be adapted, of course. Canon doesn’t have a big range of DSLR APS-C lenses, which may be why Nikon decided to have a bigger shot at the mirrorless APS-C market.

I’ve been trying to work out why the publicity photos of the Zfc don’t make it look quite right as a film SLR lookalike. I can’t decide whether it’s that the fake prism housing is a bit too small, or that the fat pancake lens is too big. Maybe it’s a bit of both.
07-01-2021, 10:51 PM   #26
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Say what you will but at least it has a flippy and just for that I may buy for the hell of it. Me personally - I love the concept. I still cannot believe they actually did it.
07-01-2021, 11:48 PM - 3 Likes   #27
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QuoteOriginally posted by Fontan Quote
Say what you will but at least it has a flippy and just for that I may buy for the hell of it. Me personally - I love the concept. I still cannot believe they actually did it.
Buy a KP and you'll be well ahead of that thing, Fontan - WR, higher resolution, IBIS, more than three consumer lenses for it, and yes, it has your flippy screen.
07-02-2021, 06:21 AM - 1 Like   #28
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QuoteOriginally posted by Serkevan Quote
I had, in fact, typed a "wait for the "it's not bad when it's not Pentax doing it" comment" addendum but I removed because I wanted to keep the post mostly informative

---------- Post added 06-29-21 at 03:59 AM ----------



Yeah, I actually quite like the control scheme (and chrome just looks better - this is an objective fact ). It's just that I also know how much Nikon will neglect APS-C again... Methinks this is to test the waters and compare adoption to that of the Z50, then maybe release a similarly-looking Z Df with a FF sensor... after all the mount is so humongous that the camera wouldn't even have to be much bigger, maybe just a couple mm thicker because of the larger IBIS system.
Probably a fun camera to use the FTZ adapter and older glass. Nikon DX has always been kinda limited, but with all the adapters probably a lot of fun with older glass from most brands.

---------- Post added 07-02-2021 at 06:27 AM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by RobA_Oz Quote
You’d be tempted to think that Nikon has given up trying to beat Canon in the FF mirrorless market, and are looking to compete in Fujifilm’s segment, if it wasn’t for the lack of Z-mount APS-C lenses.

The alternative is that they’re going to rely on the existing Z-mount FF35 lenses until they see how well their APS-C bodies sell. They have the 3rd-biggest range of APS-C lenses (after Fujifilm and Pentax) for their DSLR cameras, which could be adapted, of course. Canon doesn’t have a big range of DSLR APS-C lenses, which may be why Nikon decided to have a bigger shot at the mirrorless APS-C market.

I’ve been trying to work out why the publicity photos of the Zfc don’t make it look quite right as a film SLR lookalike. I can’t decide whether it’s that the fake prism housing is a bit too small, or that the fat pancake lens is too big. Maybe it’s a bit of both.
Check out the adapters for Z mount, it’s huge so pretty much everything fits as a manual lens with some combo of adapters. So for vintage lens users it’s probably going to be a fun camera to use. Some of them like the megadap even allow for autofocus on manual lenses in M, EF, F, OM, MD, PK, M42 mounts.
07-02-2021, 10:36 AM   #29
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I'm not impressed. I wasn't impressed by the Df either.
I guess these retro cameras just aren't my thing... I don't think the interface works for a modern MILC, or DSLR for that matter. In this case, how's the combination of modes and old-style dials? What happens when you select 'P'? (aka the Professional mode ) What are you doing with those two dials, and the buttons, and the menus?
They have to combine at least two styles of interface. What for?
07-02-2021, 11:27 AM - 1 Like   #30
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I think analog shutter speed and ISO dials are the bee's knees. I would sell body parts for a Pentax body with that. Call me old school of you will, but a customizable dial is not the same as seeing your setting right there and not on a display.

However, the Nikon implementation is lacking. There is still a PASM switch. Yuk. Why couldn't they put A on those dials, like Fujifilm does? Because it is only a warmed up Z50 and the hardware/firmware/software changes would price it into full frame territory. It is already priced at a premium over the Z50.

Every time you change a lens, you will eyeball that sad lonely eetsy beetsy teeny weeny little crop sensor inside the giant Z mount that was engineered for one mad 58mm f/0.95 prime. You will feel inadequate and regret a lot of life decisions that meant you couldn't quite stretch to a Z5. Even if it does not have cool retro dials.

Thank you. Rant over. I feel better now.
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