Pentax LX, MZ-S versus Nikon’s of that era

johnha · 04-20-2021, 02:57 AM - **2 Likes**

Originally posted by Lord Lucan

The Pentax Z-1P? I have just looked at the review here Pentax Z-1p / PZ-1p - Pentax Autofocus Film SLRs - Pentax Camera Reviews and Specifications out of curiosity, and one of its exposure modes is a "Hyper Manual" mode. What is that? It does not have a non-Hyper Manual mode.

The Z-1(P) has both HyperManual (aperture ring set on 'A') and 'normal' Metered Manual (aperture ring not on 'A'). The camera does not have the crippled K mount found on Pentax DSLRs and will open aperture meter with K & M lenses and A (and later) lenses when the aperture ring is off 'A' - without having to use the green button.

It originated the HyperProgram (seamless switching between P, Av & Tv) & HyperManual as we know them today. It also supports using HyperManual as 'one shot' Program mode by pressing the 'IF' button (just like the green button on DSLRs). It also supports combining Exposure Lock with HyperManual to give access to Tv & Av - the IF button selects the program line, once done, hitting Exposure Lock will lock that value - which can then be changed with either dial (changing the other value to compensate).

The camera also supports combining EV compensation with auto-bracketing along the number-line - so instead of shooting -1, +-0, +1 you can shoot +0.5, +1, +1.5 depending on your Exposure Compensation and Auto-bracketing step settings (in this case Exposure comp set to +1.0Ev and auto-bracketing set to +-0.5Ev).

Last edited by johnha; 04-20-2021 at 05:05 AM. Reason: Extra info

Huss · 04-20-2021, 10:26 AM

Originally posted by TwoUptons

Ha. Indeed

Like the old saying, "the glass isn't half-full or half-empty, it is just the wrong size..."

I bought some archival binders years ago (the ones that close up into a box) to store a bunch of slides and negs from a trip.
They worked great for the slides (filed by place, not by roll) but would only fit the 7*5 negative sleeves, not the 7*6 ones.
There was much profanity...

-Eric

The thing that is great about the big box binders I use, is that they are only a little bit bigger than the regular sized ones, but they fit all the different sizes of negative sleeves.
And in the shop they are all together on the same shelf, so there is no much effort to pick them.

As for shooting 24 exp rolls... well I guess that is ok if your roll of film is bookended by Christmases...
I like to shoot, plus it costs the same to develop 36 exp vs 24 exp, so using 24 is much more expensive as same cost to dev for 50% less images.

**jopenmx** · 04-21-2021, 09:42 AM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by johnha

The Z-1(P) has both HyperManual (aperture ring set on 'A') and 'normal' Metered Manual (aperture ring not on 'A'). The camera does not have the crippled K mount found on Pentax DSLRs and will open aperture meter with K & M lenses and A (and later) lenses when the aperture ring is off 'A' - without having to use the green button.

It originated the HyperProgram (seamless switching between P, Av & Tv) & HyperManual as we know them today. It also supports using HyperManual as 'one shot' Program mode by pressing the 'IF' button (just like the green button on DSLRs). It also supports combining Exposure Lock with HyperManual to give access to Tv & Av - the IF button selects the program line, once done, hitting Exposure Lock will lock that value - which can then be changed with either dial (changing the other value to compensate).

The camera also supports combining EV compensation with auto-bracketing along the number-line - so instead of shooting -1, +-0, +1 you can shoot +0.5, +1, +1.5 depending on your Exposure Compensation and Auto-bracketing step settings (in this case Exposure comp set to +1.0Ev and auto-bracketing set to +-0.5Ev).

¡ Wonderful explanation about the multiple features of Z-1p ¡ In fact, I´ve always thought that the roots of the new DSLr of Pentax were in Z-1p. At its time , it really was a strong foundation for the future cameras . And why also my K and M lenses can be used without any restriction .

Wheatfield · 04-21-2021, 01:05 PM

The LX and Nikon F3 were introduced at about the same time. The F3 was the more durable camera, but the LX was the better featured camera. I don't think the LX can be compared to the FE2, as the latter didn't have interchangeable prisms, though it was a sweet camera. The FE2 with a motor drive was my workhorse camera, even though I had an F3hp. I never really got to like the F3's meter readout position. I could never figure out what led them to move it from the bottom of the viewfinder in the F2 to the top of the viewfinder. After a decade or more of using an F2s, I never did manage to adjust to the F3hp viewfinder.

