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dylansalt · 01-10-2010, 11:46 PM

On the other hand though, I'm sure 99,9% users of Pentax were aware of it's "weak" autofocus when they purchased instead of Purchasing into Nikon or Canon's superior autofocus - so I wonder why all the angst over Pentax.

My son (22) has shot extensively with the C 450D & the N D90 and yet he likes my K10D better purely due to IQ which for him is the most critical factor.

We can't quite put our fingers on it but somehow Pentax gives a different feel/look - less digital looking and for some it's worth putting up with a slightly inferior af system - which incidentally for my type of photography (which includes way below EV 4) has "never" failed me.

BUT having said that comparing the K7 to the 7D = no contest with the K7 only winning hands down in it's size.

Wheatfield · 01-11-2010, 05:23 AM

Originally posted by PentaxPoke

Nice sequence. These pictures just show that Wheatfield's skills are not limited by Pentax's weaknesses.

You can't expect the average photographer to get the same results. It is said that Wheatfield doesn't "take" a photo, he demands it.

My skills definitely don't run to tracking fast action, it's something I have to work very hard at to get anything.
There isn't actually a sharp photo in the batch, though they look not bad at internet size. I missed on the first image, with the AF point behind the Rottie, but I'm pretty sure I had him after that.
And the AF wasn't keeping up.
This was under what would be ideal conditions. Bright sunny day, with the sun over my shoulder,

Quote:

On the other hand though, I'm sure 99,9% users of Pentax were aware of it's "weak" autofocus when they purchased instead of Purchasing into Nikon or Canon's superior autofocus - so I wonder why all the angst over Pentax.

When I bought Pentax, AF barely existed, so there wasn't much to be aware of in that regard. My angst is with their abject refusal to put something approaching high end AF into their high end camera.
Having said this, the AF speed of the K7 is good enough for me most of the time, but I do regularly run into situations where it falls on it's face.

dylansalt · 01-11-2010, 01:29 PM

Totally agree - it does seem very odd - when all the other makes have definitely moved on with the AF abilities

jensm · 01-13-2010, 07:22 AM

I am so close to selling my Pentax system with 7 AF lenses + some MF stuff and getting a 7D. I've always preached "spending it on the lenses", but after this weekend's attempt at tracking familiy sleigh rides with a k10D, I'm ripe.

joakimfors · 01-13-2010, 07:39 AM

Originally posted by jensm

I am so close to selling my Pentax system with 7 AF lenses + some MF stuff and getting a 7D. I've always preached "spending it on the lenses", but after this weekend's attempt at tracking familiy sleigh rides with a k10D, I'm ripe.

What lenses do you have? Perhaps I could buy them for my K-7 as it hasn't got any problems tracking people sledding.

PentaxPoke · 01-13-2010, 08:45 AM

Originally posted by jensm

I am so close to selling my Pentax system with 7 AF lenses + some MF stuff and getting a 7D. I've always preached "spending it on the lenses", but after this weekend's attempt at tracking familiy sleigh rides with a k10D, I'm ripe.

I hear ya pardner. (Just take a look at my sig line

) "Spend it on the lenses" is good advice, except when you get 5 bad copies of DA* lenses (combination of decentering and SDM failures)

The 7D AF is like nothing I have ever tried before. Plus ring-USM and "L" glass is pretty tempting.

heliphoto · 01-13-2010, 09:24 AM

Originally posted by jensm

I am so close to selling my Pentax system with 7 AF lenses + some MF stuff and getting a 7D. I've always preached "spending it on the lenses", but after this weekend's attempt at tracking familiy sleigh rides with a k10D, I'm ripe.

Like joakimfors said, the K-7 will do better, but I can confirm that even the 5DII will AF faster and better than the K-7 with significantly better tracking in continuous mode. If you're tempted, now's the time to look into it. With the recent price hikes, you can recover a lot of the money you have in Pentax glass. I made a spreadsheet to estimate how much money I could get by selling my Pentax system, and when all was said and done, I brought in more money than I had planned on

It allowed me to build a coherent Canon system based around the 5DII, plus a new tripod head and backpack.

