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12-01-2019, 09:05 AM   #1
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Trying out film, questions need answered and suggestions being sought

I decided to try out film so I got a Pentax Z-1 / PZ-1 on its way

Pentax Z-1 / PZ-1 - Pentax Autofocus Film SLRs - Pentax Camera Reviews and Specifications

_________

I plan on using these lenses:

Kino Precision Japan Kiron 28mm F2 MC P/KA

SMC Pentax-FA 43mm F1.9 Limited

SMC Pentax-A 50mm F1.4

SMC Pentax 55mm F 1.8

SMC Pentax-FA 77mm F1.8 Limited

SMC Pentax-D FA 100mm F2.8 Macro

SMC Pentax-A 135mm F2.8

____________

should I shoot print or slide

______________________

I will want to digitalize the good ones

what is the best way of doing that ?

______________________________

my local brick and mortar store offers these services

35mm Developing & Printing
C-41 FILM PROCESSING
12 exposure process & print
$19.99
24 exposure process & print
$19.99
36 exposure process & print
$19.99
Film developed and CD only (no prints)
$17.99
(you will get your negatives back)

Additional 4x6 print sets at time of processing
$ .49 each
Panoramic prints at time of processing
$1.99 each
Additional panoramic prints at time of processing
$1.49 each
Photos on CD at time of developing and printing
$7.99

Prints are available in Matte or Glossy finish.

Photos on CD

Photos on CD-ROM at time of processing (up to 40 exp.)
$6.99


do those look ok ?

12-01-2019, 09:40 AM   #2
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Print film is more forgiving of exposure setting mistakes (your's or the camera's). Until you absolutely know that the camera (and you) are setting the right exposure, use print film.

Getting a CD back might be OK for digitization or not... It depends on the quality and resolution of their scanner. You can digitize stuff yourself with your K-3, macro lens, and an add-on holder or rigged way to photograph the negatives.

P.S. The "best way" to digitize slides or negatives is to get a K-1 and use pixel shift!
12-01-2019, 11:25 AM   #3
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Color negitive film is the best to start out with as you learn you camera as photoptimist is correct in that it is more forgiving than slide film. When it comes to digitizing the service offered by shops varies and is very dependent on the equipment they have. Some flat bed scanners are pretty good, a good dedicated film scanner works wonders but are spendy. Using a digital camera has become a very popular method and a K-1 with pixel shift would produce some nice results. With your K-3 you could fake it by using the composition editor ability and doing super resolution in post processing.

I suggest starting out with cheaper film for the first couple rolls as you get your camera sorted out and learn it. A handheld light meter would also be a good addition to get some idea if things are at least in the ball park.
12-01-2019, 11:32 AM   #4
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My personal preference would be to shoot slides -- there is nothing more beautiful than a well-exposed slide on a light box. Also, in the heyday of film editors would only accept submission of slides and not print film so this probably accounts for some of my bias towards slide film. I always found slide film tended to be a little sharper than print film, although I've heard others claim the opposite. If you do decide to shoot slides bracket your exposures until you are confident in your exposure settings. [The old saying was it's far cheaper to bracket and get the shot than pay for a trip back to redo the shot.]

If you are entrirely new to the film world then I would begin by shooting print film -- photoptimist is right in pointing out that print film is more forgiving of exposure mistakes. It also, generally speaking, has a somewhat greater dynamic range than slide film. With a contact sheet you can easily figure out which shots you want to have a print made out of.

12-01-2019, 11:40 AM   #5
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If you know how to properly expose DSLR then it will translate to slide film except you won't have immediate feedback and histogram so you will have to be sure the meter is good. Shooting slide shows you direct results without the interpretation required by color negatives. If your local brick and mortar doesn't seem to have E6/slide processing, it won't be as convenient.