**ChrisPlatt** · 04-21-2021, 02:42 PM

Originally posted by Huss

As for shooting 24 exp rolls... well I guess that is ok if your roll of film is bookended by Christmases...
I like to shoot, plus it costs the same to develop 36 exp vs 24 exp, so using 24 is much more expensive as same cost to dev for 50% less images.

I can finish a 24-exposure roll in a weekend and get it in the soup immediately.
It's more economical to develop two rolls as well, but I prefer the single roll tank.
I don't mind spending a little extra for immediate gratification.

Chris

Huss · 04-21-2021, 03:34 PM

Originally posted by ChrisPlatt

I can finish a 24-exposure roll in a weekend and get it in the soup immediately.
It's more economical to develop two rolls as well, but I prefer the single roll tank.
I don't mind spending a little extra for immediate gratification.

Chris

It takes you that long to finish a roll?
I've already taken 5 or 6 snaps of my cats on the way out of the door.

---------- Post added 04-21-21 at 03:41 PM ----------

Originally posted by Wheatfield

.. The F3 was the more durable camera, but the LX was the better featured camera.... I never really got to like the F3's meter readout position. I could never figure out what led them to move it from the bottom of the viewfinder in the F2 to the top of the viewfinder....

No kidding the F3 is more durable. Just look at all the threads about broken LXs, sticky mirrors etc. The F3's biggest problem is some have leaky LCDs.
Better featured depends on what features you want. I find the F3's 80/20 meter pattern and AE lock much more useful for my needs than anything the LX offers.
For others, that situation may be reversed.

I think Nikon placed the LCD in the vf at the top because that is where the aperture read out was. I do find it more comfortable to have it at the bottom, not sure why that is, but as times progressed most cameras have that info at the bottom.

**ChrisPlatt** · 04-21-2021, 03:46 PM

Originally posted by Huss

It takes you that long to finish a roll?

Shooting more frames doesn't increase my keeper count.

Originally posted by Huss

I've already taken 5 or 6 snaps of my cats on the way out of the door.

I miss my cat. They're such willing subjects.
A great way to waste those last couple of frames to finish the roll...

Chris

Last edited by ChrisPlatt; 04-21-2021 at 03:55 PM.

**gofour3** · 04-21-2021, 04:53 PM

Originally posted by TwoUptons

I bought some archival binders years ago (the ones that close up into a box) to store a bunch of slides and negs from a trip.
They worked great for the slides (filed by place, not by roll) but would only fit the 7*5 negative sleeves, not the 7*6 ones.
There was much profanity...

I use archival storage boxes for my mounted slides, for me mounted slides are way easier to store that negative strips.

Archival Kits| 35MM STORAGE KITS - 1200 | Archival Methods

Phil.

leekil · 04-28-2021, 07:45 AM

Originally posted by TwoUptons

I grew up using a SuperProgram, which does the same thing, so it never bothered me terribly, though it was a bit annoying more than once.

On the Super Program I believe you can set the dial to the 125x setting and the lens on A, and it will expose the frames before 0 accurately.

**TwoUptons** · 04-28-2021, 08:14 AM

Originally posted by leekil

On the Super Program I believe you can set the dial to the 125x setting and the lens on A, and it will expose the frames before 0 accurately.

Wouldn’t that stop the lens down to its smallest aperture? There’s no auto anything at 125x on the Super Program I don’t think...

But with a 50mm lens, that would be f16 and 1/125, which would be about the same as f5.6 on that lens at 1/1000...

But that doesn’t mean 125x won’t work on some other aperture...

I haven’t had that Super Program in a very long time... so I can’t check...

-Eric

johnha · 04-28-2021, 11:45 AM

Originally posted by TwoUptons

Wouldn’t that stop the lens down to its smallest aperture? There’s no auto anything at 125x on the Super Program I don’t think...

From memory, 125x on the Super-A puts it into Tv mode with the shutter speed fixed at 1/125th. I haven't tried doing this before frame 0 though.