I do miss a few aspects of the K-7 for sure, specifically the compact size (not a big deal to me), the feel and build quality, the wx. sealing (though I think the 7D might be closer to the K-7 than the 5DII is), and a few menu/usage things... however, the focusing, high ISO performance and the IQ more than make up the difference for me.

Wheatfield · 01-13-2010, 11:10 AM

Originally posted by joakimfors

What lenses do you have? Perhaps I could buy them for my K-7 as it hasn't got any problems tracking people sledding.

I'm always amused when someone posts a picture that isn't much of a trial for a system and they says the system works perfectly.
This is one of those instances.

palmor · 01-13-2010, 11:41 AM

If you use both there really isn't any comparison to the AF of the K20 and 7d. I never bought the K7 so I can't say but even it is 20% faster then the k20 it is still pretty far behind.

Anyway the Pentax AF thing has been beaten to death as we all know. If fast AF/Servo is that important to your photography needs then you might want to make the switch or run dual systems.

John

joakimfors · 01-13-2010, 11:45 AM

Originally posted by Wheatfield

I'm always amused when someone posts a picture that isn't much of a trial for a system and they says the system works perfectly.
This is one of those instances.

Not meant as a trial show off, just an underexposed sledding picture.

Though I admit focusing is quite slow with a DA 35 if you miss and end up at the short end of the focusing scale.

jensm · 01-13-2010, 01:32 PM

It's a really great shot, but it's not that difficult in terms of AF tracking, as the DOF is so deep.

/Jens

Originally posted by joakimfors

What lenses do you have? Perhaps I could buy them for my K-7 as it hasn't got any problems tracking people sledding.

jensm · 01-13-2010, 01:33 PM

I'm strongly considering the 7D. I may end up with dual systems, just for some Pentax MF glass.

/Jens

Originally posted by palmor

If you use both there really isn't any comparison to the AF of the K20 and 7d. I never bought the K7 so I can't say but even it is 20% faster then the k20 it is still pretty far behind.

Anyway the Pentax AF thing has been beaten to death as we all know. If fast AF/Servo is that important to your photography needs then you might want to make the switch or run dual systems.

John

Big G · 01-13-2010, 03:13 PM

A couple of things:

I saw the 7D video the other day, bloody marvelous AF-C and as I said in the "what's after the K-7" thread, I think the K-7 package is absolutely awesome bar the ropey AF system. Granted, it's probably quite decent, but it's not even close to 7D territory. If the K-7 mk2 or K-8 has seriously competitive AF-C, I'd buy one in a heartbeat. Until that time, I'm considering purchasing the EOS 7D as a sideline to my Pentax kit.

Now, is the slow AF that we're seeing in the above videos purely the camera body? Or are the lenses holding back the AF system? The reason I ask is that my K20D + Sigma 100-300mm f/4 seems to focus very nearly as quickly as the EOS 7D with the 70-200mm lens as follows:

I know it's not a scientific test by any means, but my Sigma lenses don't hunt around looking for a focus point like all the other comparison videos I've seen - and they don't hunt like my Pentax 17-70mm did.

So - how much of it is down to the lens?

asdf · 01-13-2010, 04:00 PM

Originally posted by Samsungian

AF tracking w/ Canon 7D video & stills

Enjoy:

7D #2 In the Cold of Winter

Canon 7D shoots at 8fps. The dog ran for around 5 seconds. That's 32 shots (according to what the guy wrote). He showed 3 usable ones at f/5-6.3. Lame. (Although a Pentax would probably spend those 5 seconds hunting. hehe.

)

Samsungian · 01-13-2010, 06:12 PM

Ole's Canon 7D Autofocus Part 3 is posted.

More pics and insights.