If you like b&w film, this is as good a time as any to get into it. It has equal or greater latitude as color negatives and inversion to a positive is far simpler then color negatives. Developing is really simple, relatively inexpensive and can have the quickest turnaround.
12-01-2019, 11:48 AM   #6
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I never shot slides so can’t help you on that one. What I can say though is that normally the CD you get from regular shops is not good enough. It’s usually a relatively low resolution file. Getting something more “professional” is usually more expensive and offered as a separate service. My suggestion is to get either the CD only or a contact sheet only, mainly for you to decide which you want to keep. Then take your negatives to a place that can offer proper negative scan at high resolution using a negative scanner. I never tried such services myself. I’m in the process of setting up me K1 “scanner”.
12-01-2019, 12:55 PM   #7
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Slide is lovely but I wouldn't begin with.

Buy some Ektar 100 (based on your Flickr, I think you'd enjoy it) to start off with, and perhaps some classic looking B&W like Ilford HP5 Plus.

Don't worry about digitizing at the onset. Let the lab do it. You can cross that bridge later if you like.
But, "the brick-and-mortar store" you mention.... is that an actual photo lab??? or are those services offered by a Walgreens or CVS type store. In my opinion they used to be fine for the most part, but nowadays (the few remaining that still offer developing) they see so little volume these days that often those running the machines are rather inexperienced, and the digitization services leave something to be desired.

Popular online mail-order labs that do good work:

theDarkroom.com
northcoastphoto.com
dwaynesphoto.com (they're in Kansas if that matters to you)

If yours is an actual lab, I'd use that one. They need the business. But another thing to note is that many drugstore type places that do offer developing these days usually ship your film to another location for processing so it usually takes just as long as using a mail-order lab on your own.

12-01-2019, 01:11 PM   #8
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QuoteOriginally posted by chickentender Quote
Slide is lovely but I wouldn't begin with.
Years ago, my daughter asked me what film she should take on her vacation to the islands and I just packed her some films - Velvia and some color negatives. She just knew enough to load the film into her Canon Rebel. She came back, had them processed and when she went to pick them up she was surprised to see "little pictures". No reason to be afraid of using slides.
12-01-2019, 01:14 PM   #9
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Allen,

When I shot film, I started with print film, but migrated to slide film because I liked the results better. That being said, if you follow the same path to slide film, once you've calibrated the camera's exposure meter to your liking, I would recommend underexposing your slide film by about 1/3 to 1/2 a stop. That will lead to higher color saturation and less chance of blowing out the highlights. As I'm sure you know, you can usually recover some detail from the shadows, but once you've blown out the highlights, there isn't much you can do to recover them.

As for digitizing them myself, I consistently get better results from slides. I use an Epson V600 scanner, which includes attachments for scanning 4 slides or negatives at once. It's not the best scanner out there, but it's also reasonably priced. I found the cost to have them professionally scanned exorbitant and not worth the expense, considering the quality of my original images!


Hope this helps.
12-01-2019, 01:39 PM   #10
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QuoteOriginally posted by LesDMess Quote
Years ago, my daughter asked me what film she should take on her vacation to the islands and I just packed her some films - Velvia and some color negatives. She just knew enough to load the film into her Canon Rebel. She came back, had them processed and when she went to pick them up she was surprised to see "little pictures". No reason to be afraid of using slides.
Yes... You're not wrong. There's no reason to be afraid of slides, but there is reason not to load it right out of the gate with a new shooter operating an unfamiliar and not-quite-tested camera.

With a working PZ-1 chances are more more than likely all would be fine, but that's my customary response above. B&W and color-neg are good starting points, much cheaper per-shot, and much more forgiving of exp error. I prefer transparencies personally and always have... but I won't recommend to load new-to-you cameras with it. There's every chance that if exposure isn't quite right on that camera, for whatever reason, the latitude of negative film could mean the difference between an acceptable image or not (I mean that's the entire basis of disposable cameras ).

---------- Post added 12-01-19 at 12:42 PM ----------

(Though of course there's also an argument to be made that slide film behaves MORE like digital and would point out problems in a more familiar and drastic way immediately. But I'd still opt for at least "warming up" with negatives first. )
12-01-2019, 01:43 PM   #11
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Slide film is good for the range it provides and the color you saw is about what you get (negative film colors can be influenced when converted to a positive image, and there is no reference to the original in an orange-masked negative image). Over-exposure is a no-no with slide film because you lose highlights easily and once they're gone, there's no coming back. Negative film has the same issue on the shadow end of its range so if you underexpose negative film, some shadows sink into nothingness, but it is more forgiving in general (with wider "latitude" than slide film). With the camera you mentioned, slide film shouldn't be a problem. I've shot plenty of it with a PZ-1p and the exposure system in that camera rarely let me down but if you have highlights of particular interest, you might want to drop in some exposure compensation (which the PZ-1p allows without effort).