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04-20-2021, 02:57 AM - 2 Likes	#46
johnha Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2012 Location: Lancashire, UK Photos: Albums Posts: 1,155	Originally posted by Lord Lucan The Pentax Z-1P? I have just looked at the review here Pentax Z-1p / PZ-1p - Pentax Autofocus Film SLRs - Pentax Camera Reviews and Specifications out of curiosity, and one of its exposure modes is a "Hyper Manual" mode. What is that? It does not have a non-Hyper Manual mode. The Z-1(P) has both HyperManual (aperture ring set on 'A') and 'normal' Metered Manual (aperture ring not on 'A'). The camera does not have the crippled K mount found on Pentax DSLRs and will open aperture meter with K & M lenses and A (and later) lenses when the aperture ring is off 'A' - without having to use the green button. It originated the HyperProgram (seamless switching between P, Av & Tv) & HyperManual as we know them today. It also supports using HyperManual as 'one shot' Program mode by pressing the 'IF' button (just like the green button on DSLRs). It also supports combining Exposure Lock with HyperManual to give access to Tv & Av - the IF button selects the program line, once done, hitting Exposure Lock will lock that value - which can then be changed with either dial (changing the other value to compensate). The camera also supports combining EV compensation with auto-bracketing along the number-line - so instead of shooting -1, +-0, +1 you can shoot +0.5, +1, +1.5 depending on your Exposure Compensation and Auto-bracketing step settings (in this case Exposure comp set to +1.0Ev and auto-bracketing set to +-0.5Ev). Last edited by johnha; 04-20-2021 at 05:05 AM. Reason: Extra info

04-20-2021, 10:26 AM	#47
Huss Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2020 Posts: 629	Originally posted by TwoUptons Ha. Indeed Like the old saying, "the glass isn't half-full or half-empty, it is just the wrong size..." I bought some archival binders years ago (the ones that close up into a box) to store a bunch of slides and negs from a trip. They worked great for the slides (filed by place, not by roll) but would only fit the 75 negative sleeves, not the 76 ones. There was much profanity... -Eric The thing that is great about the big box binders I use, is that they are only a little bit bigger than the regular sized ones, but they fit all the different sizes of negative sleeves. And in the shop they are all together on the same shelf, so there is no much effort to pick them. As for shooting 24 exp rolls... well I guess that is ok if your roll of film is bookended by Christmases... I like to shoot, plus it costs the same to develop 36 exp vs 24 exp, so using 24 is much more expensive as same cost to dev for 50% less images.

04-21-2021, 09:42 AM - 1 Like	#48
jopenmx Site Supporter Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: vigo Photos: Gallery Posts: 137	Originally posted by johnha The Z-1(P) has both HyperManual (aperture ring set on 'A') and 'normal' Metered Manual (aperture ring not on 'A'). The camera does not have the crippled K mount found on Pentax DSLRs and will open aperture meter with K & M lenses and A (and later) lenses when the aperture ring is off 'A' - without having to use the green button. It originated the HyperProgram (seamless switching between P, Av & Tv) & HyperManual as we know them today. It also supports using HyperManual as 'one shot' Program mode by pressing the 'IF' button (just like the green button on DSLRs). It also supports combining Exposure Lock with HyperManual to give access to Tv & Av - the IF button selects the program line, once done, hitting Exposure Lock will lock that value - which can then be changed with either dial (changing the other value to compensate). The camera also supports combining EV compensation with auto-bracketing along the number-line - so instead of shooting -1, +-0, +1 you can shoot +0.5, +1, +1.5 depending on your Exposure Compensation and Auto-bracketing step settings (in this case Exposure comp set to +1.0Ev and auto-bracketing set to +-0.5Ev). ¡ Wonderful explanation about the multiple features of Z-1p ¡ In fact, I´ve always thought that the roots of the new DSLr of Pentax were in Z-1p. At its time , it really was a strong foundation for the future cameras . And why also my K and M lenses can be used without any restriction .

04-21-2021, 01:05 PM	#49
Wheatfield Moderator Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: The wheatfields of Canada Posts: 15,981	The LX and Nikon F3 were introduced at about the same time. The F3 was the more durable camera, but the LX was the better featured camera. I don't think the LX can be compared to the FE2, as the latter didn't have interchangeable prisms, though it was a sweet camera. The FE2 with a motor drive was my workhorse camera, even though I had an F3hp. I never really got to like the F3's meter readout position. I could never figure out what led them to move it from the bottom of the viewfinder in the F2 to the top of the viewfinder. After a decade or more of using an F2s, I never did manage to adjust to the F3hp viewfinder.