Canon 7D #3 Autofocus

and Canon's article about Ole's Kit

http://cpn.canon-europe.com/content/education/technical/whats_in_your_kitbag...gen_liodden.do

01-13-2010, 06:12 PM	#30
Samsungian Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Colorado USA Posts: 1,337 Original Poster	Ole's Canon 7D Autofocus Part 3 is posted Ole's Canon 7D Autofocus Part 3 is posted. More pics and insights. Canon 7D #3 Autofocus and Canon's article about Ole's Kit http://cpn.canon-europe.com/content/education/technical/whats_in_your_kitbag...gen_liodden.do

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01-10-2010, 11:46 PM	#16
dylansalt Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Durban, South Africa Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,052	On the other hand though, I'm sure 99,9% users of Pentax were aware of it's "weak" autofocus when they purchased instead of Purchasing into Nikon or Canon's superior autofocus - so I wonder why all the angst over Pentax. My son (22) has shot extensively with the C 450D & the N D90 and yet he likes my K10D better purely due to IQ which for him is the most critical factor. We can't quite put our fingers on it but somehow Pentax gives a different feel/look - less digital looking and for some it's worth putting up with a slightly inferior af system - which incidentally for my type of photography (which includes way below EV 4) has "never" failed me. BUT having said that comparing the K7 to the 7D = no contest with the K7 only winning hands down in it's size.

01-11-2010, 05:23 AM	#17
Wheatfield Moderator Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: The wheatfields of Canada Posts: 15,987	Originally posted by PentaxPoke Nice sequence. These pictures just show that Wheatfield's skills are not limited by Pentax's weaknesses. You can't expect the average photographer to get the same results. It is said that Wheatfield doesn't "take" a photo, he demands it. My skills definitely don't run to tracking fast action, it's something I have to work very hard at to get anything. There isn't actually a sharp photo in the batch, though they look not bad at internet size. I missed on the first image, with the AF point behind the Rottie, but I'm pretty sure I had him after that. And the AF wasn't keeping up. This was under what would be ideal conditions. Bright sunny day, with the sun over my shoulder, Quote: On the other hand though, I'm sure 99,9% users of Pentax were aware of it's "weak" autofocus when they purchased instead of Purchasing into Nikon or Canon's superior autofocus - so I wonder why all the angst over Pentax. When I bought Pentax, AF barely existed, so there wasn't much to be aware of in that regard. My angst is with their abject refusal to put something approaching high end AF into their high end camera. Having said this, the AF speed of the K7 is good enough for me most of the time, but I do regularly run into situations where it falls on it's face.

01-11-2010, 01:29 PM	#18
dylansalt Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Durban, South Africa Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,052	Totally agree - it does seem very odd - when all the other makes have definitely moved on with the AF abilities

01-13-2010, 07:22 AM	#19
jensm Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Denmark Posts: 146	I am so close to selling my Pentax system with 7 AF lenses + some MF stuff and getting a 7D. I've always preached "spending it on the lenses", but after this weekend's attempt at tracking familiy sleigh rides with a k10D, I'm ripe.

01-13-2010, 07:39 AM	#20
joakimfors Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Lund, Sweden Posts: 237	Originally posted by jensm I am so close to selling my Pentax system with 7 AF lenses + some MF stuff and getting a 7D. I've always preached "spending it on the lenses", but after this weekend's attempt at tracking familiy sleigh rides with a k10D, I'm ripe. What lenses do you have? Perhaps I could buy them for my K-7 as it hasn't got any problems tracking people sledding.

01-13-2010, 08:45 AM	#21
PentaxPoke Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Oklahoma Posts: 1,411	Originally posted by jensm I am so close to selling my Pentax system with 7 AF lenses + some MF stuff and getting a 7D. I've always preached "spending it on the lenses", but after this weekend's attempt at tracking familiy sleigh rides with a k10D, I'm ripe. I hear ya pardner. (Just take a look at my sig line ) "Spend it on the lenses" is good advice, except when you get 5 bad copies of DA* lenses (combination of decentering and SDM failures) The 7D AF is like nothing I have ever tried before. Plus ring-USM and "L" glass is pretty tempting.