I send all my film to a pro lab for processing so I can't address that portion of your question too well. As with anything, some are better than others and I would solicit recommendations for good ones.

I scan using a Nikon Coolscan at 4000 dpi (which isn't available anymore but can be had on the used market). It has one feature which beats the K-1 and pixel shift and that's the built in dust elimination. This is done with a separate infrared channel which detects dust (color dyes are transparent to IR) and software which fill in those defects. It saves a lot of time by eliminating retouching and with very little (if any) image degradation. The downside is it takes a lot more time than the K-1 approach. As mentioned, lab film scanning can be good or otherwise depending on who you choose to do it for you.

Anyway, that's just my two cents. Good luck with your film ventures.
12-01-2019, 01:43 PM - 3 Likes   #12
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QuoteOriginally posted by photoptimist Quote
P.S. The "best way" to digitize slides or negatives is to get a K-1 and use pixel shift!
Over 40,0000 scans later, my Coolscan and I disagree with you . . .
12-01-2019, 02:01 PM - 1 Like   #13
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QuoteOriginally posted by aslyfox Quote
I decided to try out film

should I shoot print or slide

I will want to digitalize the good ones

what is the best way of doing that ?

my local brick and mortar store offers services

do those look ok ?
I would shoot 100 ISO slide film, bracket and record a range of shutter speeds just to see how accurate the shutter is. Low ISO slides have the least exposure latitude and will show you any anomalies with the new camera.

But once you have confidence of the camera's light meter and shutter speed performance, I'd switch to a neg film for better scanning and less expense. Hard to beat Ektar 100 for quality and scanning. Most 400 ISO films, however, are much more practical, and Ilford XP2+ is great for B&W scans with an EI from 100-1600....very forgiving.

I shoot negs then only have the lab scan it. I use a film scanner for the best shots.

The only down side of saving money and not printing everything is....those prints often outlive all else. I still have shoeboxes of prints from 40 years ago, but don't ask me where most of my digital files are from 15 years ago.
12-01-2019, 02:10 PM - 1 Like   #14
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I really don't think we need to delve into scanning method anecdotes here for Allen (though I have plenty myself, bought with blood/sweat/tears).
Let the lab take care of that for now. Film scanning is a deep and dark rabbit hole.

---------- Post added 12-01-19 at 01:14 PM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by LesDMess Quote
...she was surprised to see "little pictures". No reason to be afraid of using slides.
All the above caution aside.... that's still a huge a part of the reasons I shoot transparency with my 67 and MF in general. There isn't anything quite as wonderful as the film "reveal" of slide-film on a light table or window. I'm still a little girl when that happens.

Last edited by Eyewanders; 12-01-2019 at 02:16 PM.
12-01-2019, 02:21 PM   #15
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QuoteOriginally posted by aslyfox Quote
should I shoot print or slide
For all the reasons mentioned above, C41 print film. If not shooting color, any standard (non-C41) B&W negative film.

QuoteOriginally posted by aslyfox Quote
I will want to digitalize the good ones

what is the best way of doing that ?
The best way is to do it yourself using either a dedicated film scanner or using a dSLR as a negative/slide copier. The other alternative is to admit there is no other alternative providing reasonable quality with a price point acceptable to the average hobbiest.* Machine scans such as offered by your B&M are OK for proofs, but often (more often than not?) suck for most other uses. Issues include poor exposure, excess sharpening, poor contrast control, and strange colors. I might add that shops that offer other than hand scans from B&W negatives = zero.


Steve

* The other options are a hand scan by the lab (usually done on a flatbed scanner) ($$$) or a Flextight/drum scan for much higher quality ($$$$)
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