04-21-2021, 02:42 PM	#50
ChrisPlatt Site Supporter Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Rockaway Beach NYC Posts: 7,694	Originally posted by Huss As for shooting 24 exp rolls... well I guess that is ok if your roll of film is bookended by Christmases... I like to shoot, plus it costs the same to develop 36 exp vs 24 exp, so using 24 is much more expensive as same cost to dev for 50% less images. I can finish a 24-exposure roll in a weekend and get it in the soup immediately. It's more economical to develop two rolls as well, but I prefer the single roll tank. I don't mind spending a little extra for immediate gratification. Chris

04-21-2021, 03:34 PM	#51
Huss Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2020 Posts: 629	Originally posted by ChrisPlatt I can finish a 24-exposure roll in a weekend and get it in the soup immediately. It's more economical to develop two rolls as well, but I prefer the single roll tank. I don't mind spending a little extra for immediate gratification. Chris It takes you that long to finish a roll? I've already taken 5 or 6 snaps of my cats on the way out of the door. ---------- Post added 04-21-21 at 03:41 PM ---------- Originally posted by Wheatfield .. The F3 was the more durable camera, but the LX was the better featured camera.... I never really got to like the F3's meter readout position. I could never figure out what led them to move it from the bottom of the viewfinder in the F2 to the top of the viewfinder.... No kidding the F3 is more durable. Just look at all the threads about broken LXs, sticky mirrors etc. The F3's biggest problem is some have leaky LCDs. Better featured depends on what features you want. I find the F3's 80/20 meter pattern and AE lock much more useful for my needs than anything the LX offers. For others, that situation may be reversed. I think Nikon placed the LCD in the vf at the top because that is where the aperture read out was. I do find it more comfortable to have it at the bottom, not sure why that is, but as times progressed most cameras have that info at the bottom.

04-21-2021, 03:46 PM	#52
ChrisPlatt Site Supporter Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Rockaway Beach NYC Posts: 7,694	Originally posted by Huss It takes you that long to finish a roll? Shooting more frames doesn't increase my keeper count. Originally posted by Huss I've already taken 5 or 6 snaps of my cats on the way out of the door. I miss my cat. They're such willing subjects. A great way to waste those last couple of frames to finish the roll... Chris Last edited by ChrisPlatt; 04-21-2021 at 03:55 PM.

04-21-2021, 04:53 PM	#53
gofour3 Site Supporter Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Vancouver, Canada Posts: 8,091	Originally posted by TwoUptons I bought some archival binders years ago (the ones that close up into a box) to store a bunch of slides and negs from a trip. They worked great for the slides (filed by place, not by roll) but would only fit the 75 negative sleeves, not the 76 ones. There was much profanity... I use archival storage boxes for my mounted slides, for me mounted slides are way easier to store that negative strips. Archival Kits\| 35MM STORAGE KITS - 1200 \| Archival Methods Phil.

04-28-2021, 07:45 AM	#54
leekil Pentaxian Join Date: May 2016 Photos: Albums Posts: 2,003	Originally posted by TwoUptons I grew up using a SuperProgram, which does the same thing, so it never bothered me terribly, though it was a bit annoying more than once. On the Super Program I believe you can set the dial to the 125x setting and the lens on A, and it will expose the frames before 0 accurately.

04-28-2021, 08:14 AM	#55
TwoUptons Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Nov 2015 Photos: Albums Posts: 4,214	Originally posted by leekil On the Super Program I believe you can set the dial to the 125x setting and the lens on A, and it will expose the frames before 0 accurately. Wouldn’t that stop the lens down to its smallest aperture? There’s no auto anything at 125x on the Super Program I don’t think... But with a 50mm lens, that would be f16 and 1/125, which would be about the same as f5.6 on that lens at 1/1000... But that doesn’t mean 125x won’t work on some other aperture... I haven’t had that Super Program in a very long time... so I can’t check... -Eric

04-28-2021, 11:45 AM	#56
johnha Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2012 Location: Lancashire, UK Photos: Albums Posts: 1,155	Originally posted by TwoUptons Wouldn’t that stop the lens down to its smallest aperture? There’s no auto anything at 125x on the Super Program I don’t think... From memory, 125x on the Super-A puts it into Tv mode with the shutter speed fixed at 1/125th. I haven't tried doing this before frame 0 though.