01-13-2010, 09:24 AM	#22
heliphoto Veteran Member Join Date: May 2008 Location: Region 5 Photos: Gallery Posts: 2,539	Originally posted by jensm I am so close to selling my Pentax system with 7 AF lenses + some MF stuff and getting a 7D. I've always preached "spending it on the lenses", but after this weekend's attempt at tracking familiy sleigh rides with a k10D, I'm ripe. Like joakimfors said, the K-7 will do better, but I can confirm that even the 5DII will AF faster and better than the K-7 with significantly better tracking in continuous mode. If you're tempted, now's the time to look into it. With the recent price hikes, you can recover a lot of the money you have in Pentax glass. I made a spreadsheet to estimate how much money I could get by selling my Pentax system, and when all was said and done, I brought in more money than I had planned on It allowed me to build a coherent Canon system based around the 5DII, plus a new tripod head and backpack. I do miss a few aspects of the K-7 for sure, specifically the compact size (not a big deal to me), the feel and build quality, the wx. sealing (though I think the 7D might be closer to the K-7 than the 5DII is), and a few menu/usage things... however, the focusing, high ISO performance and the IQ more than make up the difference for me.

01-13-2010, 11:10 AM	#23
Wheatfield Moderator Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: The wheatfields of Canada Posts: 15,987	Originally posted by joakimfors What lenses do you have? Perhaps I could buy them for my K-7 as it hasn't got any problems tracking people sledding. I'm always amused when someone posts a picture that isn't much of a trial for a system and they says the system works perfectly. This is one of those instances.

01-13-2010, 11:41 AM	#24
palmor Veteran Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: North of Boston, MA Posts: 798	If you use both there really isn't any comparison to the AF of the K20 and 7d. I never bought the K7 so I can't say but even it is 20% faster then the k20 it is still pretty far behind. Anyway the Pentax AF thing has been beaten to death as we all know. If fast AF/Servo is that important to your photography needs then you might want to make the switch or run dual systems. John

01-13-2010, 11:45 AM	#25
joakimfors Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Lund, Sweden Posts: 237	Originally posted by Wheatfield I'm always amused when someone posts a picture that isn't much of a trial for a system and they says the system works perfectly. This is one of those instances. Not meant as a trial show off, just an underexposed sledding picture. Though I admit focusing is quite slow with a DA 35 if you miss and end up at the short end of the focusing scale.

01-13-2010, 01:32 PM	#26
jensm Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Denmark Posts: 146	It's a really great shot, but it's not that difficult in terms of AF tracking, as the DOF is so deep. /Jens Originally posted by joakimfors What lenses do you have? Perhaps I could buy them for my K-7 as it hasn't got any problems tracking people sledding.

01-13-2010, 01:33 PM	#27
jensm Senior Member Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Denmark Posts: 146	I'm strongly considering the 7D. I may end up with dual systems, just for some Pentax MF glass. /Jens Originally posted by palmor If you use both there really isn't any comparison to the AF of the K20 and 7d. I never bought the K7 so I can't say but even it is 20% faster then the k20 it is still pretty far behind. Anyway the Pentax AF thing has been beaten to death as we all know. If fast AF/Servo is that important to your photography needs then you might want to make the switch or run dual systems. John

01-13-2010, 03:13 PM	#28
Big G Veteran Member Join Date: May 2009 Posts: 581	A couple of things: I saw the 7D video the other day, bloody marvelous AF-C and as I said in the "what's after the K-7" thread, I think the K-7 package is absolutely awesome bar the ropey AF system. Granted, it's probably quite decent, but it's not even close to 7D territory. If the K-7 mk2 or K-8 has seriously competitive AF-C, I'd buy one in a heartbeat. Until that time, I'm considering purchasing the EOS 7D as a sideline to my Pentax kit. Now, is the slow AF that we're seeing in the above videos purely the camera body? Or are the lenses holding back the AF system? The reason I ask is that my K20D + Sigma 100-300mm f/4 seems to focus very nearly as quickly as the EOS 7D with the 70-200mm lens as follows: I know it's not a scientific test by any means, but my Sigma lenses don't hunt around looking for a focus point like all the other comparison videos I've seen - and they don't hunt like my Pentax 17-70mm did. So - how much of it is down to the lens?

01-13-2010, 04:00 PM	#29
asdf Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Canada Posts: 1,252	Originally posted by Samsungian AF tracking w/ Canon 7D video & stills Enjoy: 7D #2 In the Cold of Winter Canon 7D shoots at 8fps. The dog ran for around 5 seconds. That's 32 shots (according to what the guy wrote). He showed 3 usable ones at f/5-6.3. Lame. (Although a Pentax would probably spend those 5 seconds hunting. hehe. )